CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #42 *ARREST*

[v0x]

I thought so, too, but I can't find anything to back it up, where I read it. That's why this is bothering me so much.

Maybe you saw it on FB. See attached.

 

[WhimsicalWillow]

I don't think KK killed KB but was willing to follow any other orders except for committing the murder herself. I honestly believe that KK was so in love with PF that she obeyed him.

Google the Milgram Experiment. In the 1960s, Milgram, a Yale psychologist, performed a controversial study to understand how participants reacted when an authority figure told them to obey him by delivering electric shocks, even fatal shocks, to someone screaming in pain (it was fake). Shockingly, most people obeyed.

"The Milgram experiment on obedience to authority figures was a series of social psychology experiments conducted by Yale Universitypsychologist Stanley Milgram. They measured the willingness of study participants, men from a diverse range of occupations with varying levels of education, to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts conflicting with their personal conscience. Participants were led to believe that they were assisting an unrelated experiment, in which they had to administer electric shocks to a "learner." These fake electric shocks gradually increased to levels that would have been fatal had they been real.[2]

The experiment found, unexpectedly, that a very high proportion of men would fully obey the instructions, albeit reluctantly. Milgram first described his research in a 1963 article in the Journal of Abnormal and Social Psychology[1] and later discussed his findings in greater depth in his 1974 book, Obedience to Authority: An Experimental View.[3]"

Milgram experiment - Wikipedia

 

[windrower]

(respectfully shortened)

Yep. When she learned KK's rival was missing and discovered one of her bullets was missing, don't you know she freaked out. Imagine wondering if a dead woman will turn up with a bullet inside her skull that could be linked to your gun.

Yes. But the car was borrowed on the 23rd, and all indications are that Kelsey was murdered on the 22nd.

I believe from the evidence presented so far that KK arrived in WP on the 24th. But nothing was stopping her from shooting at KB's body when KK went with PF to move the black tote (with KB's body inside) from the Nash Ranch barn to the Frazee property.

I think MG should be nervous about her missing bullet. I hope she's nervous about the whole convenient "coincidence" of loaning her car, because that means she also loaned her pistol, which "just happened" to be in the car's glove box.

I'm hoping quite a few more shoes will drop.

 

[v0x]

I think it's a possiblity that KK could've been waiting outside of KB's home in another car while PF entered KB's home and killed her. However, I don't think KK killed KB. I honestly believe that KK was so in love with PF that she obeyed him.

Google the Milgram Experiment. In the 1960s, Milgram, a Yale psychologist, performed a controversial study to understand how participants reacted when an authority figure told them to obey him by delivering electric shocks, even fatal shocks, to someone screaming in pain (it was fake). Shockingly, most people obeyed.

"The Milgram experiment on obedience to authority figures was a series of social psychology experiments conducted by Yale Universitypsychologist Stanley Milgram. They measured the willingness of study participants, men from a diverse range of occupations with varying levels of education, to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts conflicting with their personal conscience. Participants were led to believe that they were assisting an unrelated experiment, in which they had to administer electric shocks to a "learner." These fake electric shocks gradually increased to levels that would have been fatal had they been real.[2]

The experiment found, unexpectedly, that a very high proportion of men would fully obey the instructions, albeit reluctantly. Milgram first described his research in a 1963 article in the Journal of Abnormal and Social Psychology[1] and later discussed his findings in greater depth in his 1974 book, Obedience to Authority: An Experimental View.[3]"

Milgram experiment - Wikipedia

She wasn’t there that day

 

[MyBelle]

You are intentionally ignoring the evidence presented at the hearing:

• At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number, also in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. He receive a return call from this number a few minutes later. It hit off the same tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Shortly after, he received a call from that same number. Slater says it pinged off a tower in Divide.
• Referencing the Idaho number belonged to KK, state asks if PF contacting that number became important, knowing that was near the last ping of KB’s phone. Slater said yes, then they tried contacting her.
• CBI agent testified that at 4:24 p.m. on Nov. 22 PF’s phone called his mother. At 4:37 p.m. it called KK. Cell towers show he was southwest of KB‘s home.

