CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #10

[Footwarrior]

Also wondering if we ever found out who first spotted the remains and brougt LE out to that area? Maybe that has been discussed already? If it was an anonymous tip, then someone living on one of the houses on the hill theory would be more of a possibility.

The remains were found by workers picking up trash along the road. Probably the guys wearing light green safety vests in this photo.

This activity just west of Leyden is probably what the guy who called NG was seeing. The site where the body was found was about a mile further to the west. That spot is not visible from any of the homes in the area.

 

[SapphireSteel]

I´m with you 100%.

Two days ago I was looking, for hours, at that picture of the scenario/location the killer choose to place/pose part of little Jessica's body, and what came to my mind was; the killer is some kind of artist...a photographer?, a painter? or at least some kind of artistic perverted aesthetic.
(ironicly the WY/Cody photgrapher suspect, JS, popped out of nowere few hours later, and I was really chocked, especially due to that he was such a brilliant artist, some of his photographs almost Ansel Adams quality, and also his coice of motives indeed resembled the Jessica dumping location, he would have been a perfect match to the suspect I had in mind, a brilliant artist, but even sicker)

The scenario/location is desolated, yes, it's kind of creepy, or maybe more melancolic, secretive, mystical and in it's it own way bear a strange kind of beauty, especially the way the two trees, one living, one dead, the hills in the background with the ruin cabin, the sky above it all, by nature it's alltogether kind of composed into an alluring artistic picture.

This is of course all WITHOUT little Jessica's remains in it.

But that is IMHO possibly why the killer choose that very spot, it was possibley in his sick mind the perfect scene/stage for him to present "his (sick) work", and it would at the same time increase chock effect.

I belive, as I have posted before, that he also choose this area because it was isolated enough for him to not beeing cought, while dumping/posing the remains, and at the same time a perfect spot in order for "his (sick) work" soon to be presented/ found.

The fact that he dumped Jessica's backpack in a location where it would be found shortly after he placed it, IMO again point to that he in NO way want to hide his deeds.

The fact that he dismembered Jessica's body IMO has NOTHING to do with trying to hide her identity, insted I belive it is part of his fantasy/ritual.

I also belive that the killer has provided some kind of messages to the police, and I belive there are horrible circumstances concerning the way Jessica was killed and desecrated that the police have, so far, kept serect.


The killer is IMHO, under the surface, a:
psychopathic/sadistic/artistic /complicated/sophisticated/manipulating/perverted/attention-seeking person, who have the ability to blend in as a pretty normal person, and I do belive he has killed before.

Al just my humble opinion of course.

You and I think alike.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

The guy thinks he's an artist.

 

[Madeleine74]

There is someone who has a lot of interest in this case, but lives in another state and seems to have no family or friends from the area.

I think that describes the majority of WS members too. :waitasec:

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Ok,concerning the first guy on this link(The older guy)Does anyone know of the attempted abuctions? How many attempted abductions,boys or girls?Any news paper articles on them? Little Jessica's body was found in Arvada so I'll look into this other guy now.

https://twitter.com/MissingCases/status/256904186422243329/photo/1/large

 

[DeAnn]

When I heard "not intact" I immediately thought of a coyote. I live east of the JR area and we have a big coyote problem and sometimes a fox problem in our populated suburban neighborhood.

Over the years the coyotes have killed many small pets, dogs and cats and supposedly bit a neighbor. A few summers ago people were finding "mutilated" cats and neighbors were out to find this cat killer. But it turned out to be coyotes. Another neighborhood in the Denver metro area was reporting mutilated cats recently and that too turned out to be coyotes.

It's just another possibility. Coyotes and foxes can make some serious mayhem. They get into the trash and fight over the occasional squashed squirrel/rabbit in the street at night.

Reporters don't use the words that they are in this case if it were animals. The Denver newsrooms saw the body parts from their news choppers. They have talked about gruesome scenes and having to be careful about the photos used. Police would ask for a correction on "dismembered" etc if it were animals.

 

[carbuff]

The remains were found by workers picking up trash along the road. Probably the guys wearing light green safety vests in this photo.

This activity just west of Leyden is probably what the guy who called NG was seeing. The site where the body was found was about a mile further to the west. That spot is not visible from any of the homes in the area.

Yeah, but he described a number of things that were only at the crime site, including the fire truck and boom.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Kansas did not pass the law allowing concealed carry of hand guns until 2006. The first permits were not issued until January 2007.

457 is not a lot considering the number of people who legally carry concealed weapons in the US and aren't acquiring CHLs for nefarious reasons.

It's God knows how many kids without a parent though. Or parents without a kid.

457 too many.

I wish America would get past their fascination for killing sticks. The violence in your society is just getting too much.

Guns contribute to crime, even if they don't shoot people directly. Look at the Wy abductor, she would have got away but he pointed a gun at her.

