Canadian hostage, wife & children freed from Afghanistan, husband arrested for abuse, Oct 2017 #2

[MsFacetious]

Oh boy.... her lawyer is definitely going to be a witness now. They can't prove she's lying otherwise. What a disaster.

 

[katydid23]

I feel so sorry for this woman. She has been through so much. I can't imagine being held hostage in the Middle East and having children during that confinement. Then finally returning to 'freedom' ---only to have a circus surrounding me from press to dysfunctional family issues and custody battles and a psycho for an ex husband....and then the court battles.

I hope she gets some peace and quiet someday soon.

 

[Intermezzo]

Trial is to resume today with Caitlan's mother taking the witness stand.

No media reports or tweets as of yet from the courtroom

Joshua Boyle’s wife lied about advice lawyer gave her on media: defence

Joshua Boyle’s wife lied about advice lawyer gave her on media: defence

He said he would give no comment or opinion on whether Coleman had breached the order he gave her in April, but said the question about what legal advice she received about the media interviews is relevant to the case because it goes to her credibility.

Crown attorney Meaghan Cunningham told Doody she did not feel that there was enough information on the record for anyone to make any assertion about Coleman’s credibility.

The trial is to continue Friday with testimony from Coleman’s mother, Lyn Coleman. Caitlan Coleman will not return to the stand to finish her cross-examination until later this month.

 

[human]

It’s a loser for her. Who would ever think talking to the media during a trial is OK?

It seems like she wants media attention.

I imagine there is no way around it because of child custody, but in no way is she ready to do a trial.

She needs lots of mental health support and intervention.No one can possibly be mentally together after her experiences

 

[Intermezzo]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/lynda-coleman-lawyer-boyle-trial-1.5201412 July 5, 2019

Caitlan Coleman 'like a robot' after Afghan captivity, mother tells sex assault trial

Caitlan Coleman's mother told an Ottawa courtroom today she hardly recognized her daughter when she and her then-husband Joshua Boyle returned from captivity in Afghanistan in 2017.

"She was totally changed to my mind," Lynda Coleman testified at Boyle's sexual assault trial. "She was very non-expressive. Her voice was changed."

Caitlan Coleman was subsequently hospitalized; her mother said she travelled from the U.S. to Ottawa to be at her bedside. Even after she recovered, Lynda testified, Caitlin — or Katie, as she called her — was not herself.

"She seemed like a robot or an automaton," Lynda said under Crown questioning.

She testified that Boyle was controlling and expected her daughter to take care of the house and the children. Boyle was also cold and arrogant, she said.

"Josh never showed any affection," Lynda said. "He never showed any respect. He didn't help with the children or with household chores."

The defence will cross-examine Lynda Coleman later today.

 

[Intermezzo]

Boyle made notes, shook his head and snickered quietly in the courtroom as he listened to his ex-mother-in-law.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/lynda-coleman-lawyer-boyle-trial-1.5201412 July 5, 2019 UPDATED

(Caitlan's mom) She said she remembers taking her daughter and grandkids to Walmart on Dec. 30
With a full grocery cart, she said, they waited for Boyle to pick them up; suddenly, with a look of panic on her face, Caitlan blurted out that she'd forgotten to buy an item her husband wanted.
"She dashed in and got back with a 20 lb bag of rice," Lynda said. "She was afraid."

That evening, Caitlan and her mom unpacked the groceries and Boyle prepared dinner, Lynda said — but he refused to eat. Lynda didn't tell the court why; in previous testimony, however, Caitlan told court Boyle erupted in anger that evening when one of their children came into the kitchen.

Lynda said that, before midnight that same evening, she got a call back at her hotel room.
"And it was Katie on the phone saying, 'Mom, I need your help,'" Lynda said. "She was so frightened. She told me that she ran out of the house. She had no coat, no shoes."

Minutes later, Lynda said, Caitlan arrived at the hotel in a cab, "dishevelled" and in her socks. During her previous testimony in March, Caitlan told the court that night her husband threatened to confine her to their bedroom.

A visit from the Ottawa police followed, Lynda told court. The police officers said Boyle had called 911, saying Caitlan was suicidal.

The defence spent less than 20 minutes cross-examining Boyle's ex-mother-in-law. Many of their questions focused on Coleman's mental health.
Lynda told the defence she knew Caitlan suffered from PTSD, even though during earlier testimony she said her daughter didn't have mental health issues.

 

[nuff]

It’s a loser for her. Who would ever think talking to the media during a trial is OK?

It seems like she wants media attention.

I imagine there is no way around it because of child custody, but in no way is she ready to do a trial.

She needs lots of mental health support and intervention.No one can possibly be mentally together after her experiences

Whatever her mental health issues or her imperfect personality traits may be, they have no bearing on the guilt (or innocence - unlikely IMO) of the accused.

