Casey & Family Psychological Profile #8

[kageykaren]

I think this would be a great thread separate from family psych. Everyday sociopaths are good at mimicking others emotions. In a sense it is a form of acting by the sociopath who needs to fit in a certain enviroment. Looking at overall stats showing sociopathy begins to show in early adulthood has you thinking KC has her mimicking, acting down as we see. My feeling is this form of acting was forced to the surface by the birth of Caylee. KC had no direction in becomming a mother through her pregnancy as she hid it or family hid it. Once the secret was exposed, mom CC seemed to be saying by the decor she bought for Caylee's nursery, "Well, we just proceed from here, and everything will be perfectly fine. The word "Perfect" seems to play a big part in this family. After admissions of wanting to adopt Caylee out being refuted, I feel she began her biggest acting role as a bite, beautiful, mother and had no idea how difficult her role would be. I feel this acting roll was to demanding for her to keep up. Hince the hole JG relationship. KC sociopathic tendencies leading to murder was just a matter of time. Time to find a new acting roll better suited for who she saw herself as a carfree, educated, independant one of the gals. By her socialsites it seems she took bits and pieces of alot of the women around her to form what she feels is a perfect persona, only having to alter occasionally. depending on which set of friends. Acting, fantasizing for her selfish means seems interesting to throw around.

 

[essies]

I see what you're saying snow, but IMO, "Zanny" was her alter ego in a cold calculating way, part of a plot to divest herself of Caylee. I don't think she lives in a fantasy world, just a world where she better get what she desires at all costs. I don't think KC needed fantasy to live her life, she just needed to bend people to her will, hence the elaborate lies.

are you saying KC did NOT have a fantasy life?? I would find that rather odd in light of all that she said about just such a life.. a nanny .. a boss that sent her emails.. co-workers who had names and stories to go with them..

Her ability to tell stories about all of these people, and to keep those stories straight, says to me that she had thought up this whole story line over a long period of time, it wasn't just something she came up with for LE after the 'kidnapping'..

I think I will give up trying though, and go reconstruct her fantasy life on my own as best I can.. think it should be rather interesting and quite enlightening in many ways.

I think you both are on the same page but from different angles! There was a fantasy llife! Did KC believe the fantasy-NO! That is the difference! The ones who actually lived in her fantasy and believed her fantasy was her family and friends! KC knows full well the whole life she talked about was a fake! That's the difference-it wasn't delusion-it was manipulation! That's the difference between crazy and evil!:furious: IMO

 

[The Eunice Burns]

are you saying KC did NOT have a fantasy life?? I would find that rather odd in light of all that she said about just such a life.. a nanny .. a boss that sent her emails.. co-workers who had names and stories to go with them..

Her ability to tell stories about all of these people, and to keep those stories straight, says to me that she had thought up this whole story line over a long period of time, it wasn't just something she came up with for LE after the 'kidnapping'..

I think I will give up trying though, and go reconstruct her fantasy life on my own as best I can.. think it should be rather interesting and quite enlightening in many ways.

She had a fantasy life in that she constructed these lies and fables. But, what I was trying to say is that rather than it being a fantasy life born out of a need to cope with reality, no. I don't believe that. IMO, the "family" she gave "Zanny", the story she spun about Jeffery, etc. was all part of a scheme to fit her own ends. IOW, to me, a fantasy life is something I could see someone inventing to act as a buffer to the ugliness of their reality. I don't think that applies to KC. I hope I worded this a bit better......I know what I'm trying to say,but not sure if it's coming across correctly.

 

[The Eunice Burns]

I think you both are on the same page but from different angles! There was a fantasy llife! Did KC believe the fantasy-NO! That is the difference! The ones who actually lived in her fantasy and believed her fantasy was her family and friends! KC knows full well the whole life she talked about was a fake! That's the difference-it wasn't delusion-it was manipulation! That's the difference between crazy and evil!:furious: IMO

Thank You, essies! That is what I mean. :blowkiss:

 

[Brini]

Couldn't Muster Apologies
Covets Material Accessories
Curious Mental Abnormalities
Consummate Moral Abyss

Couldn't Mother Anything

 

[MAMABEAR]

are you saying KC did NOT have a fantasy life?? I would find that rather odd in light of all that she said about just such a life.. a nanny .. a boss that sent her emails.. co-workers who had names and stories to go with them..

Her ability to tell stories about all of these people, and to keep those stories straight, says to me that she had thought up this whole story line over a long period of time, it wasn't just something she came up with for LE after the 'kidnapping'..

I think I will give up trying though, and go reconstruct her fantasy life on my own as best I can.. think it should be rather interesting and quite enlightening in many ways.

Don't give up sweetie. We will get a thread started on this. This is the same kind of fantasy life that CA has.

I see what you are talkin about. I know how to start a thread but don't know what to say in the first post.

