Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #2

[andreww]

Or they don't want to be accused later of tunnel vision, incompetence, or missing something by the "Seconday Investigation" team.

My thoughts exactly. The family already has a good idea what the police investigation is going to show, and they have already hired one of the best lawyers in the province and a private investigator. Seem to me this may be a similar strategy to that of John Ramsey. The problem here is that if LE deems this a murder/suicide, there is no trial, no day in court. Barry Sherman will simply be deemed a murderer and that will be his legacy. The Ramsey's were very good at creating doubt, publicly releasing (mis)information to the public that pointed towards an intruder. I believe the Sherman family may do the same thing here, but time will tell.

 

[andreww]

I would bet an insurance company would have lots of fine print in there.

Its not just insurance. If this is deemed murder/suicide, one can assume that would leave the door open for a wrongful death suit from members of Honey's family. I'm sure that there is a lot riding on what the outcome of LE's investigation shows.

 

[Jennifer17]

Its not just insurance. If this is deemed murder/suicide, one can assume that would leave the door open for a wrongful death suitd from members of Honey's family. I'm sure that there is a lot riding on what the outcome of LE's investigation shows.

Who would they sue in a wrongful death suit?

 

[Sherlockhemlock]

If they had life insurance, I doubt if it was purchased iwhen they were in their 60’s. If they purchased it, it would have been years ago. Why exactly would they need life insurance?

It’s not uncommon to have life insurance as cash flow while an estate goes through probate. Unless specifically assigned as POD, even bank accounts can be frozen through probate. Insurance pays quickly (under normal circumstances) that it’s a great way to make sure bills are paid in case of issues with probate. In my family everyone has a term life insurance for just this reason as a backup.

 

[tarabull]

Toronto Mayor John Tory relayed Sherman family concerns to police
Updated 11 hours ago

Snipped...

...In the hours after news had emerged of the grisly discovery in the Sherman house, but long before the police confirmed the names of the victims, Ontario Health Minister Eric Hoskins tweeted condolences that identified the couple. Several media outlets used his tweet as official confirmation of the couple's death.

On Wednesday, a spokeswoman for the minister would not explain how he got that information, saying that Mr. Hoskins could not comment because of the ongoing investigation. She pointed to a subsequent statement from the minister that praised the couple but offered no explanation for Mr. Hoskins's tweet.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...out-handling-of-sherman-case/article37439873/

 

[victax888]

Can't imagine a carjacking really. Barry and Honey had gone to meet the builder of the new house at the empty lot in Forest Hill..they drove separate vehicles back to their residence. Ostensibly one would have followed the other. They were found with their winter boots and coats on inside the pool area which is accessible through the underground garage. Their coats were pulled back over their arms with leather belts around their necks affixed to the pool railing. For a 75 year old man with a bad back to have hoisted an 180 lb. woman would have been difficult at best. Given his experience in the pharmaceutical field a simple pill would have sufficed. The staging of the bodies would have taken place on the Thursday early evening and allowed the 2 killers to be able to leave the country.

 

[Jennifer17]

Can't imagine a carjacking really. Barry and Honey had gone to meet the builder of the new house at the empty lot in Forest Hill..they drove separate vehicles back to their residence. Ostensibly one would have followed the other. They were found with their winter boots and coats on inside the pool area which is accessible through the underground garage. Their coats were pulled back over their arms with leather belts around their necks affixed to the pool railing. For a 75 year old man with a bad back to have hoisted an 180 lb. woman would have been difficult at best. Given his experience in the pharmaceutical field a simple pill would have sufficed. The staging of the bodies would have taken place on the Thursday early evening and allowed the 2 killers to be able to leave the country.

None of that information has been confirmed by LE. In fact, some of that info has come from a satirical site.

 

[tarabull]

Inside look into Health Canada battle with Apotex
June 1, 2015

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada...ok-into-health-canada-battle-with-apotex.html

 

[Inthedetails]

After the initial LE reaction about murder-suicide, they sure have clammed up.

jmo

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

If they had life insurance, I doubt if it was purchased iwhen they were in their 60’s. If they purchased it, it would have been years ago. Why exactly would they need life insurance?

