CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #32 *ARREST*

[Aydrianna523]

I meant people on these boards, not people who know him.

As far as the DA goes, they aren't going to tell us anything. He already said the case wouldn't be tried in the media. I respect that. We don't share things!!!!

No one is taking up a torch and pitchfork; but what people are doing is saying "Well I haven't seen any evidence, so...." But that doesn't mean there isn't any.

PF wasn't arrested on anyone's word alone. The three charges of solicitation were not based on hearsay. The two charges of murder one are not based on hearsay. There is obviously a plethora of evidence we are not privy to.

There is obviously some level of involvement from at least KK, if not another or others. But that doesn't mean KK is solely responsible and PF is being railroaded. I just don't get the insistence.

Maybe it's just me though. Obviously I'm biased from a legal standpoint.

I, as well, get perplexed at why some believe he's innocent, and it's all KK. His car was there. He told others they were broke up leading me to think he really did not have an emotional attachment to her... so it's believable he wanted her dead. He had anger issues. He had means to do it.
And of course the evidence LE has. KK doesn't sound innocent, as well, but it's a waiting game for us to see what LE has against her and if she's charged. I'm not keen on waiting but...

 

[PommyMommy]

Thank you for the clarification. So, was it JG saying that PF said that to Kelsey's mom?

No, in my take on it, JG had not talked directly with CB at that time. CB never said it, that I know of. I believe that an aunt of both JG and KB, who lives in the midwest, might have said something like that in a social media alert to truckers. She later publicly admitted that she didn't have the facts right at that time. The whole B clan seems to me to be very independent individually, but close ranks quickly when it's needed.
IMO

Pasco relatives pray for miracle as search continues for missing Colorado mother
Family of a Colorado mother missing since Thanksgiving want folks in Eastern Washington to be on the lookout, even as they try to figure out the circumstances around her disappearance.

They say it's a long shot, but she has family in Soap Lake, Wash. and authorities say her phone last pinged, or sent a signal, from an area near Gooding, Idaho.

Cousin JG of Pasco says they're grasping at straws, but right now that's all they have to go on. She says Kelsey's mom and brother are in Woodland Park searching for the 29-year-old mother.

 

[Mom24]

I DO sit closer to the jury haha. You're correct about that.

I have zero intent of intimidating ANYONE. Just expressing my opinion about why people are speculating about his complete innocence.

However, we are also NOT on the jury and do NOT have to give him the benefit of the doubt. The presumption of innocence only exists in the courtroom. And in there, the jury will have all the evidence that we don't.

Just adding, we're also not friends or family of PF and therefore not bound by emotion to buy his baloney. Interesting how those speaking in MSM for PF don't extend that same presumption of innocence to the Berreths. Even if Kelsey dumped her baby on the father and he was left to care for her, that does not warrant the taking of her life. Even if they had broken it off in January, that doesn't warrant the taking of her life. That's why I've said before, when you cut through all the rumors PF put out there, it doesn't matter because it doesn't absolve him of planning Kelsey's murder for months and eventually killing her. I don't care if they broke up in January last year, or on Thanksgiving day or whether they ever had a relationship beyond a one night stand, he had no right to deprive an otherwise healthy young vibrant woman the right to a fulfilling life and the right of that baby to know her mother.
So if presumption means that all we can believe is what PF spread around town, then I'd call that blind ignorance because that same presumption applies to what has been said by KB's family and friends as well.

 

[CDB]

By rule, pilots should file a flight plan for every flight, but many private pilots of small planes don't. There is no enforcement Likewise, there are seven classes of airfield/airport ranging from 1st (Denver International) to 7 (bladed strip, windsock, rudimentary safety elements for takeoff and landing). Point A to Point B can be from ranch to ranch. There are thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of small planes hangered or tied down across the west. If a small plane has the right navigation/communication system, it will be tracked and can be identified by it's call sign. The night before last, I tracked one flying directly over Gooding, Idaho on planefinder.net. If it does not have the equipment, or has it turned off, it's just up there all alone, like almost like Charles Lindbergh.
IMO

In the US you are not required to file flight plans on all flights. There are two basic types of flights, VFR (visual flight rules) and IFR (instrument flight rules.) IFR always requires a flight plan, VFR only requires a flight plan when flying through specific flight control areas, such as defense zones, or highly congested commercial traffic areas.

VFR does require good visibility and daylight hours. Here is a link that outlines flight plan rules. When is a flight plan required?

