CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #46*ARREST*

[Aydrianna523]

I just finished reading this. No mention of blood on the bathroom ceiling. Was it in the affidavit perhaps?
Courtroom updates: Preliminary hearing for Patrick Frazee, who is accused of killing Kelsey Berreth

 

[marchioness96]

Unless she stumbled around or ran for a short time.

Oh lord. I can't even go there. Poor, poor Kelsey. What a colossal waste of her life, and for what?

All due to a narcissist's need for control - over his environment and the women around him though not, clearly, over himself.

My profound hope is that he never tastes freedom again. As for KK, it's a deal with the devil, but one I think there's no real alternative for.

I can only hope that Kelsey's remains are found so that her family can have that comfort at the very least.

 

[Artis]

It wasn’t KK’s preliminary hearing; it was PF’s.

I think that question was asked, though, and the answer was no. Someone better organized than I probably has it.

 

[ab01]

I don't believe PF loves or cares for ANY woman. I do believe that he cares about his money. The wrongful death lawsuit states "custody". I think PF knew he was going to have to pay child support for 18 years and fought that idea everyway he could. When he realized he was not going to manipulate KB. He eliminated her. He did not love his daughter, he didn't want the financial burden that was about to happen

Oh ....I think he has a very close attachment to one woman....

 

[ajaylee]

Sure enough, that came from her mom:

During the investigation, Berreth’s mother told Slater that Frazee had taken her daughter’s gun because the couple was arguing about finances. During one of those arguments in 2017, Berreth said, “Maybe I would be better off dead,” and pointed the gun to her head.

Patrick Frazee to face trial after preliminary hearing

It's not clear, to me, whether Kelsy told CB that or PF did but I'd think CB would have asked Kelsey about it so it must have been happened. How terribly sad that Kelsey was driven to such despair.

It's not clear to me when PF told CB this, because I agree, although CB would want to respect her daughter's privacy and not badger her about things like being engaged or getting married, I absolutely believe she would have brought this up with KB.

It's also completely inconsistent, something PF seems to specialize in. He claims he took it in early 2017. After she 'disappears', he tells her boss at work that she's been having drug and alcohol problems.

Only an idiot would allegedly keep someone's firearm for months for their own safety and then give it back to them shortly after they've sought treatment for anxiety/depression and at a time when they are supposedly having major drug/alcohol problems and threatening the safety and well-being of her child.

If PF told CB this recently, then I believe it was a complete lie.

I question whether he ever had her gun before he killed her. After all, he could have taken it after he killed her.

 

[marchioness96]

I dunno, I buy that story, as it was coming from CB via KB.

It corresponds to the timing of her seeking mental health help, and that custody document found in the Frazee home.

I could see PF encouraging her though; “You won’t do it!”

Do we know for a fact that KB told this anecdote to her mom, or is it yet another story filtered through PF? I wasn't sure that we'd had clarification on that.

Also, I was under the impression that he took the gun away from her in early 2017, but wasn't it August 2018 that she went for treatment for her depression?

As usual, it's entirely possible I'm completely off in my recollections.

The whole incident (and the fake text about getting the gun back) is just one more bizarre detail in this case. IMO and MOO

Edited for clarification

 

[OldLadyBlues]

I'm not sure they do. It looks like there's spots here and there, across at least three rooms, but KK cleaned up most of what would be visible.

I'm assuming they used more than eyes on detection to pick up the spatter. Depending on what they used, Bluestar not only picks up spatter but can pick up bleach as well. That would certainly give the CSI a good idea just HOW violent this beating was.
MOO, MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Do we know for a fact that KB told this anecdote to her mom, or is it yet another story filtered through PF? I wasn't sure that we'd had clarification on that.

Also, I was under the impression that he took the gun away from her in early 2017, but wasn't it August 2018 that she went for treatment for her depression?

As usual, it's entirely possible I'm completely off in my recollections.

The whole incident (and the fake text about getting the gun back) is just one more bizarre detail in this case. IMO and MOO

Edited for clarification

Correct. Her gun was (allegedly) taken from her by PF, on New Year’s Day 2017, and supposedly given back on Thanksgiving.

You are also correct about her treatment occurring in August of 2018.

So I was wrong, the timing of the gun being taken away, doesn’t correspond to the August treatment.

