CO - Jessica Hernandez, 17, killed by police after LEO struck by stolen car

[Deleted member 39678]

Yet avoid it he did. He dodged a car that can't have been traveling more than 5mph and then shot the driver in a fit of rage.

I haven't seen any evidence that the car was only going 5 mph or that the officers shot Jessica in a "fit of rage".

It's clear to me that a car running someone over at any speed would easily cause severe injuries. Thus the officers acted within the law. JMO.

 

[Fred Hall]

You are looking at it like it was a 17 yr old girl, driving slow, no threat, but they just shot because they are monsters. JMO

sbm
If reports of their post-shooting acts are true, I certainly consider them to be monsters. It would have been instantly obvious to them that they had fired on a car full of girls, and they should have given first aid to the driver, or at least refrained from further assaulting her. If they had done so, I would be much more willing to believe that they opened fire due to poor judgement.

 

[LonghornSpeakEasy]

Sorry, I wasn't trying to put words into your mouth — I was just trying prompt a direct answer. You may decline to discuss my hypothetical situation, which is fine, but I don't believe that one can say "IT DOES NOT MATTER". Whether or not a non-police officer would be charged in an identical shooting is a perfectly legitimate and relevant question.

We're going to have to agree to disagree here as I believe it has no relevance.

I'm gonna regret this, but do you think I should get a ticket for driving 80 mph in a 55 mph if I say "well, I was following a suspected drunk driver" to try to stop them? There are different rules for LE for good reason.

 

[katydid23]

sbm
If reports of their post-shooting acts are true, I certainly consider them to be monsters. It would have been instantly obvious to them that they had fired on a car full of girls, and they should have given first aid to the driver, or at least refrained from further assaulting her. If they had done so, I would be much more willing to believe that they opened fire due to poor judgement.

In most precincts, cops are not allowed to do any thing medically related, unless they are trained EMTs. There is probably nothing they could have done at that point anyway. It is interesting to hesr you finally admitting that you think they are monsters though. :wink:

 

[Woodland]

I haven't seen any evidence that the car was only going 5 mph or that the officers shot Jessica in a "fit of rage".

It's clear to me that a car running someone over at any speed would easily cause severe injuries. Thus the officers acted within the law. JMO.

Page 16 of the DA letter - Traffic Investigation Unit summary

The distance traveled by the Honda after damaging the fence to where it came to rest was approximately 16 feet.

16 feet from a dead stop - and according to officer DG, page 7 - The vehicle then came to a stop, almost rolled to a stop.

 

[LonghornSpeakEasy]

sbm
And he proceeded to shoot the driver after he had successfully jumped out of the way. Whether or not that act was excusable is a question a jury should have decided, as a DA is bound to prosecute according to a precise interpretation of the law. Here is a question — do you think district attorneys might have a conflict of interest when investigating the acts of police officers?

Without putting a lot of thought into it (sorry, I'm just tired), my gut reaction is that we should have an independent type of review board for officer-involved shootings. I think it is very important how they are formed, however, i.e., that the members are qualified not politicized. My cynical nature doubts they will do a lot to stop protests or the current conflicts.

 

[Fred Hall]

I haven't seen any evidence that the car was only going 5 mph or that the officers shot Jessica in a "fit of rage".

It's clear to me that a car running someone over at any speed would easily cause severe injuries. Thus the officers acted within the law. JMO.

Yes, 5mph is just my personal guess. But I have to guess, because the decision letter declines to state the maximum possible speed the car could have been traveling at the instant it was fired upon. If the officer was in front of the car when he fired he might have had a legitimate fear of being run over. However, the bullet angles place him beside the front wheel.

 

[Woodland]

Is it possible for a more computer saavy person to post the following?

Pic on page 47, post #1157 is from the letter page 37. It has markers in the windshield bullet holes - extreme rust is visible in the hole in the metal. Can this be posted side by side with last pic on page 35? That pic does not have the markers and the rust. Imo, the red marker (or straw) is in the wrong position. Pics have been taken with a time span for rust to appear. Tia!

 

[Fred Hall]

Without putting a lot of thought into it (sorry, I'm just tired), my gut reaction is that we should have an independent type of review board for officer-involved shootings. I think it is very important how they are formed, however, i.e., that the members are qualified not politicized. My cynical nature doubts they will do a lot to stop protests or the current conflicts.

