CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #31 *ARREST*

[Love Never Fails]

The double edged sword of technology. On the one had, it can help hang a killer or locate a victim but on the other is the complete loss of privacy and freedom described in such dystopian novels as 1984. I had an ex, thirty years ago, who was a PI, who told me the future would be selling information. I couldn't see it. Little did I know!

I read 1984 in 1967 and it terrified me. And here we are....

 

[Jethro4WS]

Wow, I find that shocking. Someone could help a killer get rid of a body and just get 2-6?! That's crazy.

Often they plead them down, if they are the ones giving information, to abuse of a corpse or failure to report a death, or similar.

Under Federal Statutes the maximum is 15 years or half the sentence of the person sentenced for the underlying crime, whichever is lower. Chances are, if you have a clean prior record, the sentence won't approach 15 years under the sentencing guidelines.

 

[Dave F.]

Media who identified themselves as an NBC reporter, an ABC producer and a freelance photographer for the U.K.’s Daily Mail converged Jan. 4 at a home in Twin Falls County expecting to find the FBI serving a search warrant, they said. What they found were “no trespassing” signs and a heavy chain across the entrance to the property.
Colorado district court: Murder case is sealed


What happened on Jan 3rd which caused the reporters to believe LE was going to search this place?

Their picture doesn't show the gate or a chain that is described. The sign is sure there, but those signs are everywhere during hunting season and until winter blows them over.
Hmmmm. An NBC reporter, An ABC producer, and a Freelance photographer. Could they possibly have been lost, together?

 

[Artis]

I read 1984 in 1967 and it terrified me. And here we are....

Yep, and there are fools out there getting themselves chipped.

 

[InvSmith]

Hi thanks. I couldn’t read it because you have to subscribe to the paper to do so. I remember only one coworker before Doss ( and I believe that was her supervisor) saying she was quiet and kept to herself. And I remember one person quoting KB that she told them she was getting married in February 2017. Other than that, I only remember her family speaking of her.

KB seemed committed to certain fixed things like her family, church, and education. I know when you build a career that involves travel (which we do not know how much she did when) you do not necessarily build close friends especially after a move. Laci's friends were engaged because of the missing persons case which this has not been in a month.

 

[SandyQLS]

Plus he had a jealous side chick who would do anything to be with him, she divorced her husband, then KB enter the picture, had his baby and their happy ever after went out the window.
So KK has to go back to her Hubby. Her plans lay in ruins.
She must have seethed with jeslousy,and hatred for beautiful,sweet Kelsey.How dare anyone get in the way of what Perfect Miss Rodeo Queen wants, but she has to make it look like it's only PF who wanted KB dead. So she tells BFF blah blah blah just in case they get caught, so she comes out of it unscathed. Or so she thinks.
MOO

To me, PF is a typical kind of guy with 'mechanical intelligence'. He likes to work with his hands and with tools, and he knows how things work. He shoes horses, fixes a broken storm door, probably can put in a sturdy fence, repair a leaky roof, dismantle a broken dryer. He looks at a truck engine and knows how it all works together, probably changes his own oil and winter tires.

This type of guy is usually fairly simple. He might catch the evening news, but he mostly watches TV BRO (Bull Riders Only, the most dangerous 8 seconds in sports), rodeo, fishing & hunting, maybe NASCAR and country western music. He would only have passing knowledge of the Chris Watts case, has never read an Ann Rule book and does not watch ID channel.

Look around WS and we have high proportion of females and of nurses. Many nurses have 'investigator' personalities. WS's do watch ID, read Ann Rule, and know details of the Chris Watts case. The whole plot to murder KB seems much too machiavellian for PF - but seems exactly like the detailed web a woman would create.

I have experience bias, and IMO KK is more the driving force, the schemer and leader, and PF is more the co-conspirator acting at her direction. And I do wonder, like you, if she was trying to get back at both PF and KB in one plot. I understand and read with interest the experience bias of others who view PF trying to rid himself of both KB and KK, but I am not buying the 'damsel in distress' fiction the R'S were selling, and, the fiction itself makes KK look more involved than mere accessory after the fact.

 

[Hatfield]

The double edged sword of technology. On the one had, it can help hang a killer or locate a victim but on the other is the complete loss of privacy and freedom described in such dystopian novels as 1984. I had an ex, thirty years ago, who was a PI, who told me the future would be selling information. I couldn't see it. Little did I know!

So true.

When I first got my smart phone I decided to turn off GPS location services until I thought about it more. I am pretty much anti-big-brother and didnt want Google or any other place to have access to my information but then I thought about what would happen if I am in a bad car wreck and cant talk and only could push 911 and moan. LOL

Its truly like a double edged sword. I finally decided that the advantages of being able to use the Google Map driving feature and being able for 911 to find me if needed far outweighed my paranoia of big brother. LOL

It truly is a double edged sword.

 

[Stunned]

Wow, I find that shocking. Someone could help a killer get rid of a body and just get 2-6?! That's crazy.

