CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #15 *ARREST*

[BRRI]

I don't think he would hesitate using a tranquilizer. I am just wondering why he'd need to. ?

Yea it’s too much effort I think. No real need for it.

 

[susiQ]

I keep imagining him sitting in his cell thinking, "But I didn't talk! I didn't talk! I didn't talk like that loser Watts! "

Thanks for the chuckle

 

[BRRI]

But I don't see a hired hit man taking the time to clean up.

Unless the hired hit man was also a friend of PF. Not a true, professional hit man

 

[BRRI]

Gosh. So Chrissmasy here.

Where are the ‘buns?

 

[SuperTmo]

On the horse tranquilizers, he might have used them, but I don't go with the theory of him having them to calm horses while working on his feet. There are other ways to hold a horse still and keep them from kicking. The way we used was have the horse step in a rope loop with his back foot. Lift the rope and foot and tie so the horse is standing on ONE hind foot. They can't kick with the other foot because they are using it to stand. It doesn't hurt the horse, and it keeps the farrier safe and the horse is still. Some people use twitches which I never liked.

After shoeing our pony, Dude, the farrier always lunged him to make sure he wasn’t stepping funny. This would have been impossible if Dude had even a mild sedative. He had to have a rectal biopsy once and even with a mild sedative which didn’t make him fall asleep, he had to be physically supported to stand upright and couldn’t walk for a few hours because he was so loopy.

 

[MyBelle]

Considering how cocky he was, wouldn't sit with police for an interview, didn't report her missing, didn't even attempt to look innocent..I think wherever her remains are they'll never be found unless he tells someone. I think he's so sure she'll never be found is why he's so all fire sure he'll never be charged with her murder. He must have thought without a body he couldn't be prosecuted, and he couldn't be more wrong if he tried. I also think he planned this for months, I think he poisoned his family against her and I think they fell for his story just like her aunt did.

I think PF is so incredibly narcissistic and arrogant that he really believed all he had to do to escape detection was avoid the obvious mistakes Chris Watts made. Watts did multiple media interviews, left purse and cell phone in the house, cooperated with police and disposed of the bodies at his work site.

It's all about control and manipulation with guys like them and it often involves physically separating the victim from her support system. Shanann moved over a thousand miles from her family, so did Kelsey and so did our daughter. Husbands of all three also had someone toxic interfering in their relationship. It is a recipe for disaster.

JMO

 

[BRRI]

My point is, why bother cleaning up if someone else did it? You're getting someone else to do the dirty deed to give yourself an alibi and then YOU go back and risk getting spotted there?

Part of the agreement maybe. It may not be a solicitation in the professional sense. It could have been him asking a friend to help him do it. Or something that’s not a normal textbook murder for hire.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

I don't think he drove 700 miles. Most likely not so far away, but he wanted them hunting around Gooding.

If he was trying to set a scene of something happening to her on her way to a surprise visit at grandma's, he made a major goof in leaving both her vehicles in place. The idea of her hitching a ride, renting or borrowing a car just makes no sense and I can't imagine how he thought that would be a believable story.

 

[BRRI]

I think PF is so incredibly narcissistic and arrogant that he really believed all he had to do to escape detection was avoid the obvious mistakes Chris Watts made. Watts did multiple media interviews, left purse and cell phone in the house, cooperated with police and disposed of the bodies at his work site.

It's all about control and manipulation with guys like them and it often involves physically separating the victim from her support system. Shanann moved over a thousand miles from her family, so did Kelsey and so did our daughter. Husbands of all three also had someone toxic interfering in their relationship. It is a recipe for disaster.

JMO

Goodness though CW was dumb. So, so dumb. I would think most people would intrinsically be smarter than he was. Though I guess you never know how dumb they will be.

 

[EmilyVan]

If he was trying to set a scene of something happening to her on her way to a surprise visit at grandma's, he made a major goof in leaving both her vehicles in place. The idea of her hitching a ride, renting or borrowing a car just makes no sense and I can't imagine how he thought that would be a believable story.

can't expect much more from a 30+ year old who has never lived away from mommy

 

[NanZDrew]

If he was trying to set a scene of something happening to her on her way to a surprise visit at grandma's, he made a major goof in leaving both her vehicles in place. The idea of her hitching a ride, renting or borrowing a car just makes no sense and I can't imagine how he thought that would be a believable story.

Let's say this is where that other car came in that showed up later that day. The hit man's car aka her new man.

 

[tmar]

Thank you tmar, that is very kind.

I just want to note that I am only here on Websleuths.
If you see someone copying my posts to other sites, it is not me posting.

I do like to make lists of facts we know and timelines for many case threads here on WS though.

I meant only on Websleuths.
I have noted your hard work constantly.
Often your info provided more detail for me to explore, and look at other cases.
Thank you.

 

[NanZDrew]

So I just saw another picture of Cheryl, Kelsey, and Baby K taken the same day as the other photo. The baby is smiling. There are trees with yellow leaves in the background. This tells me that either Kelsey and baby recently visited Cheryl or vice versa. I think this is great, because CB is not a stranger to the baby although they forget you pretty quickly. The picture is adorable. MSM should pick it up pretty soon. Don't want to violate TOS.

