Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #9

[JDG]

#680 ^^^^ very interesting! Of course its suicide......

 

[Lexiintoronto]

October 11th 2017 video of the Shermans together I hadn’t seen before.

 

[kiwi50]

That was an interesting interview, they certainly appeared happy together. The one thing I got from it, Honey was the boss in their relationship.

 

[human]

They really felt it important to give

 

[Hann]

Thanks for the video. They look like nice and generous people. It is a great loss for their family and their community. Hopefully, the killer will be found. Barry looks like a gentle soul, not like a criminal mastermind.

 

[deugirtni]

October 11th 2017 video of the Shermans together I hadn’t seen before.

Great find Lexiintoronto, thank you. And recorded only a couple of months before they died.

 

[dotr]

October 11th 2017 video of the Shermans together I hadn’t seen before.

start approx @323
Honey speaks about helping the Jewish community first and how that will in turn help the greater Toronto community... immediately following that statement, HS then says to BS " Now you have to sit up straight and pull down your jacket"
imo, speculation

 

[Lexiintoronto]

start approx @323
Honey speaks about helping the Jewish community first and how that will in turn help the greater Toronto community... immediately following that statement, HS then says to BS " Now you have to sit up straight and pull down your jacket"
imo, speculation

!!!! That didn’t register with me until you pointed it out.

I wonder if she said that to him often? I thought it was endearing how she straightened his tie and then later told him that.

That might be part of the message in the staging?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

From the article where the video is posted, RBBM. The writer must have been referring to HS’s battle with throat cancer:

And even during the weeks when her throat could not utter a sound, her opinions were heard loud and clear. She had only 3 objectives: transparency, excellence and impact.”

Honey Sherman z"l honored at UJA's 13th Annual Volunteer Awards Night | UJA Federation of Greater Toronto

 

[casesensitive]

Thanks for the video Lexi. It showed so much about them in such a short moment in time.
I admit I was a bit taken back by Honey's control freak behaviour, but Barry seemed to think it was hilarious. I think these two polar opposite personalities really did compliment each other, and they knew and understood each other very well.

 

[Indy Anna]

I thought they were such an endearing couple in that video. I noticed before the camera was lowered, it appeared HS was holding BS's hand. She seemed to be a very touchy-feely person, and BS was comfortable with that. HS also seemed to attach a lot of importance to appearances and presentation. Thinking back to some pictures I saw of BS, I think he didn't give much thought to appearance as he placed more emphasis on business pursuits. So, he was open to HS's reminders about his appearance. IMO, they did complement each other very well.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I thought they were such an endearing couple in that video. I noticed before the camera was lowered, it appeared HS was holding BS's hand. She seemed to be a very touchy-feely person, and BS was comfortable with that. HS also seemed to attach a lot of importance to appearances and presentation. Thinking back to some pictures I saw of BS, I think he didn't give much thought to appearance as he placed more emphasis on business pursuits. So, he was open to HS's reminders about his appearance. IMO, they did complement each other very well.

bbm
They held hands and after they separated their hands, she left her arm on his armrest. Very special to see a couple of so many years both mentally and physically connected in such a manner. Touching. She his "early trophy wife" and he her .... what exactly, Idk .... maybe the 5th child, soft, hyper smart and successful.

 

[andreww]

You all realize this is a PR appearance right? I've seen people who absolutely hate each other do a PR appearance where they appear to be the best of pals, but as soon as the camera stops rolling...

Not saying this is the case, but the video has absolutely no merit in the grand scheme of things. Regis and Kelly seemed like they loved each other on TV too, but far from reality.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

but the video has absolutely no merit in the grand scheme of things.

bbm

 

[Lexiintoronto]

You all realize this is a PR appearance right? I've seen people who absolutely hate each other do a PR appearance where they appear to be the best of pals, but as soon as the camera stops rolling...

Not saying this is the case, but the video has absolutely no merit in the grand scheme of things. Regis and Kelly seemed like they loved each other on TV too, but far from reality.

I don’t think they’re actors or PR professionals. At that stage of their lives, they had nothing to prove to anyone.

I believed the m/s theory in the beginning when the police seemed to be saying what it was.

The ligature marks on their wrists changed my mind. How do you explain them?

Why prop HS up after death?

 

[andreww]

I don’t think they’re actors or PR professionals. At that stage of their lives, they had nothing to prove to anyone.