 

[otto]

Whatever her mental health issues or her imperfect personality traits may be, they have no bearing on the guilt (or innocence - unlikely IMO) of the accused.

Both the accused and the alleged victim have PTSD and mental health issues. By alleging that previously consensual S&M was non-consensual, the accuser was able to immediately remove the children from their home and transport them across the border.

Since the start of the trial, there has been inconsistent or contradictory testimony and disrespect for the spirit if not the letter of the Judge's order on behalf of the accuser.

The mental state of both the accuser and the accused is important, and it may ultimately be impossible to determine what happened if the accuser is unable to respect the law and present true, factual information.

 

[human]

Whatever her mental health issues or her imperfect personality traits may be, they have no bearing on the guilt (or innocence - unlikely IMO) of the accused.

It has huge bearing because of issues with the law. There are so many breeches and I feel it is because in no way can someone be stable after what she has gone through.

Anyone who has had difficulties in their own lives can relate to how they were not functioning at a good capacity for a long time after trauma.

She is not making good decisions and it will hurt her.

The law often has issues with justice because the law was not followed.

 

[otto]

I think it would be a good idea for the trial to recess so the parents can sort out the custody issues. After that has been resolved, the parties can decide to put one or both of the victims in jail. It is their call.

There's no question that the mother does not want the father to have contact with the children, and that if the father is found not guilty, he will be guaranteed contact with his children. The only way for the mother to prevent the father from having contact with the children is if he is found guilty of non-consensual S&M when prior S&M was consensual. There is also the not so small issue of credibility under oath.

If this has nothing to do with custody, why don't they sort that out as though he is not guilty, and then proceed with the trial. At this time, the waters are very muddy.

 

[Intermezzo]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/caitlan-coleman-interviews-trial-1.5215273 JULY 19, 2019

Caitlan Coleman says she spoke to media during trial to give women hope

Under questioning at the proceedings Thursday against her spouse Joshua Boyle, Coleman said she felt that "speaking out" would create awareness about domestic violence and give women the courage to leave abusive relationships.

When proceedings resumed this month, Greenspon noted Coleman had been ordered by Judge Peter Doody not to discuss her testimony with witnesses, or potential ones, until completion of the trial.

Coleman said that she understood from her criminal and family-law counsel that it was acceptable to discuss her tempestuous relationship with Boyle as long as she didn't talk about the alleged acts at the centre of the trial.

It is a long-held legal principle that discussions between a lawyer and client are confidential, a concept known as solicitor-client privilege.

But Coleman's remarks led Doody to advise her there was now a question as to whether she waived her solicitor-client privilege when she testified that it was her understanding from her lawyers that she could discuss her relationship with Boyle in media interviews.

Greenspon said he didn't believe Coleman actually was told by her lawyers that it would be OK to do the interviews.

 

[Intermezzo]

The Crown has finished is case in chief, not sure when Defense arguments will begin.
will keep checking court lists .

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/caitlan-coleman-interviews-trial-1.5215273

Privilege upheld

In a July 9 ruling, Doody said Coleman's comments did not amount to a waiver of solicitor-client privilege.

During Thursday's hearing, Crown attorney Meaghan Cunningham asked Coleman to help the court understand why she spoke to reporters.

"I spent a lot of time thinking about whether or not to speak to the media," said Coleman, testifying via video link.

Ultimately, Coleman said, she decided that doing the interviews could be helpful to women suffering domestic abuse.

 

[Intermezzo]

Judge threw out PART of the expert testimony , not all of it. UGH. Headlines.

Judge Doody has a number critical evidentiary rulings he must make in the case. This is the first of them.
The Defense will present their case once the Judge has issued his rulings on the applications before him

Boyle trial: Judge throws out expert testimony on hostage trauma August 12, 2019

Boyle trial: Judge throws out expert testimony on hostage trauma

In a ruling issued Monday, Judge Peter K. Doody said he will admit the expert evidence of Deborah Sinclair as it relates to the behaviour of domestic abuse victims, but he rejected the rest of her testimony — including her opinion about the potential impact of Caitlan Coleman’s five years as a hostage in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

“I have concluded that Dr. Sinclair does not possess the necessary expertise to provide an opinion about the effects of prolonged foreign captivity,” Doody wrote

But Doody ruled that Sinclair did not have the clinical or academic background to offer an expert opinion on the impact of hostage taking. In fact, he said, she cribbed most of her answer from a previous domestic violence case in which she was involved.

 

[Intermezzo]

Joshua Boyle’s testimony indicative of his ‘pattern of behaviour’: Prosecutor August 12, 2019

Joshua Boyle’s testimony indicative of his ‘pattern of behaviour’: Prosecutor

A Crown prosecutor says testimony about former hostage Joshua Boyle’ s controlling, abusive nature should be admitted into evidence at his assault trial because it depicts a relevant pattern of behaviour.

