Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #9

[Deleted member 102539]

Related? Not long ago or far away.. speculation, imo.
The Bridle Path mansion, the missing millions, and the investigation that blew open a massive mortgage scam
"Paradise Lost
Seven High Point Road in the Bridle Path was supposed to be the ultimate symbol of achievement for the couple that bought it. Today, it’s the grandest remnant of an alleged real estate scam that left a trail of victims, $17 million unaccounted for and one young lawyer in hiding"

By Nicholas Köhler | Photograph by Daniel Neuhaus | November 1, 2018

Endless court battles, angry relatives and shady players: the truth about Barry Sherman

A hard-nosed strategic genius who built Canada’s largest pharmaceutical company, Sherman also conducted business with known criminals.

His investments outside of Apotex were both extensive and, at times, perplexing—a list that includes a failed casino bid, a money-losing gold mine, an outfit that produced therapeutic pads for horseshoes, a stake in the hottest commercial real estate venture in the country, a now-bankrupt jewellery company that dealt in “loose diamonds,” an investment in a yacht named The Great Gatsby that never existed and his backing of B movies Real Gangsters! and Sicilian Vampire.

 

[andreww]

Or, if it had been announced as a m/s what would the fallout be? (The Estate may have likely sued the TPS, based on Greenspan’s most recent press conference. IMHO, they would not be successful. Our threads here would have stopped shortly after the TPS announcement.)

That is exactly what I was getting at. Congratulations for being the first to have the balls to state the obvious. I am not sure that they would have sued initially, but you can bet that Greenspan and company would be discrediting TPS on a regular basis through the media. It could also be argued that the family has enough political clout to get chief Saunders ousted. What I'm saying is that there was a ton of pressure for this to come out the way the family wanted it to. Gomes' press conference is directed directly at the family, explaining their methodology and covering their asses. They did not answer the questions that the press and public had, they only said whatever they had to to appease the family. In my opinion this quite clearly shows that TPS was on the defensive, that their investigation was being steered by outside influences.

 

[andreww]

Because I refuse to believe that Coronors and pathologists opinions can be bought and paid for, regardless who hires their services. These are highly skilled career professionals involved in the forsesic science industry, not a like one time mechanic who might be tempted to write up a false inspection report if enough money is slipped under the table.

I think we can all agree that OJ Simpson was undeniably guilty of killing his wife and Ronald Goldman. Lets look at just a few of the people who testified on his behalf.

Fredric Rieders (July 9, 1922 – November 26, 2005) was an internationally renowned forensic toxicologist. He was born in Vienna, Austria. Rieders received his PhD in Pharmacology-Toxicology from Thomas Jefferson University. He worked as the Chief Toxicologist for the City of Philadelphia for fourteen years. He later founded National Medical Services in Willow Grove, PA in 1970. Now called NMS Labs, it is a private toxicology lab that handles forensic and clinical toxicology.[

FBI scientist Roger Martz - The FBI's chemistry toxicology unit chief Roger Martz worked on some of the US' biggest cases in the 1990s; the 1993 World Trade Centre bombing, the OJ Simpson murder trial, the Oklahoma city bombing, and the VANPAC mail bomb assassination of a US judge. (A top FBI forensic expert who helped cement the case against David Eastman was embroiled in an explosive misconduct probe that was scathing of his competence and reliability.)

Herbert L. MacDonell has conducted important research and investigation in the field of forensic science for over forty years. MacDonell is the inventor of the MAGNA Brush fingerprint device, and is considered an expert in blood splatter analysis. MacDonell has written and lectured about a wide range of forensic science topics, and has consulted on several high-profile criminal cases.

John Gerdes, a microbiologist from Denver, cited his extensive experience running a medical laboratory and told jurors they should not trust at least some of the prosecution's DNA test results, most notably a set taken from the interior of Simpson's Ford Bronco.

Dr. Henry Lee is a Chinese Americanforensic scientist. He is one of the world's foremost forensic scientists and founder of the Henry C. Lee Institute of Forensic Science.

