CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #19 *ARREST*

[otto]

I got the impression he didn't make much money. Didn't he have very few cattle and just a few horses? A very small "ranch?" I missed a large part of that discussion several threads ago but from what I read that's what I gathered. Jmo

He was living on his mom's acreage (35AC), and she has two other properties. She is a retired nurse. There must be enough money in the family to afford a lifestyle of rodeo and hobby farming. My guess is that he qualifies for a court appointed lawyer because he wants to, not because he has to - as in: use other people's money when you can.

 

[SandyQLS]

Good to know. Even if they had someone they were interogating, (see Posts by: Nancy Grace, Publisher KB dec 28 min 27 and on), they are not releasing info on this case until they absolutely have to so I doubt tomorrow will be too exciting.

I think the judge might just be ruling on some of the open motions. We already know the arrest warrants will remain sealed. PF might not even appear, or just sit silently on video from the jail.

 

[Trudie]

He was living on his mom's acreage (35AC), and she has two other properties. She is a retired nurse. There must be enough money in the family to afford a lifestyle of rodeo and hobby farming. My guess is that he qualifies for a court appointed lawyer because he wants to, not because he has to - as in: use other people's money when you can.

This is what I think, too. He wants pro bono help.

On another note, I am guessing he’s most angry. If the solicitation charge is accurate, he knows the ID of the person that talked. I’m sure he’d like to swing a rope at him. MOO

 

[Marli61]

With CO stance on the death penalty what would be the benefit to him to talk. I think he’ll talk when he hears their offer.
I tend to think if they put the right kind of pressure on him and get him into a big city stressful jail, he’d be more apt to talk. That jail where he is now must surely be upsetting him, but he’s not going to crack/talk in that little town jail. I still want to know how heavily they are interrogating him on her whereabouts.

The benefit may be to avoid a trial. I think that's why CW pleaded guilty. PF may feel confident enough to let it go to trial...who knows. They can only interrogate him with his lawyer present so it's hard telling what's going on there either.

 

[MsBetsy]

That sounds about right but I don't remember how it was determined that he owned the cattle. Do you remember? Is it possible that his mom owns the cattle just as she owns the property?
MOO

I'm not sure! I thought I remember there was some discussion about the authorities going there to remove the animals. Don't know if it actually happened though. Imo

 

[Gardener1850]

Not as I recall; that’s why I was shaking my head when I read PF had a “herd” of 35.

Could you possibly be thinking of the fake facebook account that someone set up? Someone made an account in his name with pictures of cattle on it and then started posting they were selling their "herd" off to raise money. The cattle pictures used were stock images from google. It was a hoax account.

 

[jaspermac]

This is what I think, too. He wants pro bono help.

On another note, I am guessing he’s most angry. If the solicitation charge is accurate, he knows the ID of the person that talked. I’m sure he’d like to swing a rope at him. MOO

The benefit may be to avoid a trial. I think that's why CW pleaded guilty. PF may feel confident enough to let it go to trial...who knows. They can only interrogate him with his lawyer present so it's hard telling what's going on there either.

Sometimes I wonder if (as a secondary reason) some of these guys go to trial to entertain themselves. To watch others go through more pain, to get to see the crime scene photos again. To ease the boredom of their life. The ones that fess up, I have to at least give them credit for that.

 

[KBB87]

First time poster here. I believe WS’s ToS allow me to share the link below which provides lots of good information on 18-2-301 (1) C.R.S, Colorado’s Felony Solicitation law. As an example:

“Verbally soliciting a crime is not enough. There must be additional evidence of circumstances that show you had the specific intent to promote or facilitate that crime. (For) example: One night Lenny and Mickey are having a beer, when Lenny says to Mickey, “What do you say we kill my wife? That woman needs to die.” Without anything further, Lenny is guilty of nothing more than blowing off steam. But... let's say that after Lenny's wife gets killed, the police discover a history of Google queries on Lenny's computer asking the going rate for a hired killer. The prosecutor also finds several of Lenny's friends who testify that Lenny was always discussing scenarios for getting rid of his wife. A jury could find these to be circumstances strongly corroborative of Lenny's intent to kill his wife.”