 

[Trocroc9]

I don't think KK killed KB but was willing to follow any other orders except for committing the murder herself. I honestly believe that KK was so in love with PF that she obeyed him.

Google the Milgram Experiment. In the 1960s, Milgram, a Yale psychologist, performed a controversial study to understand how participants reacted when an authority figure told them to obey him by delivering electric shocks, even fatal shocks, to someone screaming in pain (it was fake). Shockingly, most people obeyed.

"The Milgram experiment on obedience to authority figures was a series of social psychology experiments conducted by Yale Universitypsychologist Stanley Milgram. They measured the willingness of study participants, men from a diverse range of occupations with varying levels of education, to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts conflicting with their personal conscience. Participants were led to believe that they were assisting an unrelated experiment, in which they had to administer electric shocks to a "learner." These fake electric shocks gradually increased to levels that would have been fatal had they been real.[2]

The experiment found, unexpectedly, that a very high proportion of men would fully obey the instructions, albeit reluctantly. Milgram first described his research in a 1963 article in the Journal of Abnormal and Social Psychology[1] and later discussed his findings in greater depth in his 1974 book, Obedience to Authority: An Experimental View.[3]"

Milgram experiment - Wikipedia

I respectfully think the opposite. I think he killed kB for KK. I think she had a strange hold on him. If you look at both of their mugshots you will see her strength and his weakness.

 

[v0x]

• At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number, also in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. He receive a return call from this number a few minutes later. It hit off the same tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Shortly after, he received a call from that same number. Slater says it pinged off a tower in Divide.
• Referencing the Idaho number belonged to KK, state asks if PF contacting that number became important, knowing that was near the last ping of KB’s phone. Slater said yes, then they tried contacting her.
• CBI agent testified that at 4:24 p.m. on Nov. 22 PF’s phone called his mother. At 4:37 p.m. it called KK. Cell towers show he was southwest of KB‘s home.

Where is this sourced from? Link?

 

[Steelslady]

I believe from the evidence presented so far that KK arrived in WP on the 24th. But nothing was stopping her from shooting at KB's body when KK went with PF to move the black tote (with KB's body inside) from the Nash Ranch barn to the Frazee property.

I think MG should be nervous about her missing bullet. I hope she's nervous about the whole convenient "coincidence" of loaning her car, because that means she also loaned her pistol, which "just happened" to be in the car's glove box.

I'm hoping quite a few more shoes will drop.

Well, why would she shoot Kelsey's body if she was already deceased? Something is very hinky about that, I admit. Looks like she took at shot at someone or something, but what would be the purpose of shooting a dead body in a tote? Cripes, I hope Kelsey wasn't still alive and unconscious in that tote- this case has made me sick enough, with the other details we learned about.

 

[Artis]

Then everybody lied for her and said she was in Idaho when she wasn't.Her family lied and said she was at thanksgiving. Cell phone ping data was wrong saying that she was in Idaho. Her friend lied about the day and time she picked up the borrowed car. I guess expect a lot more people to be charged....MOO

What cell phone ping data was that because I didn't read that.

KK's mouthpieces knew a murder was being planned and none of said jack about it until after the fact. One them, knowing about the murder plot, loaned her a vehicle with a loaded weapon in it. If the rest of her crew are anything these people, forgive me if I question anything they say. In a situation such as this, it is not unreasonable to follow every assertion with, PROVE IT.

 

[MyBelle]

She wasn’t there that day

If KK wasn't there, who was communicating with PF from Idaho that day? Mr. Potato Head? LE says it was KK. Are they lying?

• At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number, also in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. He receive a return call from this number a few minutes later. It hit off the same tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Shortly after, he received a call from that same number. Slater says it pinged off a tower in Divide.
• Referencing the Idaho number belonged to KK, state asks if PF contacting that number became important, knowing that was near the last ping of KB’s phone. Slater said yes, then they tried contacting her.
• CBI agent testified that at 4:24 p.m. on Nov. 22 PF’s phone called his mother. At 4:37 p.m. it called KK. Cell towers show he was southwest of KB‘s home.

