CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #41 *ARREST*

[ab01]

The number one thing old farmers would do to disintegrate things in a burn barrel that is left over after several times of burning. Ie things that didn’t burn very well, they would very commonly pour old used motor oil on top and burn it. to burn it down to ash and make more room. Ok I’m moving on sorry for off topic. Anyways I don’t see any reason to doubt that pf burned kB in that trough and I believe LE is convinced he did as well. Moo

 

[Hatfield]

A burn barrel contains the fire, gets hotter, lessens smoke production. No one in a drought area is burning without a burn barrel.

How to Make a Burn Barrel - Burn Safe with Less Smoke

I have used burn barrels many times and they do work pretty well but the stuff at very bottom has to be stirred otherwise you dont get a clean burn of everything.

I call them 55 gallon drums. And in order to get good air circulation the only good way to put holes in the can is by firing a gun at the drum to put holes around it at the bottom. I first tried drilling the holes with a drill but that doesnt work because those 55 gallon drums are way too thick heavy guage metal.

Im not sure what he used to burn her in but I think a trough may actually be a little better to give him room to stir things. If he was only dousing things with the oil and gas then a trough may have been what he used.

There would definitetly be black burn marks on whatever he used so unless the trough has burn marks then it would not have been the burn container.

 

[PrairieWind]

Here’s another thing I don’t get with these dumbasses: Since this was obviously premeditated, why did PF do this in the house, and in that manner, where there would be so much blood evidence? I mean, there are a million other places and ways he could have done this which would potentially bode better for him, evidence wise.

IMO PF enjoyed the sick game and brutality, he was obsessed with this “beating” thing considering the second and third solications.

Those poor animals in his care.

I don't really understand this manner of killing her either. She was tiny, he is a rancher. He could easily have just strangled her. No blood/mess. Or he could have done this somewhere outside her home, then there is no "crime scene" to process. Since he had been planning it for some time, I can't believe he didn't actually have a better plan. But that something went wrong and for some reason he "needed" to do it right then/there.

 

[oviedo]

I assume everything she has said to be false.

para 41 from the affidavit - KK and PF were in communication during the trip back to ID - I'm not reading where they had further communication but I think they did IMO. Para 47 - LE says KK's "statements are unreliable at best". I think they recognized she was a liar but sifted through what details she did provide and matched them to what evidence they had - and PF was arrested. Time will tell if this was the best outcome but we know CB has the baby - so there's that. JMO
ETA spelling

 

[1mtroyal]

I wasn't impressed with the R's (the attorney couple that KK's friend confided in), but I have to say, I can understand why Mrs. R said what she did. She said that PF must have some kind of inexplicable hold over KK because nothing else made sense.

I don't think she meant blackmail, but I also think she recognized that it was more than just being head-over-heels in love.

Three trips to Colorado to try to kill KB, once by poisoning, and twice by blunt force - after driving for hours and having plenty of time to think about it? Yeah, that is just so hard to understand.

He tells her she has a mess to clean up and her answer is 'yes, master?' This tough rodeo cowgirl?

BTW...I really hope the prosecution is going to ask KK to explain what she meant when she told her friend that she thought PF had killed before.

I think that might be in reference to PF telling the nurse to hit her in the back of the head, its easier than you think (not his exact words). (Indicates PF has done this before)

 

[Elley Mae]

It is extremely hard to absorb KK's involvement, especially since she lived so far away. She was safe to contact LE at any point. She was educated, had a job - she didn't "need" PF. And, I find it extremely disturbing that she was willing to be part of killing a mother when she herself is a mother of young children. Even if she hated KB, surely she realized that killing a toddler's mother is cruel to the child.

I really haven't wrapped my head around it, though reading yesterday's news made it clear that KK was definitely involved.

What a waste she made of her life.

jmo

And just think had this horrific murder went unsolved she would end up raising Baby K.

 

[Herat]

I don't really understand this manner of killing her either. She was tiny, he is a rancher. He could easily have just strangled her. No blood/mess. Or he could have done this somewhere outside her home, then there is no "crime scene" to process. Since he had been planning it for some time, I can't believe he didn't actually have a better plan. But that something went wrong and for some reason he "needed" to do it right then/there.

Maybe the “something that went wrong” was that KK wasn’t going to be in WP on T-Day to assist or clean up whatever else PF was planning..... like disposing of KB if he killed her Thanksgiving Eve out in a pasture......

 

[Julia966]

I don't really understand this manner of killing her either. She was tiny, he is a rancher. He could easily have just strangled her. No blood/mess. Or he could have done this somewhere outside her home, then there is no "crime scene" to process. Since he had been planning it for some time, I can't believe he didn't actually have a better plan. But that something went wrong and for some reason he "needed" to do it right then/there.

I think whacking a blindfolded, unaware person with a bat is far easier than strangling someone. Strangulation is difficult and takes longer than people think. And he didn't have to worry about the blood; he had KK to clean it up.

 

[MassGuy]

I don't really understand this manner of killing her either. She was tiny, he is a rancher. He could easily have just strangled her. No blood/mess. Or he could have done this somewhere outside her home, then there is no "crime scene" to process. Since he had been planning it for some time, I can't believe he didn't actually have a better plan. But that something went wrong and for some reason he "needed" to do it right then/there.

Don’t forget though, two of the plans that he came up with for KK to execute, involved beating Kelsey to death.

I don’t think he had a better plan.