I could go on, but all of these people were at the time well respected in their given fields. What persuaded these people to testify on behalf of someone that was obviously guilty? One guess $$$$$$. Of course this was in America, and we all know that Canadians have a much higher moral standard

 

[andreww]

The family only ever asked for TPS to do a comprehensive investigation before mouthing off their initial suspicions to the media. I really don't think that was too much to ask, imho,...... do you?

Do you have any source to say TPS were mouthing off suspicions to the press? As far as I am aware police only said a couple of things, 1) that there didn't appear to be any forced entry (true) and 2) They currently weren't seeking a suspect (true as well).

Did anybody report that TPS had told them it was a double suicide or a murder suicide? Not that I am aware of.

And you are incorrect about the family. They clearly said that they wouldn't accept the idea of murder/suicide.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Do you have any source to say TPS were mouthing off suspicions to the press? As far as I am aware police only said a couple of things, 1) that there didn't appear to be any forced entry (true) and 2) They currently weren't seeking a suspect (true as well).

Did anybody report that TPS had told them it was a double suicide or a murder suicide? Not that I am aware of.

And you are incorrect about the family. They clearly said that they wouldn't accept the idea of murder/suicide.

That’s why police didn’t tape off the whole street, why they told the neighbours there was no public safety risk and why a senior police officer suggested for accuracy that I change my column from “they were executed” to it was “a murder-suicide.”

BBM

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/toronto...s-of-billionaires-barry-and-honey-sherman/amp

Yes, grain of salt: it’s the Toronto Sun and Warmington is a columnist, not a reporter.

 

[andreww]

BBM

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/toronto...s-of-billionaires-barry-and-honey-sherman/amp

Yes, grain of salt: it’s the Toronto Sun and Warmington is a columnist, not a reporter.

But did he ever publish that?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

But did he ever publish that?

Publish what?

 

[deugirtni]

Do you have any source to say TPS were mouthing off suspicions to the press? As far as I am aware police only said a couple of things, 1) that there didn't appear to be any forced entry (true) and 2) They currently weren't seeking a suspect (true as well).

It is obvious that if there was a murder, the police would certainly be seeking a suspect(s). Why would you think they would NOT be seeking a suspect? Why would there be 'no outstanding suspects'? It is more than obvious that if not seeking a suspect, and if no outstanding suspect, then the suspect must already be in police custody, by one means or another, which of course, the 2 dead occupants were.

They wouldn't decide to just let the murderer(s) of one of the country's wealthiest couples take a pass. So............... yes, that is very much mouthing off their suspicions on camera, to the press and the public and neighbours and family and customers and suppliers and charitable organizations, that there was nothing to see here, move along, it is a private and personal family matter that is under their control and there are no suspects outstanding from this picture.

There were so many other words they could have chosen that day, no matter their gut instincts, or beliefs at the time, which would have NOT given away their suspicions.... but their need to calm the neighbours and the city and the public was greater than their need for professionalism and to treat the family fairly.

They did not give a rat's a$$ about what the wealthy family thought at that time, but yet you are now expecting the public to believe they're moving the earth to bend to their wishes and keep them happy.

Sidenote:
I recall the one officer from TPS who wrote a scathing letter to the mayor about his thoughts on both the mayor and the officer's head hauncho and issues within the force... I find it interesting that you would believe that out of all of those who 'get' what's really going on here (in your mind), there would not be one who would go to the press with that bombshell. Even if for money.

 

[deugirtni]

And you are incorrect about the family. They clearly said that they wouldn't accept the idea of murder/suicide.

It is of no consequence what the family would or would not accept - if they were presented with the proof, then it simply is what it is. If the family had objected and ranted and cried and sued, they merely would have simply leaked some facts, or held a press conference to state that after investigating fully, the forensic pathologist ruled one death a murder and one a suicide, and their own investigation revealed blood all over B and B's skin under H's nails, etc... whatever the proof was.

The fact they are not able to do that, and instead have determined it was indeed a double homicide, tells us the family ended up being right.

And *that* is probably why Gomes was so nervous at her press conference. More egg on their faces to have to admit to in public, after all of the recent incompetencies, lack of judgement and errors were fresh in the publics' minds.

