CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #20 *ARREST*

[NanZDrew]

If not he could have just as easily had them both killed if he didn't want to be saddled with a kid, but he didn't.

ETA - Not meaning it would ever be easy to kill one's child

Or any child for that matter. There are many home invasions where infants are unharmed. It takes a special kind of evil to kill a child, but we know some of those exist.

 

[Trudie]

This brings up a question I have wondered.. What brings on FBI in a case? I understand that the FBI is brought on based on the limitations of State capabilities/ expertise. But wondered when and why the FBI was called in?

FBI investigators search the home of the fiance of missing Colorado mom Kelsey Berreth | Daily Mail Online Vandalay, this article speaks about some ways fbi is assisting

 

[MsBetsy]

From what I have read, a person cannot be charged based merely/solely on the words of one other person...there would have to be some supporting evidence. Jmo

But what if the evidence supports both scenarios?

 

[NanZDrew]

Maybe he didn't want to go to court to fight for custody and didn't want to pay child support.

Either because he's a control freak/bully or he couldn't afford it. Maybe he wanted to teach her a "lesson".

When I watch true crime docs and Forensic Files I'm always boggled at the people who think its easier to murder than get a divorce -- and they actually think they can get AWAY with killing. Divorce is rough but its the only decent, moral thing to do. So many MORE lives are ruined through murder than divorce.
smh

MOO

Exactly. The common denominator in so many of these murders is a killer who thinks they are smarter than LE and everyone else. They think they can pull off the perfect crime. It was easier years ago before technology and cameras everywhere.

 

[MsBetsy]

I was in Safeway the other day and there are even quite a few cameras inside!!!

I would think he, or anyone involved, would not have risked being seen in a public place. Not just because of the cameras, but because there are so many witnesses. Jmo

 

[mustloveco]

...so much footage from theCC rodeo. Also, there is a small rodeo in WP in the summer as well (haven't looked at footage yet)

 

[Trudie]

I would think he, or anyone involved, would not have risked being seen in a public place. Not just because of the cameras, but because there are so many witnesses. Jmo

I thought maybe he met her there for child exchange. I’ve heard he picked her up, K dropped her off. Idk how he got her, do you? Tia

But, if he met her at the store, could he have let someone else in her condo, or given them a key, maybe they restrained her until P returned (when neighbor saw his truck). Idk. MOO. Hypothetical.

 

[cluciano63]

Jmo we will never know what his motive was. We might hear what he told others (those he hired or tried to hire) but those won’t be true. So we will just have to wonder imo.

We may also never know if Kelsey knew anything at all or if she thought all was fine or fine-ish between them. Between her work and her baby, she may not have spent much time analyzing the relationship,as long as things worked out with the baby.
Jmo

 

[Irmese]

There were some things asked that I could not get to before the thread closed. If I miss anything, please just ask again! I'm home battling a head cold (yay NYE!) and a needy Chihuahua haha.

There is no need to NOT charge felony murder if they have solicitation too. Solicitation does not merge unless it turns into conspiracy. So you can have solicitation and murder, or you can have conspiracy and murder; you CANNOT have solicitation and conspiracy, or solicitation, conspiracy, and murder. Unless we start getting into multiple solicitees, so to speak, but I'll leave that until if/when we find out there were more people in fact involved.

If PF asked Bob (made up name) to commit murder and Bob agreed, a conspiracy charge might still come. At this point though, I'm thinking Bob did NOT agree because Bob would likely have been charged with murder by now. It's been 10 days since PF's arrest. So in this scenario, we have a solicitation charge for Bob being asked by PF, and then a murder charge for PF.

Yes, I have seen sealed arrest warrants for longer than 10 days. I know it seems like forever, but it's only been 10! It will eventually come.

Someone asked about him talking. I am personally of the opinion that he will not talk. He will take his chances at trial. I don't think we have a CW issue here where he did not want people to see and hear what he had done. Again, I could be wrong, but I do not think CW pled to avoid the DP. I think he pled to avoid trial. Something tells me PF will take this all the way, but hey, you never know.

Could multiple solicitation charges mean he made several separate contacts or payments to one person?
Could the person(s) being protected be someone that a solicitee confided in?

 

[cluciano63]

I worry the rush of the consumptive evidence will "muck" up the Prosecution. Let's hope not. Sounds like they have one shot at this piece of evidence.

*corrected to say Prosecution.. Not Defense

They must have more than one tiny bit...? I mean other evidence. But it is always a risk to “use up” all of an item for testing.

 

[Trudie]

Jmo we will never know what his motive was. We might hear what he told others (those he hired or tried to hire) but those won’t be true. So we will just have to wonder imo.

