Cincinnati Zoo kills gorilla after child gets into his cage, May 28, 2016

[sonjay]

They should at leaat plant bushes with thorns.

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Can you post a msm link where it states the bushes don't have thorns?

 

[DexterMorgan]

I hope they're not planning a family vacation to the Grand Canyon anytime soon.

Lol. Bring your own net . Lol.

 

[DexterMorgan]

Ok ...

I think zoos should be banned, unless it's some sort of wildlife park for endangered or harmed animals to be taken care of.

But, of course, this will never happen because of the millions made off visitors.

Come on. I'm sure you have pictures or memories of you or family having a good time at the zoo.

So others should have the experience as well. We can't all fly out to the jungle to see big cats and other exotic animals.

Plus some animals come in malnourished or damaged and are treated there. Jmo

 

[SophieRose]

Can you post a msm link where it states the bushes don't have thorns?

Can you post a link that states the bushes have thorns? I've only read a 3-ft fence with about 4 feet of bushes to the edge, and then a 15 foot drop to a moat filled with about 18 inches of water. I have read that lots of zoos do have thorny bushes around their exhibits, just haven't read that on this one.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

So I guess you're saying he didn't purposefully jump down a 15 foot cement embankment?

No. I'm simply saying he's a three year old child. Three year olds tend to be impulsive, do not have a full understanding of the world, and are certainly far too young to think through the consequences of their actions. I'm not convinced that whether he intentionally went through the barrier really means anything. Whether he wanted to play in the water, or wanted to play with the gorillas, or was chasing a butterfly or playing hide and seek, he was being a three year old. It should not have been possible for him to get through the barrier.

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[abstr]

So I guess you're saying he didn't purposefully jump down a 15 foot cement embankment?

We are talking about a 4 yo boy. We hear all the time how an 18 yo man has not fully developed his brain as far as danger....yet we are saying this kid is at fault. Kids are curious. I wish he had been stopped before he got in. I wish the Zoo had proper barriers. I wish it never happened and no animal had to be killed.....

ETA...a 3 yo....I just watched a morning news story that said he was 4.....sorry.

 

[jjenny]

We are talking about a 4 yo boy. We hear all the time how an 18 yo man has not fully developed his brain as far as danger....yet we are saying this kid is at fault. Kids are curious. I wish he had been stopped before he got in. I wish the Zoo had proper barriers. I wish it never happened and no animal had to be killed.....

ETA...a 3 yo....I just watched a morning news story that said he was 4.....sorry.

In 38 years, there had to be numerous 3 year olds that went to the gorilla exhibit. None of them ended up inside the enclosure.

 

[jjenny]

The link has video of Harambe as a young gorilla. He clearly was used to human contact.

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2016/...nt-a-very-gentle-picture-of-the-slain-gorilla

 

[sonjay]

Can you post a link that states the bushes have thorns? I've only read a 3-ft fence with about 4 feet of bushes to the edge, and then a 15 foot drop to a moat filled with about 18 inches of water. I have read that lots of zoos do have thorny bushes around their exhibits, just haven't read that on this one.

I didn't say that the bushes do or do not have thorns. Coyote asserted that they don't. I've seen no report either way, so I'm asking Coyote where he/she got that information.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

The link has video of Harambe as a young gorilla. He clearly was used to human contact.

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2016/...nt-a-very-gentle-picture-of-the-slain-gorilla

Sure... many animals are handled as juveniles... gorillas, lions, tigers, bears, rhinos, bulls... And after they mature, many of these animals don't respond to people the same way and can no longer be handled. And zoos generally minimize handling of the animals. I don't think we can rely on a video of interactions with a juvenile gorilla to predict how that animal will respond as an adult.

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[sonjay]

No. I'm simply saying he's a three year old child. Three year olds tend to be impulsive, do not have a full understanding of the world, and are certainly far too young to think through the consequences of their actions. I'm not convinced that whether he intentionally went through the barrier really means anything. Whether he wanted to play in the water, or wanted to play with the gorillas, or was chasing a butterfly or playing hide and seek, he was being a three year old. It should not have been possible for him to get through the barrier.

That's why parents or 3-year-olds have to be attentive at all times. I find it shocking that the mother didn't know it was her own child that went into the moat. He had announced his intention to her at least twice, yet she was surprised when he did exactly what he said he was going to do.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

I didn't say that the bushes do or do not have thorns. Coyote asserted that they don't. I've seen no report either way, so I'm asking Coyote where he/she got that information.

Actually, I was making a joke... it was late and I neglected to put lol or otherwise make that clear, and now it's too late to edit. My apologies for being unclear.



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[sonjay]

Sure... many animals are handled as juveniles... gorillas, lions, tigers, bears, rhinos, bulls... And after they mature, many of these animals don't respond to people the same way and can no longer be handled. And zoos generally minimize handling of the animals. I don't think we can rely on a video of interactions with a juvenile gorilla to predict how that animal will respond as an adult.