I agree with you on all points

 

[Woodland]

He did not shoot AFTER he jumped out of the way....the act of shooting was AS HE JUMPED OUT OF THE WAY. And that few inches and split second timing is what protects him from a murder wrap. JMO

Could you post a link to this conclusion as requested by SB when this report was released? I don't see that anywhere.

 

[Woodland]

He was not 'hit' by the car because he took evasive actions. If not, he would have been hit and pinned against the brick wall. He saved himself within inches and seconds to spare. So it was a life threatening situation and it is astounding that people keep trying to deny that.

Not according to the statements vs evidence. Lets agree to be astounded.

 

[Fred Hall]

Is it possible for a more computer saavy person to post the following?

Pic on page 47, post #1157 is from the letter page 37. It has markers in the windshield bullet holes - extreme rust is visible in the hole in the metal. Can this be posted side by side with last pic on page 35? That pic does not have the markers and the rust. Imo, the red marker (or straw) is in the wrong position. Pics have been taken with a time span for rust to appear. Tia!

 

[Woodland]

I haven't seen any evidence that the car was only going 5 mph or that the officers shot Jessica in a "fit of rage".

It's clear to me that a car running someone over at any speed would easily cause severe injuries. Thus the officers acted within the law. JMO.

GJ was not run over - according to GJ.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Page 16 of the DA letter - Traffic Investigation Unit summary

The distance traveled by the Honda after damaging the fence to where it came to rest was approximately 16 feet.

16 feet from a dead stop - and according to officer DG, page 7 - The vehicle then came to a stop, almost rolled to a stop.

I'm not sure how this quote relates to my post.

 

[LonghornSpeakEasy]

Is it possible for a more computer saavy person to post the following?

Pic on page 47, post #1157 is from the letter page 37. It has markers in the windshield bullet holes - extreme rust is visible in the hole in the metal. Can this be posted side by side with last pic on page 35? That pic does not have the markers and the rust. Imo, the red marker (or straw) is in the wrong position. Pics have been taken with a time span for rust to appear. Tia!

I just spent 20 minutes trying to figure out how to post the picture on page 37 and gave up! Glad there are more computer-savy people on this thread!

 

[Fred Hall]

In most precincts, cops are not allowed to do any thing medically related, unless they are trained EMTs. There is probably nothing they could have done at that point anyway. It is interesting to hesr you finally admitting that you think they are monsters though. :wink:

I have previously stated that I consider their alleged post-shooting behavior to be psychopathic.

 

[katydid23]

Could you post a link to this conclusion as requested by SB when this report was released? I don't see that anywhere.

I am not sure which conclusion you are referring to. That he shot AS he was jumping out of the way? That is how I interpret the officer's words:

He described shooting, having only his right hand on the gun, when he was at the front fender on the driver side, pushing away from the car with his left hand:

“I waited till I had to hit the car away and I’m thinking now I’m going to go -- I’m going to get squished and -- and killed, and right then is when I fired. And...I’d be surprised if my gun wasn’t touching the driver’s side -- the window.”

 

[katydid23]

I have previously stated that I consider their alleged post-shooting behavior to be psychopathic.

Not everyone agrees, apparently.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Police officers can shoot a fleeing suspect if he or she feels that the suspect is going to cause "serious physical injury" to anyone. That sounds like what we have in this case.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_v._Garner

GJ was not run over - according to GJ.

They don't have to be "run over" for officers to use deadly force.

 

[LonghornSpeakEasy]

Is it possible for a more computer saavy person to post the following?

Pic on page 47, post #1157 is from the letter page 37. It has markers in the windshield bullet holes - extreme rust is visible in the hole in the metal. Can this be posted side by side with last pic on page 35? That pic does not have the markers and the rust. Imo, the red marker (or straw) is in the wrong position. Pics have been taken with a time span for rust to appear. Tia!

The "straws" in the windshield go through the bullet holes in the windshield to the places in the car where the bullets struck so they are at the right angle.

...two bullets pierced the lower front windshield and struck the interior dashboard in an area very close to the windshield; one bullet pierced the front windshield a few inches higher and then struck the interior of the car on the plastic housing of the steering wheel.