We may also never know if Kelsey knew anything at all or if she thought all was fine or fine-ish between them. Between her work and her baby, she may not have spent much time analyzing the relationship,as long as things worked out with the baby.
Jmo

100% agree!

 

[Marli61]

They must have more than one tiny bit...? I mean other evidence. But it is always a risk to “use up” all of an item for testing.

The bit they have that will be consumed must be a very integral one.

 

[Mom24]

The bit they have that will be consumed must be a very integral one.

The issue is also that there wouldn't be enough for the defense to test it as well.

 

[WhimsicalWillow]

Maybe for his Mother’s love of the child.

I see it this way.... he met KB online, had a few hookups (as he always did), she got pregnant, he asked her to move to CO and helped her move. But she didn’t realize he is a Mamas boy. His mom owns everything. He is a playboy who takes care of the cattle and horses and the ranch. He loves rodeo. Loves playing the field. But Mom pays all the bills. KB realized this and bought her own townhouse as she decided he would never leave his easy life with mom. She may have decided it was time to move on with her life. PF couldn’t allow her to take the baby away from his mom. He didn’t care about pleasing KB or growing up and being a man. He only had to look good for moms sake.
Custody. That’s how I see it now.

I share the exact thoughts.

 

[KBB87]

See I think they think they do. They don't see it from our point of view after the fact. (Although I believe the vast majority, if not 100% of us in here would KNOW we couldn't execute a cover-up) I believe both CW & PF thought they had committed the perfect crime & covered it up flawlessly.

I’m cracking up at CW thinking he committed the perfect crime. He literally drove his GPS enabled work truck to his work site to dispose of the bodies. Lol stupid doesn’t even begin to describe him. Dude had cops in his house less than 12 hours after he killed them.

 

[Marli61]

The issue is also that there wouldn't be enough for the defense to test it as well.

IIRC it was stated in the presser that the defense could also be present when it is tested.

 

[Seattle1]

Idk. Maybe because baby K is a girl? P has no sister, correct?
I’d like to know what a horse owner in the area pays for farrier work & wait time, etc. as I mentioned last night, for me, it’s like a hair salon appointment. Pay & rebook for 6 weeks out. I just don’t buy into the “broke theory”.

PF has at least one older brother, sister, and sister in law -- all with good jobs and/or careers. PF appears to be the only sibling living with/off his Mum. MOO

Average farrier services:

Basic Shoeing Cost
According to the latest Farrier Business Practices survey conducted by American Farriers Journal, the average nationwide price for trimming four hooves and applying four keg shoes is $120.19. The average charge for trimming and resetting four keg shoes is $113.36. Trim-only prices average $42.06.

Pricing For Success | American Farriers Journal

 

[Vandalay Industries]

FBI investigators search the home of the fiance of missing Colorado mom Kelsey Berreth | Daily Mail Online Vandalay, this article speaks about some ways fbi is assisting

Thank you.. I guess my question was more law +/- at what point does the local LE require that the CBI/FBI get called. Wondered if it was because cross state lines were involved or just the the state officials requested their assistance ? People go missing everyday, so there must be a point when local LE says, Ok, Let's call in the FBI.

 

[Love Never Fails]

See I think they think they do. They don't see it from our point of view after the fact. (Although I believe the vast majority, if not 100% of us in here would KNOW we couldn't execute a cover-up) I believe both CW & PF thought they had committed the perfect crime & covered it up flawlessly.

My point was if they thought it through, they would know they were going to serve a life sentence for what they did. In most cases, you just can’t disappear a body after being the last one to see them. Someone is going to be taking a close look at you. And with all the latest technology, I have to think they are as dumb as rocks.

 

[tmar]

I have a theory as to why. I think he had moved on from her when she popped up pregnant, he did love little KB but he never was in love with Kelsey. She was in the way, she was always going to be in the way. Maybe she didn't realize that he had moved on because he wasn't honest with her or she didn't care, she just wanted to do right by her daughter and have her dad involved in their lives. He had a new love interest and all he wanted was the baby. He may have lied to the other woman about how involved he really was with Kelsey too. I think it was all coming to a head. Maybe Thanksgiving PF wanted to take little KB to be with the other woman and family and Kelsey objected to that or maybe the other woman was pressuring him to make the break. The pressure was the final straw. imo

I would think if there was another woman for PF, this would have been revealed.: friends, neighbours, phone records, Kelsey being suspicious.
Unless it was an 'on line' affair, and there were only a few times, when PF and this person, saw one another.
However, would a few occasions seeing someone, have a person consider murdering their babies mother.
MOO.