 

[riolove77]

Don't forget, too, that the duty of the prosecution is not to convict, but to see that justice is done. I think we can all agree on that.

As a DA, I guarantee you I don’t forget that! However, often the two are the same.

 

[riolove77]

I don't this is the case for PF, but it happens, Matthew Shepard. The locals all know it was a drug deal gone bad whether Matthew was gay or not, first hand accounts. Horrific senseless crime but the motive was totally wrong. I know PF murdered KB and may he rot in jail, but sometimes there is truth in what the locals say.

I definitely agree with that. However, I think it’s pretty clear in this case that PF is involved.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Yeah, I felt CK was trying to portray her as flaky and impulsive - the opposite of what her life seems to indicate. That said, PF could have told CK that. I suspect that people in PF's circle didn't know Kelsey well and would believe whatever PF said.

Without proof. Yet they sure want proof that PF is anything other than a stellar guy.
MOO

 

[Seattle1]

I wonder if the other spaces were empty or the neighbors were parked in those spots. Is that parking shared with her neighbor?

PF's red truck and KB's parking lot has sure had more than it's fair share of time on this thread! Hoping to answer your question -- and add my recollection from previously cited news reports:

KB had been a resident at the E. Lake condo association for more than a year -- she initially rented a different unit, and when #269 came up for sale, she purchased it (May 2018). As there are no garages built with these units, owners most likely own/assigned 2 spaces directly in front of their units. (KB reportedly owned 2 vehicles - her own red truck, and small sedan). Guest parking is most likely delegated to the lot area furthest from the units, and closest to the road. Many photos of the parking lot in earlier threads.

Very early in the investigation, KB's unnamed neighbor was interviewed by KOAA News 5, and provided that she allegedly saw PF's own red truck on Thanksgiving, estimated between 12:30 - 1 pm. The truck was parked sideways, behind KB's own vehicles-- in a manner that would not impede coming/going traffic in the lot. Neighbor also provided this was not unusual to her based on her long time observation of PF dropping off and/or picking up their baby. Considering that PF could be carrying the child, diaper bag, carrier/seat, etc., it seems reasonable that he would not utilize guest parking, furthest away from KB's front door, for short time purpose. Again, by all reports, this was very much typical of PF when exchanging the child.
MOO

For illustration purposes only:
KB 's E. Lake Condo guest parking area.

Neighbor of missing mom Kelsey Berreth says she saw red pickup truck, possibly fiance Patrick Frazee’s, at her home the day she went missing

 

[missy1974]

I definitely agree with that. However, I think it’s pretty clear in this case that PF is involved.

I think it's clear too, but we just don't know in what capacity yet. Which leaves some wondering. Mix in this KK stuff, and to me it becomes quite clear that his defense will be "she did it". JMO

The one thing that he did, that we don't see that often in these cases is, he got an attorney right away, and didn't speak publicly, or to LE as far as we know, don't even think he talked to the family much. I know most see that as an admission of guilt, but not going to lie, if my husband mysteriously dies and they want to question me, I will probably get a lawyer first even if I didn't have anything to do with it lol JMO

 

[Concernedmamaof3]

just a tidbit of info concerning the landfill search in Fountain:
There are 24 separate parcels of land owned by various members
of the Frazee extended familiy. All in the Fountain area of El
Paso County. Some are larger acreage.
What if PF used a relative's trash bin to dispose of the body, then
the hauling company picked up the bin and took it to Fountain
Landfill. Seems possible to me.

Makes you wonder where Thanksgiving dinner was held for the F family, huh?

 

[Dave F.]

Sorry,I didn’t mean the good weather was unlikely, I meant the whole plane scenario. JMO

Sorry, I sort of agree. I think a plane scenario would certainly work for transporting a phone to the ping range of the Gooding tower, and hasn't been considered seriously. I can't see why KK would have to be in the plane, for the phone to be; but I think all of that speculation, at this point, is pretty wide open. IMO

 

[MassGuy]

Sorry, I sort of agree. I think a plane scenario would certainly work for transporting a phone to the ping range of the Gooding tower, and hasn't been considered seriously. I can't see why KK would have to be in the plane, for the phone to be; but I think all of that speculation, at this point, is pretty wide open. IMO

We may have not seriously considered it, but law enforcement knows.

I think it’s completely ridiculous, and the alternative is far more likely.

 

[Dave F.]