 

[susiQ]

Unless the hired hit man was also a friend of PF. Not a true, professional hit man

I just think he did it himself.
Float this (maybe someone has already posted this)
KB baked those rolls for PF. Got a recipe from her mom in the morning. Went to Safeway to get the things she needed to prepare dinner for the "family". PF gets to KB's they talk, KB puts the baby down for a nap. He does the deed. He's got a suitcase in the back of the pick-up under a tarp. Get's the suitcase, packs her in, wheels her out and puts the suitcase in the back and puts the tarp over it. Starts his cleaning job. Baby wakes up, most of the mess is already wiped up and in bags. If he's not quite done, he corrals the baby with some toys and keeps on cleaning. Cinnamon rolls remain on the stove. Finishes the cleaning, takes the baby to the truck runs back quickly for the trash and "Bob's your uncle" as a good friend used to say. Takes her to the ranch. Maybe that's why the dogs picked up a scent there. Leaves baby with mom, tells her he's going for a few beer, gets rid of her.
I could go on, but you get my drift It's just a theory like all the others. However, in this one, I have KB closer to home.
edit for spelling

 

[Steelslady]

Stupid question, but could he have used a horse trailer to transport her body to Idaho somewhere? No one would even think anything of seeing someone driving down any country roads with a horse trailer.

 

[Charlot123]

My son and his girlfriend lived here a year and a half before they h ok t their own place.
I'm not divorced though, I have never depended on my child to help me get by.
That's perhaps the difference.
Learned helplessness or not letting the last son leave the nest because of dome co- dependent stuff?
I don't know.
**** and I'm not saying that is what went on with the mom either!!!
Just thinking of possiblities.
Moo

Can we think of possibilities? I think the opposition to the marriage might have been coming from the farmside...

See, from your story, it follows that either you are very clever, or both you and your DIL are clever. It might also be that both you and your DIL have easy personalities. (Or at least one of you must).

With Patrick, I can only guess what his mom's personality is. He is the youngest one. Likely, the closest one. In other countries who takes care of the parents is determined by the tradition (I know in India it is the oldest son).

But in the US, that is not determined. So in this case, the older kids left the farm, and the younger one stayed to take care of the farm and the ailing mom. Maybe he liked it, or perhaps, it just happened.

One can hear, "when (my son) gets married, I shall leave the (business) to the young couple and move away". Only IRL mothers are often incredibly jealous of prospective brides, especially if the sons are "good" and especially if the sons are somewhat long in the teeth.

(In my family, my MIL was nice, but the hubby left parental house early. However, I have observed enough polite opposition between my paternal grandma and my mom. Usually it was in the form of reproaching dad of "distancing yourself from us" (i.e. his mom).)

The stronger the women, the worse the opposition.

But Kelsey, per all accounts, appeared to be very nice. Perhaps too nice. Why she didn't want to move to the farm is clear to me. So she did something that only a nice person would do - she shared raising the baby with PF and his mom.

One can be strong and nice. One could only guess the dynamics of the relationship had she not been nice. My guess is, PF would have moved into her house long ago.

But I can imagine that on the PF's mom's side, there might have been a fear, too. The son is ready to get married. The mother of his child lives 15 miles away. What if he moves in with her and they raise the kid together?

 

[susiQ]

Stupid question, but could he have used a horse trailer to transport her body to Idaho somewhere? No one would even think anything of seeing someone driving down any country roads with a horse trailer.

Possibly told his mother he was helping out a friend to transport a horse?

 

[jewelsmac]

Nobody ever said criminals were smart. Case in point.

so much this

 

[OldLadyBlues]

I'm beginning to think that KB was in over head in an abusive relationship and was trying to leave him as any abused woman finally does. Only I think she was trying to do it in a non confrontational way to protect she and the baby. IMHO, PF was showing signs of clear mental problems and probably had shown them for a long time, but her love for him and perhaps being naive was making her think she could change him; help him. It's hell being in that situation when you finally realize there is nothing you can do but leave. But it is notoriously dangerous, too. If PF sensed her leaving, paranoia alone sends him into planning how to stop her. Ergo, the the solicitation charge. But opportunity presented itself and his anger most likely took over. Whatever love he has for his daughter saved her.
I sadly agree that there most likely isn't a bathtub drain pipe left in the condo and flooring and drywall was removed for spatter. But I also don't think KB will be found until after spring thaw and that's just a **** shame.
MOO

 

[BRRI]

Is PF, really that stupid? He tells CB that KB was headed to grandma’s and she only leaves with her purse? Why not go to the trouble of packing a bag for her, he had plenty of time, make the “story” believable. Especially since you’re going to make her phone ping in Idaho. Then he goes to the dump right after they searched his residence? Do you think that maybe he’s not altogether upstairs? Maybe that’s why he also was looking for someone to do it for him? He’s got family in LE, you’d think he’d know better. Maybe that’s why he also never spoke to the press. I also remember a comment that KB’s family thought that he was odd or something like that. Maybe because he’s mentally challenged? Maybe KB figured that out after she moved to Colorado and another reason why they didn’t have plans to get married. Just a thought....I just can’t believe that someone in their right mind could be so evil and stupid at the same time.

Ugh you know, I think this way too...and then think about Casey Anthony.