So marijuana could get you 20 years? Really need to take another look at “justice system”.

 

[Stunned]

So true.

When I first got my smart phone I decided to turn off GPS location services until I thought about it more. I am pretty much anti-big-brother and didnt want Google or any other place to have access to my information but then I thought about what would happen if I am in a bad car wreck and cant talk and only could push 911 and moan. LOL

Its truly like a double edged sword. I finally decided that the advantages of being able to use the Google Map driving feature and being able for 911 to find me if needed far outweighed my paranoia of big brother. LOL

It truly is a double edged swoard.

Yeah, that was a problem for me also and then I decided I had nothing to hide and didn’t want to not be found!

 

[SoVeryMe]

Just read an article about how to stop Google from doing that. Many folks don't know their phone and other devices are tracking them or how to shut that off.

eta I didn't realize that myself about the "free apps" tracking you either.

How to stop tech from tracking your every move: The phone settings YOU need to tweak to stay private | Daily Mail Online

Whoa!!!! Thanks for sharing.....what a complete invasion of privacy for those who don’t wish to be tracked!!!

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

So marijuana could get you 20 years? Really need to take another look at “justice system”.

I thought MJ was legalized in Colorado now.
Still up until it was it's sick that someone get away with helping a murdere,and get much less time.

 

[Hatch]

this is pure opinion, but the way PF carries that baby around, I don't think it was about the baby either. I could be 100% wrong, but I don't think he cares much about anything...two timing; unkind to his animal charges; soliciting for murder. I think grandma frazee probably likes the kid, but I'm really unsure about him. I wish he'd pull a Jake Patterson and just confess

You took the words right out of my mouth ! In the few short clips of media we saw of PF after KB had gone missing he carried baby K under his arm like you might carry a dog , to me that spoke volumns , if he was so attached to her and was her protector he would of carried her on his chest and most likely had the back of her head covered with his hand to shield her from the reporter that was trying to talk to him. When he placed her in the truck he just sort of plopped her down I also noticed the baby was very wide eyed maybe scared or cautious from being handled so odd. JMO I admit I am a people watcher ! I notice mannerisms and oddities.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Their picture doesn't show the gate or a chain that is described. The sign is sure there, but those signs are everywhere during hunting season and until winter blows them over.
Hmmmm. An NBC reporter, An ABC producer, and a Freelance photographer. Could they possibly have been lost, together?

It is possible. One of the news stations out of Colorado was up in Hansen, ID and they were showing a house with no trespassing signs and a chain. However, the place they were showing doesn't look like what we see in the photo at the top of the article. And the place they were showing didn't looking like any of the properties associated with addresses connected to KK. To me, the place they had shown on the Colorado news station looked just like a home with the right house number but on the wrong road.

In that county there are roads named with two directionals. For example, North XXXX East where XXXX is a number and part of the street name (not the house number). There also may be a road named East XXXX North where XXXX is the same number in the previous example. So, if that gets mixed up you can easily end up at the right house number on the wrong road.

 

[Jethro4WS]

I thought MJ was legalized in Colorado now.
Still up until it was it's sick that someone get away with helping a murdere,and get much less time.

Keep in mind that is for Accessory After the Fact. If you have involvement prior to that you are an accessory to the murder or a co-conspirator and then you are facing very lengthy sentences.

 

[Liadan]

Insane that we use so much technology but if you don't want to be tracked or found out don't use it. It's not foolproof as we have seen in this case. I kinda wish there was more opportunity to take advantage of tracking in this case.

 

[SoVeryMe]

To me, PF is a typical kind of guy with 'mechanical intelligence'. He likes to work with his hands and with tools, and he knows how things work. He shoes horses, fixes a broken storm door, probably can put in a sturdy fence, repair a leaky roof, dismantle a broken dryer. He looks at a truck engine and knows how it all works together, probably changes his own oil and winter tires.

This type of guy is usually fairly simple. He might catch the evening news, but he mostly watches TV BRO (Bull Riders Only, the most dangerous 8 seconds in sports), rodeo, fishing & hunting, maybe NASCAR and country western music. He would only have passing knowledge of the Chris Watts case, has never read an Ann Rule book and does not watch ID channel.

Look around WS and we have high proportion of females and of nurses. Many nurses have 'investigator' personalities. WS's do watch ID, read Ann Rule, and know details of the Chris Watts case. The whole plot to murder KB seems much too machiavellian for PF - but seems exactly like the detailed web a woman would create.

I have experience bias, and IMO KK is more the driving force, the schemer and leader, and PF is more the co-conspirator acting at her direction. And I do wonder, like you, if she was trying to get back at both PF and KB in one plot. I understand and read with interest the experience bias of others who view PF trying to rid himself of both KB and KK, but I am not buying the 'damsel in distress' fiction the R'S were selling, and, the fiction itself makes KK look more involved than mere accessory after the fact.