 

[deugirtni]

But did he ever publish that?

The link was included in the same post you replied to:

That’s why police didn’t tape off the whole street, why they told the neighbours there was no public safety risk and why a senior police officer suggested for accuracy that I change my column from “they were executed” to it was “a murder-suicide.”
WARMINGTON: $10 million questions in unsolved slayings of billionaires Barry and Honey Sherman

 

[deugirtni]

It is of no consequence what the family would or would not accept - if they were presented with the proof, then it simply is what it is. If the family had objected and ranted and cried and sued, they merely would have simply leaked some facts, or held a press conference to state that after investigating fully, the forensic pathologist ruled one death a murder and one a suicide, and their own investigation revealed blood all over B and B's skin under H's nails, etc... whatever the proof was.

The fact they are not able to do that, and instead have determined it was indeed a double homicide, tells us the family ended up being right.

And *that* is probably why Gomes was so nervous at her press conference. More egg on their faces to have to admit to in public, after all of the recent incompetencies, lack of judgement and errors were fresh in the publics' minds.

Sorry to quote my own post, but further to this - if indeed this is what had instead happened, and the family was crying about it in the press... I'm sure we can all imagine what the reporting would be like in that event. 'Rich kids thought they could change the outcome of the police investigation - the age of entitlement', etc. etc. etc. It would not have been pretty for the family.

 

[andreww]

The link was included in the same post you replied to:

That’s why police didn’t tape off the whole street, why they told the neighbours there was no public safety risk and why a senior police officer suggested for accuracy that I change my column from “they were executed” to it was “a murder-suicide.”
WARMINGTON: $10 million questions in unsolved slayings of billionaires Barry and Honey Sherman

I got that, but the story was published in late October. Did anybody actually publish anything that indicated possible suicide in December 2017? I don't think so.

 

[andreww]

It is of no consequence what the family would or would not accept - if they were presented with the proof, then it simply is what it is. If the family had objected and ranted and cried and sued, they merely would have simply leaked some facts, or held a press conference to state that after investigating fully, the forensic pathologist ruled one death a murder and one a suicide, and their own investigation revealed blood all over B and B's skin under H's nails, etc... whatever the proof was.

The fact they are not able to do that, and instead have determined it was indeed a double homicide, tells us the family ended up being right.

And *that* is probably why Gomes was so nervous at her press conference. More egg on their faces to have to admit to in public, after all of the recent incompetencies, lack of judgement and errors were fresh in the publics' minds.

What I'm getting at is that nobody seems to have said it was a suicide or Murder Suicide back in December. If the family actually wanted the truth, why not wait until the investigation was complete before hiring a team of investigators and feeding stories to the press. Seems to me that they might have been circling the wagons way too soon. Did they suspect something and wanted to get a handle on it early?

 

[MistyWaters]

What I'm getting at is that nobody seems to have said it was a suicide or Murder Suicide back in December. If the family actually wanted the truth, why not wait until the investigation was complete before hiring a team of investigators and feeding stories to the press. Seems to me that they might have been circling the wagons way too soon. Did they suspect something and wanted to get a handle on it early?

Right, but if they’d just sat back in silence and ignored the m/s rumours running rampant, then later, after the deaths were determined to be double homicide they’ve been viewed with suspicion by some, by the appearance they’d hoped the death file would be quickly closed.

So regardless of their action or inaction, either way there’d have been opportunity to point fingers of blame at them, for those inclined to do so.

 

[MistyWaters]

From almost a year ago......


Family of Barry and Honey Sherman release a statement

A statement released Saturday from the family of billionaire pharmaceutical giant Barry Sherman and his wife Honey urges the media "to refrain from further reporting as to the cause of these tragic deaths until the investigation is completed.”

Autopsies are being conducted Saturday after the couple was found dead in their York Mills home Friday afternoon.

Barry Sherman and his wife Honey Sherman were found inside a house near Bayview Avenue and Highway 401 just before noon.

