CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #5

[Sillybilly]

Speaking of AG's bank statements being missing, DLS was arrested at a laundromat after having been seen in the washroom of his bank with a knife in his waistband. (To confuse the issue, some reports say he was arrested Thursday afternoon which would have been December 30th after AG's body was found; other reports say he was just let out of jail on Wednesday which would have been December 29.) IIRC, he was in fact arrested PRIOR to Audrey being found, so that would be Wednesday, December 29 that he was arrested). Anyway, just wondering if they used the same bank.

It is unusual for someone to have all their important papers in their purse at any given time, let alone to coincide with their horrific murder ... so possibly AG was making some major financial decisions/changes that required she have all her important papers on her person.

ETA: Why, why, why were the bank statements not there when all her "important" papers were? I find this most unusual and something that smacks of a financial motive. However, with AG being such a computer whiz, maybe she was signed up for electronic statements.

 

[Woodland]

The 'evidence' would have been the feces. How long or short was the period PK spoke of - some 'evidence' or none?

Will look up the article on items found on the grounds shortly - it was not the saw viewed on the video being put into a big. There was no video or list of these items, unless LE meant it was the saw. Never specific.

I find it most interesting all of AG's important papers were found in one place (apparently the purse she was known to always carry them in? How many people said she was known to always carry her important papers around?) except for her bank statements - if AG was signed up for electronic statements - they weren't missing and obtainable with the person holding a death certificate. To me this goes with the slim numbers given by LV to the courts on AG's net worth. Just sayin'.

 

[Valleyboy]

I am not a computer whiz but I do get all my bank statements on line.

Haven't received a statement or been inside a bank in years.

PS::: I am around the same age as AG was.

 

[Sillybilly]

1. I don't think AG was 'very ill' as she said. Rather, I think she was with the killer and she had to make excuses to not see people.

<rsbm>

But she was alive when she told people she was ill, and that was before Christmas when she told PK, and again on Christmas Day when he spoke with her. After that she was out to LV's on Boxing Day, she was at the vets, and was seem alive on the Monday and when LV brought her the soup. After that, there was no communication where she was saying she was ill.

 

[Sillybilly]

The 'evidence' would have been the feces. How long or short was the period PK spoke of - some 'evidence' or none?

Will look up the article on items found on the grounds shortly - it was not the saw viewed on the video being put into a big. There was no video or list of these items, unless LE meant it was the saw. Never specific.

I find it most interesting all of AG's important papers were found in one place (apparently the purse she was known to always carry them in? How many people said she was known to always carry her important papers around?) except for her bank statements - if AG was signed up for electronic statements - they weren't missing and obtainable with the person holding a death certificate. To me this goes with the slim numbers given by LV to the courts on AG's net worth. Just sayin'.

LOL, i knew what the evidence consisted of, just wondered why you based your opinion on whether it existed or not. Okay, PK didn't specify that there was "none", just that it didn't appear they had been unattended for any period of time. So, to PK as a non dog-owner, however much existed or didn't exist, this is subjective. I have 2 shepherds and each one goes twice a day on a normal day. The older gal now lets it rip under any circumstances if she is not let out (this mortifies the younger male who gets embarassed on her behalf and runs and faces the wall until it gets cleaned up .. he would maybe hold it 10 hours or so, but i don't test it out).

Re the LWT ... we've discussed that maybe someone was unhappy they were not IN the Will, but it could also be that someone who was in it was told by AG that she was going to change it.

Still grasping at straws here

 

[Hazel]

Hi everone!
I have a couple of questions regarding Audrey's computers.

1) Were all her four computers found in her house?

2) Has her 'main' computer been forensically analysed?

This will tell LE if there was activity on her computer Tuesday, Wednesday, maybe even early morning of Thursday.

I too cannot understand why LE doesn't give a better timeline of when it is believed Audrey was last alive.

 

[Sillybilly]

I am not a computer whiz but I do get all my bank statements on line.

Haven't received a statement or been inside a bank in years.