:banghead:

My opinion only as usual...and not intended to start a wild gun debate. Just pointing out - what came first, the guns or the violence?

:dunno:

:cow:

 

[scorekeeper]

I'm still reading every post, anxious for new news.

MOO regarding the "not intact", while it could be animals, usually this is phrases by LE as "not able to quickly identify due to exposure and scavengers" or "damage due to being left in the elements". I think to say the remains were discovered "not intact" does imply that part of the crime includes causing the body to no longer be intact.
*GRAPHIC BELOW*
That could mean missing one limb, that could mean missing all limbs, that could mean skillfully dissected. From what the helicopter footage supposedly showed, my best assumption is that not intact means cut into several large parts. -did LE say some part or parts were nit recivered? The question IMO is the not intact remains being dumped as a whole in a reasonably semi-public area. I would think a bag of not intact remains would be best hidden by being thrown in win garbage, but maybe there was fear or cameras near commercial dumpsters. But if this open space was close enough to a garbage site to require waste management clean up the blown away trash, then why not just dump there? Camera fear?

BBM

Perhaps, he knew this and wanted the workers to find her???

I'm a couple pages behind, so if this has been brought up, sorry

 

[nursebeeme]

did someone just ask for social media rulz? here they are:

Social Networks

Regarding Facebook, MySpace, Twitter, and other social networking or blog websites: Links may be used to direct posters to view something on a social networking page. But postings on social networking sites are not considered fact; they are rumor. Copying and pasting, or taking screen caps, directly from these pages is not allowed. Paraphrasing is okay. (Exception: If the Twitter or Facebook post belongs to a verified news station, it may be copied. But a link should still be provided.)

Also, social networking pages may only be linked if they are directly related to a case, i.e. the victim or suspect. We don't want to post to someone's mother, brother, employer, milkman, or postal carrier just because they know the main player. We also NEVER link to minor's pages (unless they are the victim). And be sure that the page actually belongs to the person being discussed. Do not link to someone if you are not 100% sure it is the correct person. And if a social networking is set to private and you get in the back way, you may not post what you find. Private means private!

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8364858#post8364858"]Rules Etiquette & Information - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[jackjester]

First time poster, been lurking for some time, and have a point of clarification and a bit of information I have not seen yet in this thread.

1. It was suggested by Otto that some one might have driven around the loop of roads off of 82nd to hide their car, etc. This is not possible as there are gates at both entrances to these dirt roads.

2. No one has pointed out the fact that the backpack was found just a few 'feet' from the former home of a mother who suffocated her newborn... Stephanie Rochester.
This reporter seems to be the only one who has picked up on this detail (at the end of the article):
http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_2...ca-ridgeway-moves-superior-backpack-discovery

This story was heartbreaking in the Boulder area and received some metro attention, but not much out side of the area. I cannot help but wonder if the backpack location is more than just coincidental....

 

[SapphireSteel]

In thinking about altering a body so it's not intact, I think it's done for the convenience or need of the perp. If a perp is going to leave a body (or body parts) out in the open where they can be discovered, he's not that concerned with someone IDing the remains. Anyone who's been on this planet during the last 20 years knows about DNA testing and that it can be done on any body part or tissue or even just bone.

No, this is about him. He took the extra step to dismember the remains, which is extra work and holds a risk of additional forensic evidence getting on him, or his vehicle, or his home/apartment. He'd want to obscure or get rid of evidence that might tie him to the murder. Also, as others have said, it's less conspicuous to be carrying a bag or maybe more than 1 bag, than trying to carry/conceal a person.

Ease of removal, ease of disposal, hide or obscure possible physical evidence that might link to him. I think that's what this may be about.

Then why display the body? If he wished to hide evidence, he would also hide the body. Colorado is a big place.

It's not consistent.

It's like he's giving the finger to LE.

:cow:

:waitasec:

 

[nursebeeme]

welcome to websleuths jackjester! :cheer:

we are so glad to have you!

 

[iamnotagolem]

It's God knows how many kids without a parent though. Or parents without a kid.

457 too many.

I wish America would get past their fascination for killing sticks. The violence in your society is just getting too much.

Guns contribute to crime, even if they don't shoot people directly. Look at the Wy abductor, she would have got away but he pointed a gun at her.

:banghead:

My opinion only as usual...and not intended to start a wild gun debate. Just pointing out - what came first, the guns or the violence?

:dunno:

:cow:

Cain killed Abel with a rock. Europe has plenty of violence, they just use knives because they can't guns. Guns don't make people bad, bad people use what they have access to.

 

[neverletgo]

The "child enticements" are among hundreds of leads being investigated in the wake of the Ridgeway case. <snipped>

Source: http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20639202,00.html

 

[NC Analyzer]

Then why display the body? If he wished to hide evidence, he would also hide the body. Colorado is a big place.