Toronto Police Constable David Hopkinson told reporters Friday evening, "Until we know exactly how they died we treat it as suspicious and once a determination has been made with the pathologist and the coroner then we move forward from there."

A statement from the Sherman family, released by Apotex, Saturday afternoon said,

"Our parents shared an enthusiasm for life and commitment to their family and community totally inconsistent with the rumors regrettably circulated in the media as to the circumstances surrounding their deaths.
We are shocked and think it's irresponsible that police sources have reportedly advised the media of a theory which neither their family, their friends nor their colleagues believe to be true.
We urge the Toronto Police Service to conduct a thorough, intensive and objective criminal investigation, and urge the media to refrain from further reporting as to the cause of these tragic deaths until the investigation is completed."

 

[deugirtni]

I got that, but the story was published in late October. Did anybody actually publish anything that indicated possible suicide in December 2017? I don't think so.

Well yes, and you've lost me. See my post above when 'we' just discussed how TPS said, on the day the bodies were found, that there were no outstanding suspects. That is why the family was offended. etc etc etc. That there was no outstanding suspect according to TPS, only has one meaning. Think about that.

 

[deugirtni]

What I'm getting at is that nobody seems to have said it was a suicide or Murder Suicide back in December. If the family actually wanted the truth, why not wait until the investigation was complete before hiring a team of investigators and feeding stories to the press. Seems to me that they might have been circling the wagons way too soon. Did they suspect something and wanted to get a handle on it early?

Why? Because their parents were being trashed in the news, around the world, publicly, through the press... in that TPS was saying that there was no suspect outstanding. Of course there would have been a suspect outstanding if the couple had been murdered, unless of course, they had already taken the murderer into police custody. Why would they wait? They could easily see where this was going. So could everyone else, including yourself. You have stated many many times that police were forced to change their tune from their initial findings, via financial and political pressures, remember?

 

[andreww]

Why? Because their parents were being trashed in the news, around the world, publicly, through the press... in that TPS was saying that there was no suspect outstanding. Of course there would have been a suspect outstanding if the couple had been murdered, unless of course, they had already taken the murderer into police custody. Why would they wait? They could easily see where this was going. So could everyone else, including yourself. You have stated many many times that police were forced to change their tune from their initial findings, via financial and political pressures, remember?

So first you say that they are looking for the truth, but without any knowledge of what actually happened, they assemble a team to dispute it? And can you show me just one example of their parents being trashed in the press?

 

[deugirtni]

So first you say that they are looking for the truth, but without any knowledge of what actually happened, they assemble a team to dispute it? And can you show me just one example of their parents being trashed in the press?

Yes.... the one example is when, on the very day the bodies were found, police went on TV saying there were no outstanding suspects, that no suspects were being sought.

I have never said they hired a team to 'dispute' anything. Indeed, *you* have been saying that. I said the family only ever asked for a comprehensive investigation to be undertaken before mouthing off their theories in the media. Since TPS did so on day#1, that is why the family acted very quickly to assemble their own team and to have an independent autopsy completed before it was too late. It didn't take a rocket scientist to see where the investigation was going, according to TPS - in fact it was all over the news andreww, remember? As mentioned earlier, there really is only one way to take that statement that they weren't seeking a suspect and everyone clued into that right away.

 

[andreww]

Well yes, and you've lost me. See my post above when 'we' just discussed how TPS said, on the day the bodies were found, that there were no outstanding suspects. That is why the family was offended. etc etc etc. That there was no outstanding suspect according to TPS, only has one meaning. Think about that.

You take that to mean what you want it to mean. To me it just means they don't have a suspect? I guess you are taking to mean they killed themselves? I believe you are interpreting things incorrectly as a reason to justify the family's behaviour.

Everything about this case has been off since the beginning. Everything. The family's team, the work orders listing one victim, Gomes' press conference, TPS officers whispering behind the scenes, and here we are one year later and we have not heard one single detail that would positively confirm that this was in fact a double murder. In my opinion this case is dead, exactly as I expected it would be a year ago. Let's see if TPS makes a progress update on the anniversary. I'm not holding my breath.