Boyle’s lawyer, Lawrence Greenspon, argued such evidence should not be allowed, saying it was insufficient to contend his client was generally inclined to act abusively toward Coleman.

Greenspon suggested the Crown would need to do more than demonstrate Boyle had a “bad attitude” in Ottawa for the testimony to become part of the evidentiary record.

He questioned how prosecutors could draw a direct line from such testimony to the alleged commission of criminal offences. In turn, he wondered how any of it added an essential thread to the narrative, warranting admission into evidence.

“In my submission, it doesn’t,” Greenspon said.

 

[Intermezzo]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/boyle-trial-legal-arguments-evidence-1.5233918 August 12, 2019

Joshua Boyle's lawyers seek to exclude evidence from estranged wife, in-laws

The defence argued that most of the evidence from Boyle's in-laws didn't directly relate to the charges he faces.

Crown lawyer Meaghan Cunningham argued Boyle's alleged demeaning and denigrating ways is relevant to establishing the "narrative" that Boyle physically and sexually abused his wife and held her in captivity while in Ottawa. Cunningham, who in court called this "relationship history evidence," said it was critical for establishing the motive for Boyle's crimes.

"The point of this evidence is it shows a pattern," Cunningham said.

Defence lawyer Eric Granger argued before a break for lunch that much of the evidence Coleman and her family gave referred to the mundane day-to-day happenings of the couple's relationship. These "normal vicissitudes of life," Granger said, didn't touch on the charges that his client faces.

 

[nuff]

There's no question that the mother does not want the father to have contact with the children, and that if the father is found not guilty, he will be guaranteed contact with his children. The only way for the mother to prevent the father from having contact with the children is if he is found guilty of non-consensual S&M when prior S&M was consensual. There is also the not so small issue of credibility under oath.

If this has nothing to do with custody, why don't they sort that out as though he is not guilty, and then proceed with the trial. At this time, the waters are very muddy.

You seem to be ignoring the charges that relate to a different victim, currently under a publication ban as I recall. If that second victim is one of the children (as is probable), the outcome would most certainly relate to the custody issue.

 

[MyBelle]

You seem to be ignoring the charges that relate to a different victim, currently under a publication ban as I recall. If that second victim is one of the children (as is probable), the outcome would most certainly relate to the custody issue.

ITA.

 

[Intermezzo]

Admin.
Sept 3,
Is it time to start a new thread? The trial has resumed today and at 51 pages in with this thread maybe its time to start a new one?

 

[Intermezzo]

Joshua Boyle's lawyers want charge of misleading police thrown out SEPT 3, 2019

Joshua Boyle's lawyers want charge of misleading police thrown out

In court today, Boyle's lawyers argued there is insufficient evidence to support the charge that Boyle misled police to believe Coleman was suicidal and missing to divert suspicion from himself the night of Dec. 30, 2017.

The Crown has agreed to modify a charge of sexual assault with a weapon, specifically ropes, to simply sexual assault.
Boyle's lawyers argue another charge of sexual assault with ropes should proceed as an allegation of assault with a weapon.

 

[Intermezzo]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...e9-98c1-e945ae5db8fb_story.html?noredirect=on. AUGUST 23, 2019

This interview/article is long and she gives her side of the story.

‘No one just goes hiking in Afghanistan’: American woman gave birth as a Taliban hostage. Now she seeks to end her mystery.

Now back in the United States, Coleman is attempting to create a stable home for her four young children while a Canadian court tries their father on 19 counts of abuse, including sexual assault and unlawful confinement. The outcome of the case, which has focused attention on the couple’s intimate life and their conflicting depictions of each other, is likely to determine whether Coleman retains sole custody of the children.

Coleman said she is speaking out to tell her own, unfiltered account of what occurred during those five difficult years. It amends and, in some cases, contradicts some of the statements she made following the family’s release in 2017, which she says Boyle coerced.

Taking care of four children on her own is not easy. Coleman attended college for a year before she was kidnapped and hopes to pursue a career in psychology when the children are older.

“Caity comes back and she’s penniless,” Jim Coleman said of his daughter, who is seeking a divorce.

The Canadian government provided some assistance to the family, including housing, medical care and a social worker, but Coleman struggled back in the United States to find a doctor and a therapist. Social services didn’t seem equipped to address what had happened to her and the kids.
The boys are seeing specialists in childhood trauma.

But it’s difficult to look ahead while the trial — and the possibility Boyle will reenter their lives — hangs over her.

“There are still days that I feel very, very fearful that I’m going to lose all of this,” she said, “and one day I’m going to be back in that place.”