I believed the m/s theory in the beginning when the police seemed to be saying what it was.

The ligature marks on their wrists changed my mind. How do you explain them?

Why prop HS up after death?

Very simply actually. Barry is wanting to stage this as a murder, I mean that's why you stage something isn't it? To make it look like something it's not? You don't stage a murder to look like another type of murder. So here is what I think happened. Barry staged Honey's body first. As part of that staging he tightly bound her wrists, possibly using shoelaces. When it was time to stage his own death he found that either 1) he could not tie his own wrists together effectively or 2) with his wrists tied, he could not manipulate the belt around his neck and the railing. So at this point he removes the bindings and goes with the straight jacket approach.

This is speculated to be one of the confusing factors in the Jonbenet Ramsey case, elements of staging that were added or removed as the plan evolved.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Very simply actually. Barry is wanting to stage this as a murder, I mean that's why you stage something isn't it? To make it look like something it's not? You don't stage a murder to look like another type of murder. So here is what I think happened. Barry staged Honey's body first. As part of that staging he tightly bound her wrists, possibly using shoelaces. When it was time to stage his own death he found that either 1) he could not tie his own wrists together effectively or 2) with his wrists tied, he could not manipulate the belt around his neck and the railing. So at this point he removes the bindings and goes with the straight jacket approach.

This is speculated to be one of the confusing factors in the Jonbenet Ramsey case, elements of staging that were added or removed as the plan evolved.

Your theory makes sense to me. I just don’t see why someone as brilliant as Barry would not make it look as though it was clearly murder.

Honey was dead in your theory when the bindings were applied, and her bindings applied first. Why would Barry remove *her* bindings. Presumably, it’s either Barry’s or Honey’s belt around her neck with evidence of ownership- same with the bindings. Where are they?

Wounds made before and after death are distinct, wouldn’t the Provincial pathologist see that?

My guess would be that Barry would have wanted to get his affairs in order in whatever little time he had left. I’d think there would be some trace of that.

ETA: ‘Sources’ say Honey had facial injuries and bled on the ground in one area before being moved to the staging area- why not leave her there? If Barry’s staging it, why not make it loook like he struggled or give himself the same matching facial wounds, knock his glasses off...?

 

[andreww]

Honey would have had to have been dead in your theory when the bindings were applied, and her bindings applied first. Why would Barry remove *her* bindings. Presumably, it’s either Barry’s or Honey’s belt around her neck with evidence of ownership- same with the bindings.

Also, wounds made before and after death are distinct, wouldn’t the Provincial pathologist see that?

My guess would be that Barry would have wanted to get his affairs in order in whatever little time he had left. I’d think there would be some trace of that.

Not sure what you are asking, if it is why he removed Honey's bindings I'd say that the idea would be that he was trying to portray a scenario where they were both murdered together. It would only make sense that if one was bound with laces, the other would be too.

Would skin abrasions be different after death? Possibly, possibly not.

As far as ownership of the items used, to this point we have absolutely no evidence that any "tool" was used that came from outside of the home. The belts and the jackets belonged to the Shermans. I find it unfathomable to believe that a murderer would tie their wrists, hang them up, remove the ties, then apply the jackets as a binding mechanism.

Again, as I said earlier, staging has only one purpose, to make one thing appear to be something else. You do not stage a murder to look like another type of murder. You might stage it to look like an accident or you might stage it to look like a suicide. We know this wasn't an accident, and the jackets acting as arm restraints tells me that this is not staged as a suicide.

 

[andreww]

My guess would be that Barry would have wanted to get his affairs in order in whatever little time he had left. I’d think there would be some trace of that.

ETA: ‘Sources’ say Honey had facial injuries and bled on the ground in one area before being moved to the staging area- why not leave her there? If Barry’s staging it, why not make it loook like he struggled or give himself the same matching facial wounds, knock his glasses off...?

Sorry, missed these two. First off, I think Barry's affairs were already in order. He's not like you or I, people that have to look after things like that on our own. He had accountants and lawyers to look after everything for him, so I doubt he needed to look after anything.

As to the facial injuries. None of us are actually sure what they actually were, so kind of hard to comment. Apparently whatever it was was enough to allow a pooling of blood on the floor though. I would suggest that it is simply impossible to replicate that kind of injury on yourself. Could you punch yourself in the face hard enough to break your nose? I think not.

 

[JDG]

And yet the TPS have described it as a double homicide.