Colorado’s "Criminal Solicitation" Laws (18-2-301 C.R.S.)

If this link is not permitted, I trust a mod will delete.

Awesome link and post, and welcome!

 

[Gardener1850]

I'm not sure! I thought I remember there was some discussion about the authorities going there to remove the animals. Don't know if it actually happened though. Imo

I don't think it happened. MOO.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is closed for review and cleanup.

Check back later.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is open again.

ADMIN NOTE:

Many posts had to be removed tonight because the original post had no link to the document that was being discussed. By the time a link was eventually provided, it was a paywalled link. Information from behind a paywalled/subscription article can only be paraphrased and a link provided so if someone wants to pay to view the info, they can. You may NOT direct quote or post screenshots from documents behind a paywall. Posts discussing that information will remain unapproved.

Eventually a link was provided to the Colorado Courts with info in a different format than what was behind the paywall. IOW, some post that were removed may have been referring to the paywalled article (not allowed for discussion) OR they may have been referring to the document at Colorado Courts (allowable for discussion). At times it was difficult to determine which document members were referring to. Unfortunately this is what happens when someone starts out with unlinked, unsourced information ... things can get very kerfuffled downthread.

If you feel your post was unfairly removed and it did refer to the official Colorado Courts document, please let me know and I will try to find your post and reapprove. Hopefully what remains of the thread at this time still makes sense.

On another note, please do not post and trust a mod to see it and remove it. If you have doubts, please ask WS staff beforehand. Mods and Admin do not sit on a thread 24/7 to read posts in real time. By the time we see such a post, it may have created a lot of extra work for staff. We would much rather you message us to ask and wait for an answer.

 

[Niner]

Monday, Dec. 31st:
*First Appearance Hearing (@ 8:30am MT) - CO – Kelsey Berreth (29) (last seen Nov. 22, 2018, Woodland Park; phone pinged 800 miles away in Gooding, Idaho on 11/25/18 @ 5:13pm, reported missing Dec. 2, 2018) – Patrick Michael Frazee (32) “fiancé” arrested & charged (12/21/18) with 1st degree murder & solicitation of 1st degree murder. Held without bond.
Was a suspect as of 12/15/18. Search warrant executed 12/14/18. Search & arrest warrants are sealed. The little girl, who had been staying with her dad up until his arrest, is now in protective custody & will be reunited with Berreth’s family.
12/27/18: The court continued the temporary custody of the minor child with maternal grandparents, but the Teller County Dept. of Human Services will retain legal custody.
12/21/18 Hearing on Advisement; first appearance hearing set for 12/31/18.
12/24/18: Defense has filed a motion to limit the release of information about the case before it goes to trial. His attorneys cite “massive pre-indictment and pretrial negative publicity.” Prosecutors are fighting to have the motion denied without a hearing. Motion has been denied re a request to limit pretrial publicity. Request Denied.
Other motions filed:
P-4 People’s Response to Defendant’s Notice of Invocation of all Statutory, Case Law, and Constitutional Privileges
P-3 People’s Response to Defendant’s Motion for Preservation of Physical Evidence
P-2 People’s Response to Defendant’s Notice of Representation and Demand for Notice of any Pre-Trial Nontestimonial Identification Procedure Sought Pursuant to Crim. P.41.1
P-1 People’s Response to Defendant’s Motion for Preservation and Production of Law Enforcement Notes, Recordings, and Other Evidence
D-004 Notice of Invocation of all Statutory, Case Law, and Constitutional Privileges
D-002 Notice of Representation and Demand for Notice of any Nontestimonial Identification Procedure Sought Pursuant to Crim. P.41.1
CTO-02 Decorum Order
12/27/18 Update: The court continued the temporary custody of the minor child with maternal grandparents, but the Teller County Dept. of Human Services will retain legal custody. Paternal grandmother file a motion to intervene. The parties agreed to reserve for later hearing paternal grandmother’s motion to intervene & placement request. The case is continued for a pre-trial conference on January 3, 2019.