PS::: I am around the same age as AG was.

Same here Valleyboy, but it's still a bit odd that there wouldn't be some indication of which financial institution she dealt with. Although I do online banking and receive emails when bank statements are available, I still receive snail mail from the bank about promotions, etc that don't relate specifically to my bank statements. Some of those things would normally be found around the house or in a file cabinet. You'd think between PK and LV, one of them would have had an inkling about which bank she dealt with.

JMO

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I am not a computer whiz but I do get all my bank statements on line.

Haven't received a statement or been inside a bank in years.

PS::: I am around the same age as AG was.

I'm no computer whiz either, but ever since the last postal strike I, too, do all of my banking online.

The only snail mail my husband and I receive is the 'big stuff' at tax time (investments, etc.).

I'm confused about the following:

1. What kinds of 'personal papers' did Audrey keep in her purse?

2. And what did LE find outside of her house?

3. If there were financial statements scattered about AG's property, wouldn't PK have seen that before entering the garage?

4. When PK took Audrey shopping, did she carry this purse which contained all of the personal papers? Or, did she just take a small wallet with her?

 

[Hazel]

3. If there were financial statements scattered about AG's property wouldn't PK have seen that before entering the garage?,

respectfully snipped by me.

Now I'm the one confused, lol. Must have missed something because this is the first time I heard of this.

 

[Hazel]

These are just my thoughts regarding the 'important documents' inside Audrey's purse.

Have mentioned this a long time ago, but there are so many posts and threads now. By the way, Thread #4 was pulled out for review by one of the Mods, and I believe that thread is still not available.

Would it be possible that Audrey kept her important documents inside a purse, and not the one she used to go out (besides, we women have more than just one purse) ... I know my mother does keep 'important' things hidden in very strange places, lol.

What I mean is, perhaps Audrey used an old purse to store these documents, in the event a burglar came in and looked in the most obvious places....so perhaps LV found the documents after checking all her belongings. I just cannot imagine Audrey carrying important documents with her all around town, JMO.

 

[roseofsharon]

LOL, i knew what the evidence consisted of, just wondered why you based your opinion on whether it existed or not. Okay, PK didn't specify that there was "none", just that it didn't appear they had been unattended for any period of time. So, to PK as a non dog-owner, however much existed or didn't exist, this is subjective. I have 2 shepherds and each one goes twice a day on a normal day. The older gal now lets it rip under any circumstances if she is not let out (this mortifies the younger male who gets embarassed on her behalf and runs and faces the wall until it gets cleaned up .. he would maybe hold it 10 hours or so, but i don't test it out).

Re the LWT ... we've discussed that maybe someone was unhappy they were not IN the Will, but it could also be that someone who was in it was told by AG that she was going to change it.

Still grasping at straws here

Where were the dog crates in proximity to the garage? Could the killer, a known person to AG and the dogs, have let the dogs out of the house in a friendly manner, with AG's consent, to do their business (as I remember reading AG had electric fence around her property), murdered AG and then brought the dogs back into the house and into their crates via the front door and not through the garage. Did LE check the property for feces and would it be known the approx. time of any defecation.

Still thinking about motive, but feel it was financial also.

moo

 

[roseofsharon]

Same here Valleyboy, but it's still a bit odd that there wouldn't be some indication of which financial institution she dealt with. Although I do online banking and receive emails when bank statements are available, I still receive snail mail from the bank about promotions, etc that don't relate specifically to my bank statements. Some of those things would normally be found around the house or in a file cabinet. You'd think between PK and LV, one of them would have had an inkling about which bank she dealt with.

JMO

It has been a long time, but IIRC, AG didn't have any investments and did all her banking with the Teacher's Credit Union in Hamilton. I'm just pulling from my memory and may have this all wrong and that she also made withdrawals on a regular basis. moo

Footnote: If this is fact, I think AG may have kept large sums of money hidden in her home and she may have told someone that she confided in regarding this fact. Just moo

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

respectfully snipped by me.

Now I'm the one confused, lol. Must have missed something because this is the first time I heard of this.