 

[countzero]

Don't give up sweetie. We will get a thread started on this. This is the same kind of fantasy life that CA has.

I see what you are talkin about. I know how to start a thread but don't know what to say in the first post.

Yes you do know what to say mama ....... Just make sure the title is a catchy one that hasn't already been discussed. And without looking to search, I don't believe we have ever had a fantasy thread.

Sometime maybe with "How KC created her fantasy world with stories she knew were lies". Just a suggestion, not to be used .... :crazy:

And I promise if I post in it I will keep my posts short. :woohoo:

 

[Brini]

I think this would be a great thread separate from family psych. Everyday sociopaths are good at mimicking others emotions. In a sense it is a form of acting by the sociopath who needs to fit in a certain enviroment. Looking at overall stats showing sociopathy begins to show in early adulthood has you thinking KC has her mimicking, acting down as we see. My feeling is this form of acting was forced to the surface by the birth of Caylee. KC had no direction in becomming a mother through her pregnancy as she hid it or family hid it. Once the secret was exposed, mom CC seemed to be saying by the decor she bought for Caylee's nursery, "Well, we just proceed from here, and everything will be perfectly fine. The word "Perfect" seems to play a big part in this family. After admissions of wanting to adopt Caylee out being refuted, I feel she began her biggest acting role as a bite, beautiful, mother and had no idea how difficult her role would be. I feel this acting roll was to demanding for her to keep up. Hince the hole JG relationship. KC sociopathic tendencies leading to murder was just a matter of time. Time to find a new acting roll better suited for who she saw herself as a carfree, educated, independant one of the gals. By her socialsites it seems she took bits and pieces of alot of the women around her to form what she feels is a perfect persona, only having to alter occasionally. depending on which set of friends. Acting, fantasizing for her selfish means seems interesting to throw around.

Bet it'll get hijacked into yet another psych thread, though.

 

[Brini]

Calculating Matriarchial (or Meretricious) (0r Mouth-Driven) Azz___

 

[countzero]

Bet it'll get hijacked into yet another psych thread, though.

You may be right. Unless the OP stated to keep the psych out of it. Something along the lines of

What fantasy lines did KC tell others about herself and her life.

She told everyone she had a job ........ she told friends she had 15K in a bank account.

Or list the fantasies of KC's world that you would include if you were writing a book about her life.

I don't know if this is even what mama and snow walker had in mind ......... ignore me if I am wrong. Won't hurt my feelings if ya do

 

[essies]

How about a thread listing just the non-facts or, as Cindy would say, the mis-truths without any commentary about why or how?:waitasec:

 

[cecybeans]

I can see where all of you are coming from and why this might seem difficult. Some of us think KC's lies and "fantasy" stories about herself come from the fact she could be a sociopath. Some people think they might be from the fact that they were a coping mechanism for living in a family like hers, or perhaps learned from CA, who certainly is very good at creating "alternate realities" to make the facts conform to her wishes. In fact, several of KC's friends use those very terms to describe her - I can't remember if it was Kio, Amy or Annie, but one of them said that if something bad had happened to Caylee, KC would have reconstructed it in her mind to be something totally different. JG, even though he admitted her lying was "diabolical" also said something to the same effect, as if she often lied to create a perfect world whether from insecurity or some other motivation.

From what I can see, no one is arguing whether she is legally insane - she certainly knew right from wrong and that is evidenced by her elaborate stories she created to cover up Caylee's death. And all of us have opinions about what we might or might not label her personality disorders - that does not seem to be the issue either. Or whether she was lying because she enjoyed it, or to cover insecurity, or to manipulate people or for all those and maybe a host of others.

Let me know if I haven't got this straight, but it seems to me you want to talk about the inconsistencies between the things KC said and did and what was really true or that we can verify actually happened - and leave out the psychological speculation.

Maybe someone could start a thread similar to the ones on GA and CA entitled "Inconsistencies" with what KC said, told others, etc. and what we know really went on so that there is a record. I would also suggest that it might be nice to identify things that she said that we don't know yet are true or not but may have simply taken for granted as a group since they have been present from the outset, or supported by others but who did so only using her as their source (so that they are completely hearsay).

I think that would be a useful addition, to separate the contradictions (call them lies, mistruths, fantasies, whatever) from the actual verifiable facts. If someone starts that thread and makes it clear that the discussion is about comparing inconsistencies but avoiding speculation as to WHY then it could provide a useful list for later.

(For instance, she told various people she knew "Zanny" for six years, four years, two years, etc. - but WHEN did she tell each of those people those stories?) So perhaps, we could make not only a list of inconsistencies but a timeline of when they appeared and to whom they were told. Does that make sense?

 

[MAMABEAR]

Thanks Beans---Thats the first post. LOL
Lub you lil kid.

