CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #2

[audge86]

I doubt Kelsey and PF had a firm custody agreement or a legally binding one. They were engaged, according to her family. And their daughter is too young for school so they can still do whatever is best for their schedules.

I read here that PF had her during the week while Kelsey worked. So it seems that his house is her primary home.

Regarding lawyering up "right away," he didn't. She was reported missing 9 days before he was seen with a lawyer.

We also have no idea if his property was searched or if they've even asked to search it. So it's inaccurate to say that cooperating doesn't include allowing that.

Also there is clearly a lot of sleuthing of someone who is not a suspect or POI. We know who owns his home, his job, his potential salary and what social media has to say about his character. Plus discussion has turned into how he did it rather than where Kelsey is. This thread needs major clean up. We all know the TOS, this isn't supposed to be a gossip site

 

[Jethro4WS]

I would not expect someone to lawyer up if they're innocent. It's simply not how innocent people act. At least not at first.

I'm always surprised how many people advocate shutting down and not speaking to police if they're innocent. I'm an attorney and would absolutely not lawyer up unless I was guilty or unless it became clear they were trying to go after me.

And yes, legally it's the smart thing to do. But it's not human nature for innocent people to do that.

He seemed to have lawyered up the day after the press conference where it was unmistakable that law enforcement is targeting him.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

True, but considering half or more of female homicide victims are killed by an intimate partner, it's a pretty reasonable suspicion.

CDC: Half Of All Female Homicide Victims Are Killed By Intimate Partners

Agreed. As I mention, I think the most likely scenario is she's the victim of foul play at the hands of someone close to her. But, it only takes 1 case (Mollie T., for ex) to remind us why we shouldn't assume that's always the case.

 

[Jethro4WS]

This may have been ansered already, but, in the press conference LE stated that on the 25th the mother called PF. He called her back. He told her that she had texted him that day.

No. In the press conference the Police Chief giving the timeline specifically stated that Kelsey's mother called PF on December 2nd. There are so many articles that have this wrong.

 

[oviedo]

Well, he doesn't own the house he lives in nor the property. So, he can't give permission for that.

But his mother could if in fact she owns the property that he lives on. I believe he said he saw her that afternoon for the baby exchange. So far, LE can find no other witnesses/people/etc. that saw her after that exchange from what I have read. I would want my property cleared immediately if it were me. And I would have a lawyer even if I was innocent (10 years working in a law firm) - just to help me and keep me steady. JMO

 

[Inthedetails]

Has anyone seen this version of the press conference?

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=2273639882654648

I'm curious what your thoughts are on the last 20 seconds of the video?

ETA: Not sure if it's random banter (without context, it seems a little... off?) or something more.

You mean the part when the tech guys say, "We fooled them again?" If that's what you're referring to, I think that's just on-the-job banter. I've worked putting events together super fast, and sometimes it seems like we survived the presentations thanks to a little scotch-tape and alotta luck....in other words "we fooled" people into thinking we are on the ball when really we were scrambling. I think it's co-worker banter without any meaning whatsoever to the case.

Or, did you mean something else? If you mean something else, can you be specific with the words on the video you're interested in?

jmo

 

[oviedo]

Yep. Me too. But I participated in those forums and there were plenty of people who suspected him too.

And his poor brothers... I think her brothers too. Between her case and Jayme's - I don't hold out hope any more.

 

[MassGuy]

According to statement released by PF attorney today, he only had an hour notice about the presser.

How did he only get an hour’s notice if we knew about it the day before?

Does the Zillow search result show his home is a rock, and that he lives under it?

 

[Gigglingtoes]

If he did not do anything to her and he is telling the truth about the text from her then not calling her mother for a few days was a dumb idea on
his part.

Jmo

I think majority of people whether or not they are together, when they have a one year old child the Mother is usually very close to her child.

I think you would still check to see when the Mom is coming to see the baby or get the baby and not just be like "Huh. Weird. Guess she's gone for good."

jmo.

 

[kspoon45]

You mean the part when the tech guys say, "We fooled them again?" If that's what you're referring to, I think that's just on-the-job banter. I've worked putting events together super fast, and sometimes it seems like we survived the presentations thanks to a little scotch-tape and alotta luck....on other words "we fooled" people into thinking we are on the ball when really we were scrambling. I think it's co-worker banter without any meaning whatsoever to the case.

Or, did you mean something else? If you mean something else, can you be specific with the words on the video you're interested in?

jmo

That makes a lot of sense, thank you!