Guilty of the same.
For the life of me, I fail to see how parking behind someone not trying to leave, is blocking them in.
No one reported seeing KB outside trying to leave, afaik.

No one saw PF outside, trying to leave either. the neighbor next door saw a familiar red truck parked that way, from 12:30 to 1:00 pm.

 

[Dave F.]

All of this parking talk, reminded me of @mustloveco (welcome back, btw!) pictures of KB's house. Her vehicles were still not in the driveway... Would LE keep them impounded for evidence, possibly? Anyone know if that is common LE practice?

I noticed that, too! Have no idea what to make of it.

 

[Mom24]

I think it's clear too, but we just don't know in what capacity yet. Which leaves some wondering. Mix in this KK stuff, and to me it becomes quite clear that his defense will be "she did it". JMO

The one thing that he did, that we don't see that often in these cases is, he got an attorney right away, and didn't speak publicly, or to LE as far as we know, don't even think he talked to the family much. I know most see that as an admission of guilt, but not going to lie, if my husband mysteriously dies and they want to question me, I will probably get a lawyer first even if I didn't have anything to do with it lol JMO

I don't know what their defense will be, but I'm sure it will continue in the same vein it has since PF first began planning KB's death, to malign KB and somehow make her responsible.
I can't speak for others, but when PF hired an atty that didn't make him look guilty to me. What made him look guilty was his callous behavior toward what we originally thought was a missing person. You might "lawyer up" if your husband went missing, but you'd also be out there front and center begging for his return, working to answer all questions you possibly could to LE and you'd most likely round up some search parties to search the area he was last seen. PF got an atty, locked his gates, refused to meet with LE, didn't attend a single PC, didn't use social media to get her face and pic out there, didn't head out to Gooding to ask questions or call a good friend he knew out there (KK) if she could put the word out or hang some posters, and in that it was bad enough he showed no concern, his family didn't either and that indicated not only guilt but a level of disdain that was stomach turning.

 

[Lhughessk]

Don't forget, too, that the duty of the prosecution is not to convict, but to see that justice is done. I think we can all agree on that.

Yet I am amazed at how often, when a convict is found to have been innocent, the DA will go to his grave insisting that the guy did it despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. They hate to be proven wrong, and would rather see the convict quietly released as if on a technicality, rather than to man up and say, “We were wrong, and we are glad to correct that error today.”

 

[Mom24]

No one saw PF outside, trying to leave either. the neighbor next door saw a familiar red truck parked that way, from 12:30 to 1:00 pm.

Good point. A half hour seems like a long time to gather a diaper bag, a baby and a car seat. Wonder how long he would normally park to get the baby to watch while Kelsey was working in the past?

 

[GordianKnot]

That’s just public perception though, and it will have no bearing on the criminal case.

The case is being built in secrecy, and will rely on actual evidence.

We’re getting bits and pieces of dubious information from third parties. Law enforcement and the DA are likely annoyed, but it won’t change much.

We will likely see things much differently once we see the arrest affidavit.

32 days until February 19th. Save the date.

32 days until we see the affidavit, which will no doubt reveal irrefutable evidence that PF is both a complete moron, and a murderer. A regrettable combination which we see all too often here.

JMO.

 

[Dave F.]

Thank you for the information. You know a lot more about this subject than I do. I agree that those factors about forage and compaction and all that would be extremely important. I've seen horses do enormous damage to land, causing extreme erosion problems when they either eat too much grass or simply trample it down, then water that might otherwise soak in erodes the ground instead.

It is my understanding that the cattle ranged in the market area of the auction at Divide are ranged on US Forest Service permits. I imagine that the grazing rules are the same, or stricter.

 

[Artis]

Pasco relatives pray for miracle as search continues for missing Colorado mother
Family of a Colorado mother missing since Thanksgiving want folks in Eastern Washington to be on the lookout, even as they try to figure out the circumstances around her disappearance.

They say it's a long shot, but she has family in Soap Lake, Wash. and authorities say her phone last pinged, or sent a signal, from an area near Gooding, Idaho.

Cousin JG of Pasco says they're grasping at straws, but right now that's all they have to go on. She says Kelsey's mom and brother are in Woodland Park searching for the 29-year-old mother.

Thanks. Going back and looking at it, it appears that the official info released said PF told CB he hadn't seen Kelsey since Thanksgiving, didn't know where she was and got an alleged text three days later, the contents of which were never revealed (and we all know is BS, anyway).