Life insurance is often used in estate planning to provide liquid assets, so heirs won't have to, for example, sell the family business to pay estate taxes. That said, I think they were well beyond having to worry about liquidity.

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[Snoopster]

Can't imagine a carjacking really. Barry and Honey had gone to meet the builder of the new house at the empty lot in Forest Hill..they drove separate vehicles back to their residence. Ostensibly one would have followed the other. They were found with their winter boots and coats on inside the pool area which is accessible through the underground garage. Their coats were pulled back over their arms with leather belts around their necks affixed to the pool railing. For a 75 year old man with a bad back to have hoisted an 180 lb. woman would have been difficult at best. Given his experience in the pharmaceutical field a simple pill would have sufficed. The staging of the bodies would have taken place on the Thursday early evening and allowed the 2 killers to be able to leave the country.

I feel uncomfortable with everyone saying it is a fact that they had their "winter coats and boots" on. The only place that has been mentioned, is in the Frank article (and I'm not sure they can be considered MSM. They also don't say where they heard that from...nothing about hearing it from sources. Other places mention jackets, but has any other online source mentioned boots?

 

[Snoopster]

If they had life insurance, I doubt if it was purchased iwhen they were in their 60’s. If they purchased it, it would have been years ago. Why exactly would they need life insurance?

Life insurance is often used for estate planning purposes by the rich in Canada. It allows tax-free transferring of some wealth. (although that "loop-hole" is gradually being closed off)

 

[Inthedetails]

Life insurance is often used in estate planning to provide liquid assets, so heirs won't have to, for example, sell the family business to pay estate taxes. That said, I think they were well beyond having to worry about liquidity.

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I agree. And if this is a murder-suicide, I don't think BS's thoughts were on an insurance policy.

If this is murder-suicide, I think he killed himself either because:
* He accidently killed Honey, knew he would be found guilty, and decided to end it then and there out of practicality. His life was essentially over and he ended it on his terms.
* He purposely killed Honey and himself because of impending financial ruin or disgrace.

These are my two working theories on murder-suicide.

I am on the fence and do think double-murder is a possibility, but beyond that broad generalization, I don't have a specific hunch about it, except I think it would be personal, not global, in motivation.

jmo from the fence :fence:

 

[Wondergirl]

Have their cell phones been discussed?

What is known with respect to them?

 

[victax888]

If you mean that the satirical site is the Frank magazine....yes...some of their contents have often been presented as satirical to avoid lawsuits... however not at all in this case...Ive followed Frank for the last 20 years and found that much of their reporting is based upon fact.

 

[victax888]

I have followed Frank magazine for 20 years and although they have often relied on satire to avoid lawsuits...in this particular case there is no element of satire.

 

[victax888]

The pool area is accessed also through the underground garage.

 

[Jasper52]

Have their cell phones been discussed?

What is known with respect to them?

AFAIK, nothing has been mentioned yet.

 

[musicaljoke]

Life insurance is often used for estate planning purposes by the rich in Canada. It allows tax-free transferring of some wealth. (although that "loop-hole" is gradually being closed off)

Yes, that's right. A wealthy person could have a life insurance benefit worth $100,000,000.00 (one hundred million) or more. Additional amounts can be invested within the policy over many years, so that the value can be much higher. It's a way to flow large sums of money to a named individual, without probate or taxes. The uber wealthy don't use life insurance in the same way that average income people use it.

I certainly wouldn't dismiss life insurance as a motivating factor in a potential murder.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/glo...-it-all-tool-for-the-wealthy/article29937074/

 

[matou]

Joe Warmington of the Toronto Sun is still running with this info:

The unusual circumstances of how the bodies were found — hanging from a pool railing with their hands in jacket sleeves behind their backs — has many speculating this was a murder.

http://torontosun.com/news/local-news/family-of-barry-and-honey-sherman-hire-private-investigator