 

[MyBelle]

There is no such thing as "full custody."

Unmarried moms have parental rights but dads automatically do too if named on the birth certificate. But if the couple breaks up the dad would typically have to go to court to get custody orders.

CO is like CA - liberal when it comes to custody rights for parents. A dad would be entitled to joint legal custody and if he had the same capability of caring for the child - the same amount of hours on the job, for example -nothing would preclude him from substantial time with the child unless she was a newborn and breastfeeding.

Dads are considered equal to moms in CA and CO and if she was deemed unfit he could absolutely take custody.

In this case, the couple is not living together and the mother is now missing. The question I have is whether PF automatically has custody or does he have to petition the court? I have no idea if he's on the birth certificate. I find it unusual that the couple are engaged but the baby doesn't carry his last name.

In Illinois and Ohio, an unmarried mother has sole legal and residential custody until the father petitions the court. Jake Wagner had to petition the court for custody after the mother of his child was found murdered. And two years later, Jake is now in jail for the murder and some of the custody filings are alleged to be fraudulent. JMO

 

[Inthedetails]

According to statement released by PF attorney today, he only had an hour notice about the presser. I disagree with his attorney. MOO

I wonder how much time he needed to get to a press conference in his town with LE and his child's grandmother in the missing-person case of the mother of his child?

jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

delete duplicate post

 

[PommyMommy]

Can you link to the video of her brother and brother in law? I haven't seen that yet. TIA.

 

[Warwick7]

Has anyone seen this version of the press conference?

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=2273639882654648

I'm curious what your thoughts are on the last 20 seconds of the video?

ETA: Not sure if it's random banter (without context, it seems a little... off?) or something more.

I can't hear it. Maybe someone else can.

 

[MassGuy]

I doubt Kelsey and PF had a firm custody agreement or a legally binding one. They were engaged, according to her family. And their daughter is too young for school so they can still do whatever is best for their schedules.

I read here that PF had her during the week while Kelsey worked. So it seems that his house is her primary home.

Regarding lawyering up "right away," he didn't. She was reported missing 9 days before he was seen with a lawyer.

We also have no idea if his property was searched or if they've even asked to search it. So it's inaccurate to say that cooperating doesn't include allowing that.

Also there is clearly a lot of sleuthing of someone who is not a suspect or POI. We know who owns his home, his job, his potential salary and what social media has to say about his character. Plus discussion has turned into how he did it rather than where Kelsey is. This thread needs major clean up. We all know the TOS, this isn't supposed to be a gossip site

Where Kelsey is, is directly related to the circumstances of her disappearance.

There are two reasonable options here:

She left on her own

She was kidnapped and is almost certainly deceased

If the latter occurred, it’s pretty clear who is most likely involved

That press conference made it absolutely clear that authorities are interested in him.

They increased suspicion of him, rather than alleviate it.

The chief was asked directly if they had executed a search warrant of his property.

He responded with “that’s something we’re going to look into.”

That’s a no.

 

[Gardener1850]

I think majority of people whether or not they are together, when they have a one year old child the Mother is usually very close to her child.

I think you would still check to see when the Mom is coming to see the baby or get the baby and not just be like "Huh. Weird. Guess she's gone for good."

jmo.

He claims he got a text from her phone on Nov 25th. We still don't know what that text said. And we don't know how long he was supposed to have the baby before she came back for her.

 

[oviedo]

In this case, the couple is not living together and the mother is now missing. The question I have is whether PF automatically has custody or does he have to petition the court? I have no idea if he's on the birth certificate. I find it unusual that the couple are engaged but the baby doesn't carry his last name.

In Illinois and Ohio, an unmarried mother has sole legal and residential custody until the father petitions the court. Jake Wagner had to petition the court for custody after the mother of his child was found murdered. And two years later, Jake is now in jail for the murder and some of the custody filings are alleged to be fraudulent. JMO

https://goldmanlaw303.com/understanding-colorado-custody-laws-unwed-parents/
If he is on the birth certificate, it would seem to be a simple process according to this law firm.

 

[dgfred]

He sure could clear that (what she txted and said) up a bit... wonder why he hasn't.

 

[Gardener1850]

Thanks Pommy, but that is her Uncle, her pastor and a family friend speaking. I thought someone was saying there was video of Kelsey's brother and brother-in-law.

ETA: nevermind Seattl1 linked it for me