I do have to agree with Coyote on this point. Once an animal reaches sexual maturity, all bets are off. Even the highly domesticated dog develops different behaviors at sexual maturity. Just cause you trusted your pit bull puppy with your baby, it doesn't mean you should trust your now-grown pit bull adult intact male with your baby.

 

[jjenny]

I do have to agree with Coyote on this point. Once an animal reaches sexual maturity, all bets are off. Even the highly domesticated dog develops different behaviors at sexual maturity. Just cause you trusted your pit bull puppy with your baby, it doesn't mean you should trust your now-grown pit bull adult intact male with your baby.

I am not suggesting he should have been used as a babysitter. Furthermore, he hasn't even reached sexual maturity as he wasn't even breeding yet. (per the zoo director).

 

[Mrs G Norris]

I am not suggesting he should have been used as a babysitter. Furthermore, he hasn't even reached sexual maturity as he wasn't even breeding yet. (per the zoo director).

A 17 year old Harambe was a much more dangerous animal than he was as a little one though, that's the point.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Furthermore, he hasn't even reached sexual maturity as he wasn't even breeding yet. (per the zoo director).

RSBM

I don't understand this. He was 17, right? He certainly was considered an adult, and it seems he was past the typical age of sexually maturity from what I've found (see links below). Odd.

http://pin.primate.wisc.edu/factsheets/entry/gorilla/behav

It is more difficult to assess male reproductive maturity because they can be fertile before exhibiting secondary sexual characteristics (the silver saddle that characterizes adult males). Males between eight and 12 years are called blackbacks (Robbins 2001). In captivity, though, males can sire offspring by the age of six (Stoinski pers. comm.). Usually by age 12 or 13, males can be considered silverbacks, but most will not reach their full adult size until the age of 15 (Czekala & Robbins 2001).

https://nationalzoo.si.edu/animals/primates/facts/fact-gorilla.cfm

Due to competition between males for access to females, few wild males breed before they reach 15 years old. ...

http://www.gorillas-world.com/gorilla-reproduction/

Gorilla males are ready to mate when they are approximately 15 years of age. For females it is about 8 years of age. What is very interesting is that those in captivity seem to be ready to mate a couple of years earlier than those in the wild.

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[sonjay]

I am not suggesting he should have been used as a babysitter. Furthermore, he hasn't even reached sexual maturity as he wasn't even breeding yet. (per the zoo director).

A 17 year old Harambe was a much more dangerous animal than he was as a little one though, that's the point.

Yes, exactly so, he was much more dangerous, and at 17 he was likely entering or partway through puberty:

Males mature later than the females and are rarely strong and dominant enough to reproduce before 15 to 20 years of age.
https://seaworld.org/en/animal-info/animal-infobooks/gorilla/reproduction

 

[jjenny]

A 17 year old Harambe was a much more dangerous animal than he was as a little one though, that's the point.

If he wanted to kill the kid, he had plenty of time.But he didn't. I don't agree that they had to kill him (not at all). He was agitated by people screaming. Once these screaming people were removed, he would have most likely calmed down. Then (per some experts) zoo could have offered him his favorite food so he would give up the child.

 

[jjenny]

RSBM

I don't understand this. He was 17, right? He certainly was considered an adult, and it seems he was past the typical age of sexually maturity from what I've found (see links below). Odd.

http://pin.primate.wisc.edu/factsheets/entry/gorilla/behav

It is more difficult to assess male reproductive maturity because they can be fertile before exhibiting secondary sexual characteristics (the silver saddle that characterizes adult males). Males between eight and 12 years are called blackbacks (Robbins 2001). In captivity, though, males can sire offspring by the age of six (Stoinski pers. comm.). Usually by age 12 or 13, males can be considered silverbacks, but most will not reach their full adult size until the age of 15 (Czekala & Robbins 2001).

https://nationalzoo.si.edu/animals/primates/facts/fact-gorilla.cfm

Due to competition between males for access to females, few wild males breed before they reach 15 years old. ...

http://www.gorillas-world.com/gorilla-reproduction/

Gorilla males are ready to mate when they are approximately 15 years of age. For females it is about 8 years of age. What is very interesting is that those in captivity seem to be ready to mate a couple of years earlier than those in the wild.

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No, it doesn't seem that. 15-20 years is the range, and he was 17.

 

[sonjay]

If he wanted to kill the kid, he had plenty of time.But he didn't. I don't agree that they had to kill him (not at all). He was agitated by people screaming. Once these screaming people were removed, he would have most likely calmed down. Then (per some experts) zoo could have offered him his favorite food so he would give up the child.

And meanwhile, while the screaming people are being removed, Harambe is swinging the child around by its leg the way a mischievous boy swings his little sister's doll. It wasn't necessary that Harambe have any intent to harm the boy for very serious injuries (or death) to occur.

Sadly, once the inattentive mom allowed her child to enter the enclosure, Harambe's fate was sealed.