CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #5

[dotr]

I have too many theories in the AG case one of them involves two women gay lovers though both married with children motive money and hate one living in Ancaster one grew up there they have a history in fraud of the elderly and probably homicide of the elderly masked as natural deaths. I am not dreaming this up but have to leave it at that in terms of specifics for now.

I have a question: assuming that the conjecture that an intimate body portion of the victim was taken by the killer, just assuming from the cryptic remarks of LE and media then...

Is there a precedent for WOMEN rather than men who are conflicted about their sexual orientation to feel rage for another woman anatomically etc.? Or is this unlikely?

Thinking of the "sexual component" of Audrey's murder and in particular the taking of a "trophy.."
This could be considered by some as a brutal sex crime committed by females against females and sanctioned by men.....
Female genital mutilation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Back to the crime scene:

- we don't know where the blood pooling/spatter was (PK thought AG 'slipped on ice')

- we really don't know where the killing took place......bedroom, kitchen, anywhere inside the house

- the killing could NOT have taken place in the garage near/beside a WHITE car

- IF the killing did take place inside the garage, the killer must have thoroughly cleaned the white car + tires + under the car

- where did the sexual component take place - after a sexual encounter, after a sexual put-down, during a sexual encounter

- did the killing take place elsewhere and then the body was placed inside the garage

- what was the weapon which was used in the sexual component

- did Audrey have Xmas decorations up hence a religious freak was involved

- was there blood on the soles of Audrey's shoes

?????????????????????????

:dunno:

 

[dotr]

Good point about blood on the soles of Audrey's shoes, I don't seem to recall offhand any discussion here about that.
Did A keep her shoes and coat in the garage and if so,was she re-dressed in her old footwear and coat (as previously speculated) perhaps to disguise her whereabouts?

 

[Sillybilly]

Random thoughts that make me go hmmm ...

In the "come hell or high water" email to PK, AG indicated she would be at her coffee klatch in 2 days time, and commented on cabin fever (although she had been to LV's the day prior with her weakness that was "disappearing but still there" ... sounds a bit contradictory and smacks as if speaking about someone else???). Just curious why she wouldn't have mentioned that she was busting out that very afternoon with the dogs for a drive to the vets. Seems an unusual omission, given that it would fit so neatly into her expressed thoughts about getting out of the house.

No biggy, but also in that email, there is some wording that just doesn't seem to me to be how AG would speak, given she was a teacher for most of her life, and she sounded like a stickler for detail (i.e. "so don't think I've a fever" ... Wed. instead of Weds)

For someone who had been under the weather, still hadn't recovered, and was experiencing some new symptoms (termed by her to be "infection") ... she had been at Lynne's on Sunday, was reputed to be a nighthawk but seemed to have sent PK an early morning email, then a 10:26 am email, then LV dropped in for soup, then AG set off to the vets with the dogs (hugging Dr. Collins, thus possibly exposing the somewhat elderly vet to her undiagnosed infection both through her visit and the physical contact), returned home, and sent another email to LF sometime between the vet and Monday evening. Hell, for a gal who was up in age, i'd say AG was doing more with her day than I do most days

 

[Sillybilly]

Okay ... so maybe i'm the illiterate one here. Turns out "Wed." or Weds are both correct and/or common usage.

Oddly enough, when I moved to the west coast, i found that some usage was different (informality through less punctuation being one of them), so I don't recall if Weds is something i picked up out here. Lordy, I can't say "i'm wrong" ... there just has to be an explanation lease:

jk

 

[Chorley8]

Random thoughts that make me go hmmm ...

In the "come hell or high water" email to PK, AG indicated she would be at her coffee klatch in 2 days time, and commented on cabin fever (although she had been to LV's the day prior with her weakness that was "disappearing but still there" ... sounds a bit contradictory and smacks as if speaking about someone else???). Just curious why she wouldn't have mentioned that she was busting out that very afternoon with the dogs for a drive to the vets. Seems an unusual omission, given that it would fit so neatly into her expressed thoughts about getting out of the house.

