Cause of Death and Time of Death *MERGED* (Warning: Contains Graphic Content!)

[ynotdivein]

Wondering about the striations that a chainsaw would leave, and the mention of markings in the tub. Although I'm not convinced a chainsaw was the tool used quite yet.

RBBM--I'm waffling on that too. LE did take a "knife with sheath" from the house and from what I've learned, it would not take more than that to dismember the limbs at the shoulder and hip joints... They may have begun with a small chainsaw, seen the mess/spatter it caused, and switched to the knife.

 

[Synaptic Cliff]

RBBM--I'm waffling on that too. LE did take a "knife with sheath" from the house and from what I've learned, it would not take more than that to dismember the limbs at the shoulder and hip joints... They may have begun with a small chainsaw, seen the mess/spatter it caused, and switched to the knife.

Yes.. I think there was a knife/sheath taken. So far this seems to me like the only thing we know for sure could have been used for the dismemberment. Still.. There could be a lot we don't know yet.... JMO

I wonder what size knife we're talking....

 

[Hickory Born]

Yes.. I think there was a knife/sheath taken. So far this seems to me like the only thing we know for sure could have been used for the dismemberment. Still.. There could be a lot we don't know yet.... JMO

I wonder what size knife we're talking....

I have my deceased father's deer hunting knife and sheath and it measurers 7 & 3/4 inches long. The blade is 4 inches long. If that helps you any.

 

[tlcya]

They may have taken the knife because at the time, we did not have a body and had no idea other than EB's statements to LE what happened, how, when , where or why. It would make sense to remove any knives from the home which may be suitable for dismembering a body. Remember, we did not have remains yet, but we did have EB telling in her letter to website owner that "what he did after was pretty disturbing" <--paraphrase as I don't recall the exact written sentence from letter.

That is not to say this knife was not used, it may well have been. But its removal during execution of search warrant alone is not enough to convince me that was indeed the implement used in dismemberment.

 

[hmmmisee]

I read in one of the warrants that hair and tissue , as well as tissue samples were removed from the wall. What method(s) of dismemberment could cause that?

 

[LCoastMom]

I read in one of the warrants that hair and tissue , as well as tissue samples were removed from the wall. What method(s) of dismemberment could cause that?

(Besides the power / chain saw) a small axe or any tool used in a swinging motion (up over the head and down) would leave all kinds of splatter.

(Not that I am saying this is the case) but even a bullet that passed thru a body and stopped in a wall, could leave tissue, blood, hair or bone.

I would think it is also possible to leave tissue, hair and blood from slamming someone against a wall.

Weren't the samples taken from the wall in Zahra's room and supposedly the dismembering happened in the bathtub?

Odd that there maybe two places where there are signs of this type of violence.

 

[Allusonz]

a hacksaw, does not need to be big, used it all the time butchering cows, pigs etc along with knives

 

[WhyaDuck?]

This thread is about determining the time of death. Please stay on topic.

(Post falls at random.)

 

[hmmmisee]

Sorry. My fault. I think that my thought process was: since the tissue samples were removed from the wall, is there is a difference between dismembering a person that died a day ago (24th after a 2 week illness) and someone just killed ( on 25th after a store sighting), in regards to the spatter? The method seems that it would be different based on the state of the body. Which, I think goes back to the dates that EB gave. The body has to go thru rigor and back. Would the state of the body (bodily fluids, blood, breakdown) effect the spatter? Or am I confusing myself?

 

[wenwe4]

I realize that NC doesn't have the "Sunshine Laws" that FL does, but shouldn't we be hearing the Medical Examiner's report sometime soon? The cause and manner of death as well as the time period of the death should be given. Would they wait until they take someone to trail before that info would come out?

 

[LCoastMom]

I realize that NC doesn't have the "Sunshine Laws" that FL does, but shouldn't we be hearing the Medical Examiner's report sometime soon? The cause and manner of death as well as the time period of the death should be given. Would they wait until they take someone to trail before that info would come out?

That may or may not be revealed before toxicology, which can take months. With body parts scattered all over, not found for almost two months and quite possibly incomplete - they may not know the answers to many of our questions.

I'm not counting on EB's answers being truthful in any of this - why dismember / discard if Zahra died from natural causes? Why freak out if she died from illness? Why not take her to a doctor if she was ill? Makes no sense, the only thing that does make sense is she was covering up a crime.

 

[Allusonz]

Sorry. My fault. I think that my thought process was: since the tissue samples were removed from the wall, is there is a difference between dismembering a person that died a day ago (24th after a 2 week illness) and someone just killed ( on 25th after a store sighting), in regards to the spatter? The method seems that it would be different based on the state of the body. Which, I think goes back to the dates that EB gave. The body has to go thru rigor and back. Would the state of the body (bodily fluids, blood, breakdown) effect the spatter? Or am I confusing myself?

no you are not confusing yourself i was following your train of thought just did not post how that could affect the tod in the post so it was me actually that took it off thread so let me clarify

in my experience with respect to butchering animals like cows etc the tools we used were a small hacksaw and knives which i believe would be helpful with respect to both cod and tod

they did bring in a blood splatter expert and i am thinking it was for this purpose and i do apologize for not making my post clearer

 

[WhyaDuck?]

Here's the "Cause of Death" thread, in case people are interested:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119664"]Zahra Baker's Possible Cause(s) of Death - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[westsidefox64]

? can they get a TOD from the blood splatter and tissue they took? It makes sense that it would continue to decompose but if its painted over would that change the decomp?

 

[tlcya]

<mod snip>
I am not sure what effect those assumed cleanup/coverup efforts would have had on the blood/tissue but I am imagining they would interfere with ascertaining TOD by those samples. That is just my own supositions.

 

[believe09]

this thread is regarding Time Of Death.

WhyADuck has kindly bumped the threads that concern Cause of Death etc.

Please stay on topic-TIA!!!

 

[ynotdivein]

I wish we had done a poll for this thread:

TOD was Sept. 22 (perhaps linked to a ritual of some kind)
TOD was Sept. 24 (as Elisa says)
TOD was sometime the week before Oct. 9 (as AB says)
TOD is the topic here, dangit! (as the mods say)

:blowkiss: to our VPMs (very patient mods)

 

[LCoastMom]

I'm sorry - I don't mean to wonder from the TOD - there are so many questions unanswered - time, manner, WTH anyone would do this, etc, etc, that it is all a blur - I'll go back to lurking in the Zahra forum.

I agree YNot, they are great mods and very patient. :blowkiss:

 

[tlcya]

Sorry Ducky and Believe09, my post #76 was an attempt to drag things back on topic.

 

[hmmmisee]

I posted this in another area, but I am still wondering about the cell phone pings. The pings only show that the phone was in the area, not who was using it. If AB and EB were together, maybe they were only using her phone. Does he have an alibi for the 25th? Where was he while his daughter was dying and being dismembered all over the house ? Didn't he play the video game? Maybe they were practicing, no offense meant.