 

[otto]

This is what I think, too. He wants pro bono help. <sipped for space>

I think he wants a free ride. The family can afford a lawyer, I think, but it's in the financial interest of the estate to not pay for one.

Is there a law in Colorado that even if someone starts with a court appointed lawyer, they have some leeway in terms of elected lawyer when it is a capital case? I think that's how it works in some states. Does that work in CO?

 

[tmar]

First time poster here. I believe WS’s ToS allow me to share the link below which provides lots of good information on 18-2-301 (1) C.R.S, Colorado’s Felony Solicitation law. As an example:

“Verbally soliciting a crime is not enough. There must be additional evidence of circumstances that show you had the specific intent to promote or facilitate that crime. (For) example: One night Lenny and Mickey are having a beer, when Lenny says to Mickey, “What do you say we kill my wife? That woman needs to die.” Without anything further, Lenny is guilty of nothing more than blowing off steam. But... let's say that after Lenny's wife gets killed, the police discover a history of Google queries on Lenny's computer asking the going rate for a hired killer. The prosecutor also finds several of Lenny's friends who testify that Lenny was always discussing scenarios for getting rid of his wife. A jury could find these to be circumstances strongly corroborative of Lenny's intent to kill his wife.”

Colorado’s "Criminal Solicitation" Laws (18-2-301 C.R.S.)

If this link is not permitted, I trust a mod will delete.

Welcome Brix.
Great first post, carrying a good explanation.
Hope to hear more from you.

 

[susiQ]

Can you please post the link? TIA
MOO

If what Nancy Grace's "insiders" had to say is true, my hunch was right all along. <modsnipped jnformation from random vlogger- not msm>It appears it may be factual given what Nancy Grace's insiders said in the interview on the 26th.

Posts by: Nancy Grace, Publisher Dec 26th, Kelsey go to 27 min. mark to listen
Edit to include link

 

[buttonbaby]

If what Nancy Grace's "insiders" had to say is true, my hunch was right all along. <modsnipped> It appears it may be factual given what Nancy Grace's insiders said in the interview on the 26th.

SusiQ, would you please be so kind to remind me of your hunch? Thank you!

 

[susiQ]

SusiQ, would you please be so kind to remind me of your hunch? Thank you!

My "hunch" was that there was someone else. Many have postulated that Kelsey may have "moved on" but PF's history and his behaviour told me he had a "dish" and most likely in Idaho. JMO. To me that would have explained those stupid texts meant to buy him time with CB and to somehow give him an alibi or bolster his "story" about KB going to visit her grandmother. So, either he was travelling to Twin Falls Idaho to visit his "friend" with KB's phone, or she had visited him and was returning to Twin Falls, Idaho with the phone. MOO

 

[buttonbaby]

My "hunch" was that there was someone else. Many have postulated that Kelsey may have "moved on" but PF's history and his behaviour told me he had a "dish" and most likely in Idaho. JMO. To me that would have explained those stupid texts meant to buy him time with CB and to somehow give him an alibi or bolster his "story" about KB going to visit her grandmother. So, either he was travelling to Twin Falls Idaho to visit his "friend" with KB's phone, or she had visited him and was returning to Twin Falls, Idaho with the phone. MOO

Aha.... interesting indeed! Curioser and curiouser... I don't watch Nancy Grace anymore, but wow!

 

[susiQ]

To understand PF one just needs to do a cursory read on narcissists. There are many varieties but they all share certain traits. KB isn't the first not to recognize the signs but I'm sure she was beginning to see through the deception. Strange thing, shortly before our middle son died of cancer, a friend's friend's husband killed himself. I was told he was a narcissist. I hadn't really looked into that diagnosis to fully understand what that entailed so I looked it up and did a wee bit of research. It was then that I understood my ex DIL and why she could do what she did to a dying man and how he ever fell for her. It's tragic that KB hooked up with one that was capable of murder. My ex DIL merely made our son's last two years incredibly difficult. I'll leave it at that.

 

[susiQ]

Aha.... interesting indeed! Curioser and curiouser... I don't watch Nancy Grace anymore, but wow!

I don't watch her either, but another poster supplied the link