No biggy, but also in that email, there is some wording that just doesn't seem to me to be how AG would speak, given she was a teacher for most of her life, and she sounded like a stickler for detail (i.e. "so don't think I've a fever" ... Wed. instead of Weds)

For someone who had been under the weather, still hadn't recovered, and was experiencing some new symptoms (termed by her to be "infection") ... she had been at Lynne's on Sunday, was reputed to be a nighthawk but seemed to have sent PK an early morning email, then a 10:26 am email, then LV dropped in for soup, then AG set off to the vets with the dogs (hugging Dr. Collins, thus possibly exposing the somewhat elderly vet to her undiagnosed infection both through her visit and the physical contact), returned home, and sent another email to LF sometime between the vet and Monday evening. Hell, for a gal who was up in age, i'd say AG was doing more with her day than I do most days

So according to this timeline the email to PK had probably to be written by AG since she is seen later than that by Vet.

This vet visit becomes key since again there is no need to lie about the soup since she is seen later.


(Was the young friend himself friends with the kids of the bringer of soup I am assuming they are the same age group?) Was the young friend himself friends with the offspring of the animal cemetery owner?

Is the last person to see Audrey alive other (obviously than whoever killed her) the vet SB I mean as far as we know?

If AG's real will real intentions was to give money for SPCA or other animal rights group vet might know of this. We might expect some bequest to the animal cemetery even a small one.

Is a plot young friend/bringer of soup/pet cemetery owner possible? How about if we include offspring? Motive money OR a combination of obstructing some research of AG's into subject unknown mixed with the financial factor? Could the research be into the fraud/homicide of the elderly I broached before?

If you want someone dead it is always nice if they can leave you a bequest as well.

Did AG's husband exaggerate his distance from AG that he hadn't seen her since Mr. Doveiko's/Doveika's funeral? Husband's brother in law is author of the story that Audrey feared being raped and killed. Why was be in touch with Audrey and not the husband or is he the conduit through to husband? As has been suggested here way back was the crime made to fit the prophecy? Did the perp have actually no desire to rape Audrey hence the 'perverted' gesture of assault on her anatomy?

We still can't rule out the possibility someone else authored the email about coffee klatch because just personally I don't trust the cemetery owner and I mean that in more than one sense.

"Disappearing but still there". About to be murdered hasn't been murdered yet. Hell/High Water= death. Repetition of fever and cabin fever as you suggest SB if written by someone else fever suggested the phrase cabin fever.

Sounds to me like written by a woman don't know why. I don't see it as authored by PK.

 

[Chorley8]

Can anyone remember how long it was (according to him) before Audrey's third husband AG heard of her murder? It seems to me it was quite some time which I should confirm before I say the following but to save all of our time:

Wouldn't you find out almost instantly that your former wife had been murdered? And he had an uncle with Hamilton police there is no way they would forget that in Hamilton someone wouldn't.

Of course even if this suggestion of mine is right he could just be trying to steer clear of media he has no obligation to them.

Overall I get the feeling we are circling tighter and tighter around the truth - but I am not sure what we need to live in and what to leave out - still puzzling.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I think it was many, many years that Allan Gleave had been in contact with Audrey. Something like 20+ years, perhaps more.

I highly doubt that the former husband is the perp.

Why did it take LE so long to inform the former husband of Audrey's murder? Probably because they had been estranged for so many years. He really wasn't in the picture at the time of her killing.

I think LE is looking at people who were close to Audrey when the murder took place. The people who actually were in contact with AG during the final year of her life.........coffee people, LV, PK, neighbour who received the song via e-mail............

:twocents:

 

[Sillybilly]

Can anyone remember how long it was (according to him) before Audrey's third husband AG heard of her murder? It seems to me it was quite some time ...

from:
http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/595858--who-is-audrey-gleave

Soon after the news broke, the phone rang at the home of David Gleave in British Columbia. It was his brother, Allan, on the line.

Allan Gleave was Audrey’s ex-husband. To David, Allan did not sound upset, the voice was matter-of-fact. But then, Allan had not been in touch with her for many years.

“Did you hear the news about Audrey?” Allan asked.

Allan had not been contacted by Hamilton detectives about the murder. Police would not call Audrey’s ex-husband for five months. Instead he had heard the news when Hamilton Spectator reporter Danielle Wong called him.

Unlike his brother, David had been in touch with Audrey in recent years. He remembered something she once told him.

Audrey had said she feared she would one day be raped and murdered in her home.

HTH

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Just My Opinions:

In my thoughts, I am ruling out these people as the perp:

- Allan Gleave
- David Gleave
- the lady across the street who received the song via e-mail
- former students
- all neighbours (adults) who knew Audrey and spoke with her from time to time
- all three former husbands
- the vet
- people/kids who fooled around in the adjacent cemetery

My reason is that these people weren't close enough to have a grudge against Audrey. They were either in the past OR mere acquaintances. Not close enough for a brutal murder......where would the motive be?