 

[ajaylee]

I think some may be overestimating an RN's murder scene cleaning skills. RN's receive OSHA training in how to contain and dispose of a small bio-hazard spill. If there's a spill larger than what can be contained in a few disposable towels and some disinfectant spray, Environmental Services are called. Hospitals take bio-hazards very seriously and have strict rules on how to deal with it.

Or KK is over-stating how much blood there was.

 

[Trudie]

I wasn't impressed with the R's (the attorney couple that KK's friend confided in), but I have to say, I can understand why Mrs. R said what she did. She said that PF must have some kind of inexplicable hold over KK because nothing else made sense.

I don't think she meant blackmail, but I also think she recognized that it was more than just being head-over-heels in love.

Three trips to Colorado to try to kill KB, once by poisoning, and twice by blunt force - after driving for hours and having plenty of time to think about it? Yeah, that is just so hard to understand.

He tells her she has a mess to clean up and her answer is 'yes, master?' This tough rodeo cowgirl?

BTW...I really hope the prosecution is going to ask KK to explain what she meant when she told her friend that she thought PF had killed before.

I remember Mrs. R pausing when asked if she thought KKL committed murder. Finally “no, I don’t think so”, in response. Iirc

 

[Herat]

I think whacking a blindfolded, unaware person with a bat is far easier than strangling someone. Strangulation is difficult and takes longer than people think. And he didn't have to worry about the blood; he had KK to clean it up.

On T-Day - How did he know that KK was going to clean up the mess>

 

[Hatfield]

JMO
Regarding trying to burn a body fully.

I have shared before how I once tested if I could burn bones down to ash because I had to get rid of a dead possum that some other animal attacked and left in my yard. I had been burning tree limbs and had a very large open fire going of tree limbs. The fire I had going at the time was really large about 8 foot diameter or so and flames were shooting up about 10-15 feet. So it was a really big open fire.

I put the dead possum in one of the hottest parts of the fire where white hot ash was. It took about 1-2 hours and a little stirring and I was surprised that it was reduced to nothing but ash. I actually thought there would be some of the larger skull bones left but no, the whole thing was nothing but ash and that surprised me.

With that said though, I think a human skull and other large human bones would be much more difficult to get all the way to ash and I think that is why KK has said that PF had to remove what was left and got rid of it elsewwhere. I dont think PF managed to burn everything to ash. I suspect the skull and larger bones he had to dump elsewhere. Whether that ended up at the dump or somewhere else I do think there are remains that could be found. Probably not much but some remains like the skull and maybe some larger bones were probably dumped by PF and company (kk?).

 

[raja]

I feel he did plan to kill her the night before or early morning. The problem was he could not look in her eyes. I think I read that is why he told KK he had to blindfold her. How do you get her to blindfold herself in a cow field?

 

[MassGuy]

I think whacking a blindfolded, unaware person with a bat is far easier than strangling someone. Strangulation is difficult and takes longer than people think. And he didn't have to worry about the blood; he had KK to clean it up.

Chris Watts had no issue with strangling Shanann to death.

It’s quite easy, as long as you know what you’re doing. Unconsciousness comes quickly, and it’s just a matter of maintaining pressure.

Scott Peterson may have also used this method.

 

[oviedo]

Besides the Amended Complaint and the Affidavit - does the defense have any other evidence yet? I know they are awaiting test results from items still - but when they get those, they have to share them with the defense and will those be entered into the court docket or do we have to wait for a media request? anyone know how this works? We don't do any criminal litigation - so have no idea.

 

[InvSmith]

Hi Everyone, This is my first post on WS. I have been following since the Watts murders.
I was wondering if anyone has seen the photo of PF when he returned to KB place at 1:24 pm. The info says the neighbor said someone who looked like PF but shouldn't he also have been carrying the baby. The info never mentioned the baby.

As you organize this, it is obvious LE have him captured committing the murder within a tight timeline. What is still astounding is why he thought in the middle of the day he could walk in and brutally kill someone. At some point, this case would move from missing person to suspect. He was going to be obviously the suspect. Even without (no matter what the DA claims) the former nurse, PF was going to be tracked via cell data, Safeway, cameras, blood, etc. What you have to be careful of is letting someone tell you this is how it happened and matching the facts to that story. You can see they have tried to not do that with KK.

 

[ajaylee]

The number one thing old farmers would do to disintegrate things in a burn barrel that is left over after several times of burning. Ie things that didn’t burn very well, they would very commonly pour old used motor oil on top and burn it. to burn it down to ash and make more room. Ok I’m moving on sorry for off topic. Anyways I don’t see any reason to doubt that pf burned kB in that trough and I believe LE is convinced he did as well. Moo

Thanks for that. I've had a burn barrel, never heard of using used motor oil as an accelerant. It kind of jumped out at me when KK mentioned PF poured both the five gallons of gasoline and oil over the tote with (we assume) KB's body.

 

[Deleted member 718]

Perhaps there was blood in his pickup and the mop was used there.

"Defense attorneys also highlighted a lack of blood or other physical evidence detected in Frazee’s truck..."

Cops: Man tied sweater around fiancee's face, beat her to death with bat before burning body

 

[MassGuy]

Besides the Amended Complaint and the Affidavit - does the defense have any other evidence yet? I know they are awaiting test results from items still - but when they get those, they have to share them with the defense and will those be entered into the court docket or do we have to wait for a media request? anyone know how this works? We don't do any criminal litigation - so have no idea.

Yeah, they were just given over 3000 pages of discovery.

The defense will be privy to testing results and that sort of thing, as the prosecution receives it.

We will not have access to that stuff, until after trial.

That’s evidence.