It's not consistent.

It's like he's giving the finger to LE.

:cow:

:waitasec:

I believe the poster was referring to concealing the remains while transporting the body to the dump site...not concealing the identity of the remains. It is much easier to transport a non-descript trash bag as opposed to transporting a whole body.

We also don't know for sure that the body was displayed. It could just as easily have been placed in the culvert and later dragged out by animals in the area.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Cain killed Abel with a rock. Europe has plenty of violence, they just use knives because they can't guns. Guns don't make people bad, bad people use what they have access to.

You are so right!

Toddlers don't burn down the house if they aren't left alone with matches.

It is up to the more responsible people to ensure temptation is out of their grasp.

It's not the guns per se, it's the gun laws that I have issues with.

Every toddler can just go and buy as many matches as he wants.

:banghead:

 

[alexandra]

I have a few thoughts I'd like to bounce off everyone. And my thoughts assume remains were intentionally put in the condition they were found, not by animal activity.

1. the abduction - perp has his/her own vehicle, unless it's someone that lives on Jessica's route to school and he/she lured her into to the house/garage. An exception would be someone who drives a company type vehicle: i.e. delivery truck, school bus, carpeting, utility company, etc.

2. Because of the condition of the remains, perp needs a secondary location as I doubt he would be able to accomplish "dissection" in a vehicle. It's also difficult to think that the perp went to the trouble of dissection unless it was absolutely necessary for the disposal of the remains. It would be necessary if the perp lived in an apt building for instance and he would have been seen carrying a body size object out of the building. But, I also don't see how the perp would have gotten her into the apartment building without the same concern. So that leads me to think they either have a home or a facility to take her to. I can't see him taking her to an outside location to do all of this, but I suppose it's a remote possibility. If he could take her to a warehouse for instance, why would he not be able to get her out of the warehouse without being seen? What really puzzles me at this stage is if he was able to get her into a location without being seen, why then couldn't he get her out without being seen?? So, why else would he dissect the body if not for the fear of being seen? What if he didn't have the use of a vehicle after the initial abduction? Perhaps his vehicle broke down, or perhaps he drives a company type vehicle for work and either walks or bikes (or motorcycle) back and forth to the job. If the only way he can dispose of the body is by foot or bike, that would make it necessary to dissect the body into more manageable parcels...sorry

I do not subscribe to the theory that he modified the remains to make identification more difficult. Why would he go to all of the trouble to do that and then deposit partial remains right along side the road? It didn't matter if it took police longer to make a positive ID because of it....what benefit would he have gained from that? Cops were outl looking for a perpetrator from the moment Jessica was reported missing. If cops made a ID from the 1st moment the remains were discovered or 2 to 3 days later, I see no advantage for the perp in the 2 or 3 days scenario. Everyone knew it was JR's remains...but to be 100% sure they had to DNA test it. I see no benefit gained from modifying the remains other than for transport purposes.

3. Another issue that supports the no vehicle theory is....why didn't the perp just take the body further out of town and dispose of it in a body of water, dumpster, etc. etc? It may be true that he wanted her to be found....so then why not leave the body intact??

MOO

 

[absentia]

not unusual for vehicles to be there, but the neighbors saw suspicious vehicles they have not seen before, doing unusual things.

Judging from all the graffiti on the building, I'd say it's probably visited by teens.

Good point about people being used to seeing vehicles parked in the area.

 

[izzyblizzy]

Then why display the body? If he wished to hide evidence, he would also hide the body. Colorado is a big place.

It's not consistent.

It's like he's giving the finger to LE.

:cow:

:waitasec:

I agree. I think he is a BTK type killer (thought this since they found the backpack upright on the sidewalk). He is taunting LE. I think her body was probably missing her head (at least). And he is like "follow me to where I put the head ... this is fun for me!" (sicko). I also think he might get frustrated there is very limited coverage of *him* on local news right now.

I almost suspect that local news channels might have been told "hey don't give time to this off the top of news and give it minimal attention." I have noticed today they are starting off with more attention on the Colorado theater shootings and kind of burying the Jessica story. I think this might be to "piss him off" and they think he might do a "hey look at me!" move.

All just speculation and my opinion only, but that has been my sense of it.

 

[No Stone Unturned]

Just catching up on the thread am only on page 2 currently but wanted to chime in on my opinion of what a useful sexual offenders database is like.

In my home state of WV, you can go to the state police database and view all sexual offenders currently living in the state. You can search by name, street, city, county, or zip code.

The entry for each offender includes full name, gender, age, and current address.

More importantly each entry includes the conviction date and state where convicted, relationship of offender to the the victim (such as stranger or custodial parent), the age of the victim (in broad categories like Under 5, or 13 to 16), the gender of victim, the amount of time served in the prison sentence or probation, and a generalization of the sexual crime (1st degree sexual assault).