Interesting thoughts.....this all makes a lot of sense to me. I agree about PF being a simple man.....I can’t imagine he has the ability to plan out a complex plot to murder or take care of cleaning up the crime scene and destroying evidence. IMO he wasn’t the mastermind....someone else came up with the plan, someone else meticulously cleaned the crime scene (to the casual observer at least) and someone else took the responsibility to dispose of the evidence including the phone. Maybe the original plan was robbery gone wrong and that’s how it was staged....until someone thought it might be better to cover it up instead after the fact. MOO

 

[mrstfs]

KB seemed committed to certain fixed things like her family, church, and education. I know when you build a career that involves travel (which we do not know how much she did when) you do not necessarily build close friends especially after a move. Laci's friends were engaged because of the missing persons case which this has not been in a month.

All good points. Side note, I noticed a large number of people who liked KBs FB posts have changed their profile pics to show support for her.

 

[jaspermac]

Wow, I find that shocking. Someone could help a killer get rid of a body and just get 2-6?! That's crazy.

No, no something is wrong or being misinterpreted here.

You can get life if you helped and didn't even know that the intent was to murder.

Interesting article to read.
In the U.S., You Can Get Convicted of Felony Murder Without Killing Anyone. This Case Shows That Needs to Change.

Accessory to a Crime (C.R.S. 18-8-105) in Larimer, Grand or Weld County, occurs if a person intends to "hinder, delay, or prevent the discovery, detection, apprehension, prosecution, conviction, or punishment of another for the commission of a crime".

Complicity (C.R.S. 18-1-603), on the other hand, is a crime in which "[a] person is legally accountable as principal for the behavior of another constituting a criminal offense if, with the intent to promote or facilitate the commission of the offense, he or she aids, abets, advises, or encourages the other person in planning or committing the offense." The person charged does not have to be present when the crime is committed.

So, Complicity involves assistance before the crime and Accessory involves assistance after the crime.

If acting in complicity with another, you will be charged the same as the person committing the crime. If acting as an accessory, you will be charged with a lesser felony if the underlying crime is a felony, or with a petty offense, if the underlying crime is a misdemeanor.

There is no way you get a light sentence. If you look at complicity- it is as simple as having those conversations prior to the murder about murdering KB. Each time you have KK had a conversation with PF about it she was enabling and encouraging him by continuing that conversation. There have been other cases in Colorado where the secondary person involved got hammered just because they discussed it. Same sentence as the one who did the deed.

Accessory- got 9 yrs after pleading down to lesser charges
Accessory gets 9 years – The Denver Post

I am sure the the verified lawyers (@riolove77 , @gitana1 , @PrairieWind ) on the site can provide better insight into this than I can

 

[InvSmith]

Hi thanks. I couldn’t read it because you have to subscribe to the paper to do so. I remember only one coworker before Doss ( and I believe that was her supervisor) saying she was quiet and kept to herself. And I remember one person quoting KB that she told them she was getting married in February 2017. Other than that, I only remember her family speaking of her.

KB seemed committed to certain fixed things like her family, church, and education. I know when you build a career that involves travel (which we do not know how much she did when) you do not necessarily build close friends especially after a move. Laci's friends were engaged because of the missing persons case which this has not been in a month. I guess we will learn more.

 

[Jethro4WS]

No, no something is wrong or being misinterpreted here.

You can get life if you helped and didn't even know that the intent was to murder.

Interesting article to read.
In the U.S., You Can Get Convicted of Felony Murder Without Killing Anyone. This Case Shows That Needs to Change.

Accessory to a Crime (C.R.S. 18-8-105) in Larimer, Grand or Weld County, occurs if a person intends to "hinder, delay, or prevent the discovery, detection, apprehension, prosecution, conviction, or punishment of another for the commission of a crime".

Complicity (C.R.S. 18-1-603), on the other hand, is a crime in which "[a] person is legally accountable as principal for the behavior of another constituting a criminal offense if, with the intent to promote or facilitate the commission of the offense, he or she aids, abets, advises, or encourages the other person in planning or committing the offense." The person charged does not have to be present when the crime is committed.

So, Complicity involves assistance before the crime and Accessory involves assistance after the crime.

If acting in complicity with another, you will be charged the same as the person committing the crime. If acting as an accessory, you will be charged with a lesser felony if the underlying crime is a felony, or with a petty offense, if the underlying crime is a misdemeanor.

There is no way you get a light sentence. If you look at complicity- it is as simple as having those conversations prior to the murder about murdering KB. Each time you have KK had a conversation with PF about it she was enabling and encouraging him by continuing that conversation. There have been other cases in Colorado where the secondary person involved got hammered just because they discussed it. Same sentence as the one who did the deed.

Accessory- got 9 yrs after pleading down to lesser charges
Accessory gets 9 years – The Denver Post

I am sure the the verified lawyers (@riolove77 , @gitana1 , @PrairieWind ) on the site can provide better insight into this than I can

The topic was Accessory After The Fact -- and nothing else.