 

[Liadan]

So just catching up with this thread after many weeks. I am so incredibly sad and truly lost for words. That splendid, high achieving, loving, family woman, with the world at her feet, Kelsey, was beaten to death AT HER HOME in the most horrific and malevolent way by a man who basically had zero skill at being a cowboy and training ranch dogs.

Then she was allegedly burnt at the PF ranch, while her aggressors rifled through her belongings and took great lengths to de-identify her remains. Not only that but this disposal was witnessed by the agressors mother who had to have had some idea of the stench that was coming from the fire on the property was not just burning of plant material but the tell tale sign of flesh being cremated. Yet, no report! Nada - I am speechless. PF's mother was 'supposedly' surprised by the intensity of blaze? WTAF?????

Lets hope mom Frazee has not covered any further for her son's depraved and disgusting act. And on what planet could a judge award custody of that sweet child to a family who was complicit in the act of killing her mother!

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Where did you read that about the body bag placed on the floor near the car? I agree that seems like a detail he wouldn't even focus on to relate to her.

It was posted on twitter by a reporter who was covering the preliminary hearing. It may also be in news articles.

 

[MassGuy]

You are intentionally ignoring the evidence presented at the hearing:

• At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number, also in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. He receive a return call from this number a few minutes later. It hit off the same tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Shortly after, he received a call from that same number. Slater says it pinged off a tower in Divide.
• Referencing the Idaho number belonged to KK, state asks if PF contacting that number became important, knowing that was near the last ping of KB’s phone. Slater said yes, then they tried contacting her.
• CBI agent testified that at 4:24 p.m. on Nov. 22 PF’s phone called his mother. At 4:37 p.m. it called KK. Cell towers show he was southwest of KB‘s home.

You are misreading this. Slater is talking about PF’s phone, and his phone activity.

He is talking about the location of PF’s phone pings.

He is driving with Kelsey’s phone and his phone, from Kelsey’s house (after killing her).

When she calls him back from HER Idaho number, his phone pings off a tower in Divide.

The bolded position pertains to a completely different part of his testimony, when the link is made between KK’s phone, and Kelsey’s phone, as she is driving back from Colorado, to Idaho.

 

[MyBelle]

Where is this sourced from? Link?

See page one. A member here, Tippy, actually took notes.

 

[Eevie]

Deleted by me, MassGuy kindly explained the facts above.

 

[windrower]

Kelsey Berreth case timeline: Everything we know so far

Nov. 22, 2018
1 – 4 a.m.: Investigators found that there were at least seven contacts made between Frazee and Berreth’s cell phones between these hours, including a four-minute phone call that happened around 1:42 a.m.

9 – 10 a.m.: Cell phone records show Berreth text messaged Frazee at 9:37 a.m. and that the two spoke on the phone for about 3 ½ minutes around 9:40 a.m.

12:27 p.m.: Berreth and her daughter are captured on a surveillance camera at the Safeway in Woodland Park leaving the store. Receipts from the store and her home corroborated she was there at that time.

12:31 and 12:33 p.m.: Frazee calls Berreth's cell phone in a 35-second call, and there is an incoming call from Berreth to Frazee listed as 8 seconds in length in the affidavit. The affidavit says that both of their cell phones connected to the same cell tower in Woodland Park

12:41 p.m.: A text message was exchanged between Berreth and Frazee.

12:54 – 1:17 p.m.: Frazee was captured on surveillance video at the Walmart in Woodland Park carrying a baby carrier with a blanket similar to the one seen in the Safeway footage. Investigators wrote in the affidavit that they believe their 1-year-old daughter was in the carrier at the time.

Frazee said he met with Berreth in an alleyway outside her home in Woodland Park to exchange the child just beforehand, which investigators said they believe did occur. This is the last time that Frazee reportedly saw Berreth alive, and he told investigators that while they exchanged their daughter, he returned some of her belongings, including a handgun, keys and other items – which have so far not been recovered.

