CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #22 *ARREST*

[katydid23]

Self Defense is a possibility or Kelsey was choking the child so I had to kill her.

One would think that he would have been forewarned about that excuse, after seeing the backlash when Chris Watts tried that bogus story.

 

[Kapua]

Well, yeah. She apparently sent a text to Doss from that phone to explain KB’s future absence. Of course she knew.

It's hard to imagine that IF she powered on the phone and the phone then sent those 2 texts, that she wouldn't have read them out of curiosity. MOO

 

[Trudie]

How coincidental the nurse was in CO Tday.
Not for a sec do I believe she didn’t transport the phone knowingly, IF it is proven she actually had possession of the phone.

MOO

 

[BingoBongo]

I can’t help but recall the mention of this whole situation being a “long story”- will need to find the link to MSM but it was mid December - what the heck was the murder plot and just how many were involved ??

I don't know, exactly, how many were involved in the actual murder. I hate to even type that. :-( But more than just a few in the cover-up, and silence. And some just random people who happened be conveniently "used" because they were close by when needed.

 

[MyBelle]

Idk if there is a “right” decision in EVERY custody case.
I expect many may be rather difficult for the Judge to rule on. In essence, is a Judge not saying “Jane Doe is better than John Doe ”, after ruling in Jane’s favor? Surely, in some cases, the evidence against one petitioner is blatantly obvious & not so obvious in other cases. In some, I’d expect it to be a grueling decision, cuz NO ONE is perfect or without fault.
Right now, based on what we know, if P killed K for custody of their daughter, it backfired. Even if his mom is awarded custody, P is out of the picture, if he’s in prison.
Sure, he can offer input, etc., but he’s sure not going to be in physical custody.
.......it’s going to be real interesting to see how this plays out. It looks like we’re in for a “long ride”, IMO.

I don't believe PF killed KB over custody. I think he killed her because he didn't want to pay child support AND he wants the SS survivor income she'll receive. I'll lose all faith in our justice system if the Judge allowed the state to remove the child from the Frazee home and then decides to hand her right back. JMO

 

[Lhughessk]

Watch the video of the court proceedings from a few days ago. You will see the judge clearly ruled to allow PF's attorneys to see the contents of the warrant but it remains sealed to PF until she rules on it Fri.
From the Denver Post as you referenced "May said he is asking the judge to withhold the affidavit from the defendant, but Frazee’s attorney would be allowed to have it as long as he swore not to speak with his client about it."

The Judge has seen the contents of the arrest warrant and knows why the Prosecution has a safety concern around the release of the information. And I trust the Judge knows more about the law and how to make rulings than the Denver Post or me.

The Denver Post reference makes it sound like it’s talking about what would happen Friday if the judge grants the motion - that the attorney “would be allowed to have it” at that time, but not share it with PF. But whatever - if you saw the judge clearly order that the affidavit be turned over to PF’s attorney immediately without waiting for a ruling, then so be it.

All of your faith and trust in the judge is fine for you but not how I myself operate. Judges make errors all the time, leading to mistrials, reversals on appeal, etc.

 

[MassGuy]

But, my point is this; is the nurse that reportedly has something to do with K’s phone the ONLY person claiming to be Solicited? If so, she’s not believable, imo.
He will DENY, LIE, DENY more. He ain’t talking, as far as we know. He’s getting his ducks in a row. Now he knows or will know her story.
She could be in some trouble.
If I am in her position, I’m tightening my saddle.

We don’t have any evidence that she was the one he solicited to kill her.

For all we know that was someone else entirely, and she simply helped him with the phone.

If this follows the usual pattern, there are several people who are aware of this plot, all of which could potentially testify against him.

Witness statements can be a problem if someone isn’t credible, but they are far more potent when backed up by evidence.

Like digital evidence.

I think it’s there.

 

[Mercedes]

Could it be his mother was also detained briefly when he was arrested to ensure she couldn't take physical custody of the baby right then and there? With her being briefly detained, it ensured the baby went into protective custody and then the Berreth's. Otherwise, I'm wondering if he had been arrested while his mother was present with the baby (and she had not been detained as well), would she have been able to keep the baby?

Do we know where the baby was while PF was being arrested and taken away?

 

[BRRI]

Snipped by me.

If that is what they found, I think that would be enough to convince a jury.

JMO

They have to have something already if they are saying they do believe she has been murdered. I have a feeling that’s it. But, it’s also about establishing that HE was the one to do it.

 

[Trudie]

I hate to say this...but rumors often ARE true in the end, I find. I avoid FB but often the gist of a rumor makes its way onto WS and lo and behold, a week, a month, a year later...it pans out. Jmo

Yes, rumors are not always “rumors”.

 

[BingoBongo]

Well, yeah. She apparently sent a text to Doss from that phone to explain KB’s future absence. Of course she knew.

Not sure if that is a fact. Not sure of the type phone it was, or if it had an app installed that allowed delayed timing of sends. Dunno.