 

[OneLostGrl]

bbm:

My arms got tired after years of attempting to shake some sense, so I simply cut the cord that attached us. Toxic people - I don't need or want. Don't care if they are family or not. My sanity was and is more important than blood when the family member CHOOSES to remain on the same destructive path.

Amen!

 

[OneLostGrl]

BOY, OH BOY!! I think you have really nailed CA & KC. I have begun to think that CA was showing so many behaviors of Sociopath, also. Particularly when you look back at the many, many interviews, jailhouse visits, dealing with protesters, etc.

My question: how do you label or classify GA??

Well, the important thing to remember is- other illnesses share many of those same symptoms.

 

[OneLostGrl]

I found a diamond ring in a restroom once, and didn't turn it in to security, thinking the security guard would just keep it anyway... some darling 80 year old grandmother is probably heart broken over losing it

I've been charged the wrong amount for things (in my favor) and made a joke of it, "It must be my birthday"

I have fudged on my business expenses on my taxes

I have lied to my mother in law on the phone when the truth is I just wasn't in the mood for her

I have called off work sick, when I was already dressed for the beach, the car packed and running , sunglasses in hand, ready for a "me" day

I have said unkind things about someone. One time my niece repeated something I said to the person. The lady is approaching us, and my little niece (3) says, "Here comes Miss______, the one that you said gives you such a headache!!" Thank goodness the lady just laughed with me, because I was cold busted.

Never during any of these incidents did it occur to me I am modeling lying, cheating, gossiping, committing federal tax fraud or stealing, in fact I fancy myself as one of the "good ones". That is what I mean about it is a cautionary tale about children learning what they live, maybe I was reminding myself to be mindful of what example I am setting. My children and nieces and nephews treat me like I pretty much hung the moon. I want to deserve their respect. Looking at my list, I better get busy changing my ways.

LOL- oh hell, girl, least you can still vote and ya aint goin' to hell! :blowkiss:

 

[OneLostGrl]

That was a classic snarky mommy-daughter moment that showed such an undercurrent of jealous competitive one-up-manship I'm sure ran rampant in that house. I love KC's condescending malaprop "cameos" to describe her mom's media appearances, and CA acting all giggly and flushed with that I'm-gonna-be-a-star-aren't-I? expression. I'm sure she thinks they should have an Emmy for Interview Cameos - cuz she would certain be up for an award even if it is Worst Actress. Uh-oh, I'm getting snarky too. Time to zip it, beans.

:laugh:

 

[OneLostGrl]

My choice would be a "nest of pit vipers," but that isn't in the DSM.

So, I guess we'll have to stick to "personality disordered."

:laugh:

 

[OneLostGrl]

Ok...random thought I had today, but it does go toward the psych profile...and clearly tells me something is very much amiss with CA's psyche, for lack of a better word...but so telling all the same...who snatches $200 from a wallet while LE is in your house investigating the "kidnapping" of your granddaughter? I mean, the walls are crashing down around you, and you have money on your mind? Where's the panic, the grief, the torment? Clearly, at least to me at this point, they knew something. It seems that their behavior at that moment in time...and the days thereafter...they had reconciled "something" in their minds. I know grief can make you do and say some crazy things...but when there is a baby involved? It's mind-numbing!! And she gets sticky fingers?

Wonderful post!!

 

[OneLostGrl]

I think this would be a great thread separate from family psych. Everyday sociopaths are good at mimicking others emotions. In a sense it is a form of acting by the sociopath who needs to fit in a certain enviroment. Looking at overall stats showing sociopathy begins to show in early adulthood has you thinking KC has her mimicking, acting down as we see. My feeling is this form of acting was forced to the surface by the birth of Caylee. KC had no direction in becomming a mother through her pregnancy as she hid it or family hid it. Once the secret was exposed, mom CC seemed to be saying by the decor she bought for Caylee's nursery, "Well, we just proceed from here, and everything will be perfectly fine. The word "Perfect" seems to play a big part in this family. After admissions of wanting to adopt Caylee out being refuted, I feel she began her biggest acting role as a bite, beautiful, mother and had no idea how difficult her role would be. I feel this acting roll was to demanding for her to keep up. Hince the hole JG relationship. KC sociopathic tendencies leading to murder was just a matter of time. Time to find a new acting roll better suited for who she saw herself as a carfree, educated, independant one of the gals. By her socialsites it seems she took bits and pieces of alot of the women around her to form what she feels is a perfect persona, only having to alter occasionally. depending on which set of friends. Acting, fantasizing for her selfish means seems interesting to throw around.

But the thing is- she isn't good at acting or mimicking anything close to "normal" human emotions. If she were she'd have been better prepared when it came time to attempt to convince LE, the media and the public that her daughter was missing and that she had nothing to do with it. It was her absolute lack of emotion that was probably the first clue that she may be involved.