1:24 p.m.: A person matching Frazee’s description is captured entering the front door of Berreth’s apartment on a neighbor’s surveillance camera – which investigators said contradicted what Frazee had told them about a timeline on that day.

Afternoon: Investigators believe this is when Frazee allegedly killed Berreth inside her apartment, then took her cell phone when he left. Investigators allege that he blindfolded Berreth and asked her to smell a scented candle, then beat her to death with a baseball bat. They say that Kenney was aware because Frazee told her about it.

Cell tower records show that Frazee’s phone was connected to the tower serving Berreth’s apartment from approximately 1 p.m. to 4:30 p.m. that day.

3:36 p.m.: That same neighbor’s surveillance camera again captures images of a person that matches Frazee’s description at Berreth’s home. Frazee called his mother, Sheila, and Kenney at this time, according to his phone records. This is the beginning of when Frazee allegedly started carrying out his “scheme,” as the affidavit calls it, of using his and Berreth’s phones to try and “distract law enforcement, distort the actual date of [Berreth’s] appearance, and separate himself as a suspect in a murder investigation.”

Kenney told investigators that Frazee called her and told her to come to Colorado because she “had a mess to clean up.” She told investigators that she understood that meant that Berreth had been killed.

Evening hours: Both Frazee’s and Berreth’s cell phones were connected with cell towers near Cripple Creek, traveling in the same direction and similar distances from the towers. “This would indicate the phones were likely traveling together,” Frazee’s affidavit says. The affidavit says the two cell phones stayed together for the entirety of Nov. 22-24.

Ah, the timeline.

Also to be noted: PF's brother Sean told LE that he (Sean) arrived at the Frazee home on Thanksgiving Day about 2:30 p.m., and that PF arrived soon after. (I don't recall Baby K being mentioned. And I'll look for link to SF interview, which took place at a Five Guys in Colorado Springs, iirc.)

Florissant and Frazee home are 15+miles from Woodland Park and KB townhouse.

I hope the timeline continues to tighten around his neck.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

Where did you read that about the body bag placed on the floor near the car? I agree that seems like a detail he wouldn't even focus on to relate to her.

Live blog: Patrick Frazee appears in court for preliminary hearing

 

[v0x]

You are intentionally ignoring the evidence presented at the hearing:

• At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number, also in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. He receive a return call from this number a few minutes later. It hit off the same tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Shortly after, he received a call from that same number. Slater says it pinged off a tower in Divide.
• Referencing the Idaho number belonged to KK, state asks if PF contacting that number became important, knowing that was near the last ping of KB’s phone. Slater said yes, then they tried contacting her.
• CBI agent testified that at 4:24 p.m. on Nov. 22 PF’s phone called his mother. At 4:37 p.m. it called KK. Cell towers show he was southwest of KB‘s home.

I see you’ve edited your original post. I’m not ignoring evidence presented at the hearing, I’m posting evidence reported, and presented at the hearing. Again, please link to your source of information.

 

[gitana1]

definitely
as per my post I think it was a good decision the DA made just in hindsight wish they held out a little longer to get more dirt on her.
conspiracy would have been fine with me!

Of course. But that would be the best case scenario. If they got more they'd probably try to plea down to accessory.

I think the baby being in his custody may have made them decide to try to wrap things up. That and the fact that creepy witnesses were starting to talk publicly and they'd probably done as much forensically as they could with phone and internet records.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

You are intentionally ignoring the evidence presented at the hearing:

• At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number, also in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. He receive a return call from this number a few minutes later. It hit off the same tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Shortly after, he received a call from that same number. Slater says it pinged off a tower in Divide.
• Referencing the Idaho number belonged to KK, state asks if PF contacting that number became important, knowing that was near the last ping of KB’s phone. Slater said yes, then they tried contacting her.
• CBI agent testified that at 4:24 p.m. on Nov. 22 PF’s phone called his mother. At 4:37 p.m. it called KK. Cell towers show he was southwest of KB‘s home.

Wow. Wow. Wow. Is that poor semantics or is this saying the Idaho number was a phone located SW of KB's townhome?