 

[cluciano63]

If PF wanted to benefit from Kelsey’s death, I think he would have wanted her body found. Not wait around up to seven years until she was declared legally dead. In fact, the way he wanted it to look was that she ran off. Jmo

 

[Steelslady]

Very possibly. Other possibilities are:
- She may have contacted LE once she woke up and realized that she was in very deep doo-doo or
- LE figured out who she was based on PF's phone records.

I honestly don't believe that she contacted LE on her own. I believe she was sweating bullets until she heard LE say that it might be a "false ping". She let her guard down, perhaps brought up seeing PF and his or her families during Thanksgiving. Some coworkers or friends put two and two together and called LE, hence, the warrants.

 

[Mom24]

It’s very common on live reality LE shows. Maybe that’s where it’s coming from. Do we have an LE expert that can weigh in here?

607.8 DETENTIONS DURING WARRANT SERVICE Deputies must be sensitive to the safety risks of all persons involved with the service of a warrant. Depending on circumstances and facts present, it may be appropriate to control movements of any or all persons present at a warrant service, including those who may not be the subject of a warrant or suspected in the case. However, deputies must be mindful that only reasonable force may be used and weapons should be displayed no longer than the deputy reasonably believes is necessary.
https://www.epcsheriffsoffice.com/s...aso_County_Sheriff_s_Office_Policy_Manual.pdf
This is from neighboring El Paso county. It also goes into stating that one of the considerations is the knowledge of weapons permits. So in other words, if the person being arrested has a weapons permit, the knowledge that there is a weapon would be evaluated. It also says that the desire is to serve the arrest warrant and arrest the person outside rather than in their home. It was an interesting read.

 

[MsBetsy]

Really? Where? In your state? I have been present & within eyeshot (bc of previous job) of many arrests & I've never seen “those around” detained.
I know my home state does not detain innocent bystanders. If serving an arrest warrant, they would arrest
the person on the warrant. Unless all hell erupted, family or guests wouldn’t be detained. If a spouse or a parent started screaming or otherwise going off (like not wanting to surrender a child), then, yes, they might be detained.
Jmo
Every state has dif’ laws.

It happens in NY. When I was tutor going to homes for instruction, a students home was raided by police. They took the tutor right along with everyone in the home and detained her until she could prove she worked for the school! After that we were reqired to wear identification at all times. Imo

 

[Trudie]

Do we know where the baby was while PF was being arrested and taken away?

I wonder about this too. I can’t tell from video. Several cars were in the picture. I thought perhaps the baby was in a car & Ma F was visibly upset, hence detainment.
Maybe the baby was placed in a car before the reporter got to the scene or got camera rolling. Jmo

 

[cluciano63]

I honestly don't believe that she contacted LE on her own. I believe she was sweating bullets until she heard LE say that it might be a "false ping". She let her guard down, perhaps brought up seeing PF and his or her families during Thanksgiving. Some coworkers or friends put two and two together and called LE, hence, the warrants.

Or people may have known she had plans to go to CO, and when she returned she did not talk about her trip. She may not have known in advance what the trip would entail, i.e

 

[Mom24]

They have a lot on their plate right now. They need time.

I think her uncle or brother posted here a couple of times too? Anyone else remember who it was?

 

[Gardener1850]

I have a whole box full of old cellphones and tablets I have been afraid to toss out thinking they might have private information left on them. Was wondering what to do with them............

Well whatever you do with them don't toss them in a lake. Besides the environmental concerns, they might still work if found: This iPhone still works after being at the bottom of a lake for a year
And so I stay on topic, I hope the person who disposed of KB's phone was so naive as to think tossing it in water would destroy it. As the above article shows, there is a possibility the phone could still work and perhaps LE could recover everything on it. JMO.

 

[Trudie]

607.8 DETENTIONS DURING WARRANT SERVICE Deputies must be sensitive to the safety risks of all persons involved with the service of a warrant. Depending on circumstances and facts present, it may be appropriate to control movements of any or all persons present at a warrant service, including those who may not be the subject of a warrant or suspected in the case. However, deputies must be mindful that only reasonable force may be used and weapons should be displayed no longer than the deputy reasonably believes is necessary.
https://www.epcsheriffsoffice.com/s...aso_County_Sheriff_s_Office_Policy_Manual.pdf
This is from neighboring El Paso county. It also goes into stating that one of the considerations is the knowledge of weapons permits. So in other words, if the person being arrested has a weapons permit, the knowledge that there is a weapon would be evaluated. It also says that the desire is to serve the arrest warrant and arrest the person outside rather than in their home. It was an interesting read.

Oh, I believe you see this in your area, I just have never & I worked in a court position for 25 years & witnessed multiple drug related arrests & our LE doesn’t practice this protocol. our SO is a small force and could not provide manpower to detain multiples for a moment or two.

And, I know all about preferring arrest outside. No way of knowing what’s going on inside. That’s always risky.

I think Ma F may have been upset (understandably). If my son was hauled off on murder charges, I’d probably throw a fit & appear deranged.

Moo