I'm confused as well. From sillybilly's post I thought I understood that:

1. Audrey kept many personal papers in her purse.

2. And, *some* personal, financial papers were missing from her house after the murder.

Perhaps I got that wrong.....if so, many apologies for upsetting the applecart.:bang:

 

[Hazel]

No worries NSU, lol, you didn't upset the applecart :wagon:

I was just asking re your mentioning "financial documents scattered about Audrey's property", that PK would have "seen before entering the garage" - that's all

 

[2soccermom]

Re: some of the ideas in recent posts:
The dogs were, by many reports, very protective of Audrey; for my part, I'm not sure that the perp(s) could manage those dogs back into the house after her murder. About the questions re: Audrey's habit of keeping important papers in her purse: this might be the legacy of being the daughter of "old world" immigrants; although Audrey was born in Hamilton, her parents were from Latvia/Lithouania. Coming from that era and geography, it is likely that they raised their daughter to keep identity and other documents on her person. I know Audrey was estranged from her mother (I'm sure I read that in several reports?) but all those years of socialization would be hard to shake, I'm sure. That's my speculation, anyway. What we know of Audrey as an adult is that she was a very private, very independent (wherever possible) individual; it would make sense to me that she would carry those docs in her own protection. MOO.
I don't remember reading anywhere that documents were scattered or even that these were missing. Only that some items were missing from the home; I don't ever remember these being identified. Does someone have a link for that??

 

[Sillybilly]

It has been a long time, but IIRC, AG didn't have any investments and did all her banking with the Teacher's Credit Union in Hamilton. I'm just pulling from my memory and may have this all wrong and that she also made withdrawals on a regular basis. moo

Footnote: If this is fact, I think AG may have kept large sums of money hidden in her home and she may have told someone that she confided in regarding this fact. Just moo

When discussing the guy who installed the oven, PK said:

I'm not 100% sure how she paid but if I know Audrey it was with cash

To have regular cash on hand, she would have to go to an ATM, a bank, or get cash back while grocery shopping etc. If she truly dealt mostly in cash, then both ATM and cash back aren't as likely, as those transactions would require a bank debit card.

Most pension cheques are issued toward the end of the month. December 2010, government cheques were issued early (iirc, Dec 22). This would probably apply to her teacher's pension as well.

If AG paid for most things by cash, it's possible that she "paid herself first" when she received her fixed monthly income. She may also have attended to her fixed monthly expenses (hydro, telephone, etc.). As she was ill around the time pension cheques were out that month, I'm wondering if she may have visited the bank or other businesses the same afternoon that she went to the vets.

Just throwing out some possibilities. I'm sure LE would have checked into all her finances. If they did, they sure aren't talking.

JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

Just for reference, apparently the crime scene was released the Tuesday (Jan 4/11):

from:
http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/309093--friends-remember-audrey-gleave

That ended when police released the scene Tuesday. Friends and a cleanup crew spent the day cleaning out her home.

 

[Sillybilly]

I don't remember reading anywhere that documents were scattered or even that these were missing. Only that some items were missing from the home; I don't ever remember these being identified. Does someone have a link for that??

<rsbm>

I don't recall that documents were scattered either, just that she was a hoarder of sorts and that, at some point in time, PK helped her in sorting things.

I can't find it right now, but have a specific recollection of LV saying that she had to go to numerous banks to find out where AG did her banking, so it would seem the bank statements were not in the home, and not with the important papers in her purse.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Teacher's pensions are issued on the final banking day of each month.

 

[Hazel]

<rsbm>

I don't recall that documents were scattered either, just that she was a hoarder of sorts and that, at some point in time, PK helped her in sorting things.

I can't find it right now, but have a specific recollection of LV saying that she had to go to numerous banks to find out where AG did her banking, so it would seem the bank statements were not in the home, and not with the important papers in her purse.

I do remember exactly the same as you Sillybilly and I also remember we learned about that through "Susie" ..... will go back some threads and see if I can find the post.