Now, I could be completely off base here. But these are my thoughts on the matter.

How About:

- a random serial killer.......possible
- [modsnip]
- golfing buddies......possible but hightly unlikely
- Bridge people........for what reason
- a young person/neighbour coming home for Xmas........possible, but why
- someone from Audrey's past about whom we know nothing......possible
- a chat room person on the internet.......how would they find her location
- a secret lover.......possible

:twocents:

 

[Sillybilly]

Anyone have a clue as to WHERE AG's LWT was actually located? IOW, did LV already have a copy, or was it simply found in the house?

I am curious about AG having recently taken up the hobby of handwriting analysis. Did she have a specific project in mind? Did someone try a swap of the Will, hoping AG wouldn't notice, but the whole plan went south when AG discovered something awry?

 

[Chorley8]

Great question. And did a lawyer have a copy say in the safe in their office. That makes fraud much more difficult not impossible especially in dear old Hamilton.

And brilliant point you and another poster at some point querying whether the interest in handwriting analysis was linked to the will.

 

[dotr]

http://brainwriting.com/Common_Questions.html

"
The use of handwriting analysis has grown since 1988, when the lie detector test (polygraph machine) was made illegal to pre-screen potential employees in the United States.

Companies are now starting to realize that the studies done over the past 10 years are true. These studies have shown that 80% of the people who are hired for their jobs are not right for their jobs and will often be replaced within 3-12 months.

This is a staggering statistic that most companies want to avoid. Many companies now search for various means to lower their turnover rate, and increasingly, they are turning to handwriting analysis to help aid in their hiring decisions.


What companies have used handwriting analysis as a part of their pre-screening process?


You might be surprised to learn that companies such as General Electric, Firestone, Royal Typewriter, United States Steel, IBM, Prudential Life Insurance, and Boise Cascade have all used this tool to aid them in their hiring practices."

 

[dotr]

http://www.documentexaminer.info/?gclid=COCO1--_h7QCFSOnPAodkGkA4w

"Forensic Document Examiner - James A. Green
The laboratory of Mr. Green offers a variety of forensic document examinations. A professional laboratory analysis by a court qualified and certified examiner may resolve questions regarding: The authenticity of signatures or handwriting
The identification of altered or fraudulent documents
Obliterated or indented writing
Questioned typewritten documents
Forgery detection such as “cut and paste” signatures or text
Ink identification and dating"

 

[dotr]

Hmmm, warning for students about fake fb at M University..
http://www.macinsiders.com/showthread.php/mcmaster-2013-facebook-group-scam-must-read-any-22151.html

 

[dotr]

So sorry for yet another post, but this link from Dec. 2009, seriously rang some bells !!...............
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/cri...r-at-perth-avenue-amid-death-and-bomb-threats

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

So sorry for yet another post, but this link from Dec. 2009, seriously rang some bells !!...............
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/cri...r-at-perth-avenue-amid-death-and-bomb-threats

WOW!!!!!! Bells ringing loudly!!

 

[Hazel]

Relationship between the women quite possible. Not sure anyone understood me before will repeat but it might be relevant that the witnesses to the W. were a gay female couple.

RSBUBM

:what:
"were"? are they both dead?

 

[Chorley8]

"Were" = at that time which is what is relevant.

Wit. to will + address + neighbour = coincidence or mystery.

(Brought to my attention didn't spot this).

By the way handwriting: was Audrey getting strange letters, handwritten, poison pen letters, threatening letters?

Did she discuss this with anyone and maybe say where she was keeping them.

 

[Sillybilly]

"Were" = at that time which is what is relevant.

Wit. to will + address + neighbour = coincidence or mystery.

(Brought to my attention didn't spot this).

By the way handwriting: was Audrey getting strange letters, handwritten, poison pen letters, threatening letters?

Did she discuss this with anyone and maybe say where she was keeping them.

<bbm>

Possibly her expressed fear of being "raped and murdered in her own home" was due to threats contained in letters that she was analyzing? Assuming her former BIL is telling the truth, that fear HAD TO HAVE BEEN ROOTED IN SOMETHING. I think the average person would go to LE, but AG might have been the type to try to figure it all out on her own ... and maybe she did.

Was someone trying to upset AG by vandalizing her mailbox and making outright threats or veiled intimidation / insinuations .. perhaps hoping she would die of a heart attack?