 

[OldLadyBlues]

Thanks for the link. Something jumps out at me and I don't believe I've read it anywhere else. It implies PF was in the townhouse during the time KK was there cleaning. Has anyone else reported it this way? I know it was difficult to hear in the courtroom.

He said Kenney helped Patrick Frazee clean up the entire bloody scene, but she said she intentionally left blood splatters for law enforcement to find.

Unless it's a reference in KKs testimony that she found where PF tried to clean up with baby wipes. MOO

 

[ajaylee]

Correct. Her gun was taken from her by PF, on New Year’s Day 2017, and supposedly given back on Thanksgiving.

You are also correct about her treatment occurring in August of 2018.

So I was wrong, the timing of the gun being taken away, doesn’t correspond to the August treatment.

I don't know that we know that the gun was ever taken away or that KB ever pointed it at her head.

Does anyone recall KB's pregnancy dates? I wonder if she was pregnant when she allegedly pointed the gun at her head?

 

[MassGuy]

I don't know that we know that the gun was ever taken away or that KB ever pointed it at her head.

Yeah. It’s murky at best.

We don’t know what came from CB via Kelsey, or from CB via PF.

Only one of those two is trustworthy, and she is dead.

 

[ajaylee]

Yeah. It’s murky at best.

We don’t know what came from CB via Kelsey, or from CB via PF.

Only one of those two is trustworthy, and she is dead.

The only way I would believe it is if KB herself talked about it to CB - and not by text or email.

 

[lindaromas]

I saw a 4 pack on Walmart site with silver/grey clip handles but they looked really small. If you could see all the plastic totes I have! 6 on my patio mainly storing my grandkids toys

Here's the 4 pack https://www.walmart.com/ip/Sterilit...hguid=8f1b1ab7-9fb-169302794247dc&athena=true

 

[acutename]

I will hide with you because here I go again...how did PF get the bat into KB’s townhouse?

he seems to have had keys to the place (?); he said he was returning them, so unless that was a double lie, he had keys, so he could have just put it in a closet or carried it in in a bag with clothing and other items.

 

[Dave F.]

It goes to show you there are different tweets or some have been corrected because I understood it I thought as she went the night before Thanksgiving (no idea alone or not), and that it came from a call between KB and CB. So quite different accounts. That audio in that courtroom may be the cause...


Interestingly enough, I just reread the affidavit for the 3rd of 4th time and some of my thoughts were put to rest. Each time I pick up something else, notice what may be missing, etc. I am now satisfied with some things and believe there is likely more. However, I now have a new question or two and a severe headache from trying to tie it all together.

One question is did KK live in Utah at the time of these murders when she referenced it as home (paragraph 35)? I realize this is her lying period of time to LE but it has also been referenced somewhere that she had things for cleaning from painting their new home. I have always assumed when seeing PF she was driving from Colorado, the 12 hour trip. Utah was also the last place she turned on KB's phone allegedly. Did they just recently move to Idaho?

So it put much to rest, hinted at other things unknown and more evidence which was encouraging but created new questions. I get that not all goes into such a document but I am always trying to connect dots

KKL did NOT live in Utah at any time. The mention in Item 35 makes no sense, except that she clearly returned to Idaho through Utah. KKL has always lived in Twin Falls county, at various locations south of the city of Twin Falls. Her separation and divorce seems to have been a slow motion process, possibly executed in reverse, but the recent move that is mentioned in the affidavit was from the residence of her ex to the address listed in the complaint against her. IMO

 

[ilovechili]

KK lived in Idaho at the time of the murder. She went through Utah on her way home and Salt Lake City was one of the places she turned KB's phone on.

Google Maps

I had heard that but so then you think the Utah reference as home in the affidavit is a typo then?

 

[Auntie Cipation]

BBM. If a stranger came to my front door to thank me for returning her lost dogs, I would be frightened because I would know I never returned her dogs. I certainly wouldn't drink the coffee.

Plus, KK made two more trips to KB's but she abandoned the drug idea after the first visit. The next two were pipe and ball bat. Maybe they were caught on the neighbor's camera and warned KK? That is certainly something KB would discuss with her mom.

I'm not sure KB was even aware of KK's attempts #2 and #3. I don't think I've read that they had any interactions, other than KK apparently noticing that she and KB drove past each other as KK was driving out to the ranch after chickening out on that attempt.

Thank you so much.

The info leaves only a couple of possibilities and I am not going to go there at the moment. A Toyota. Truck at KB's.

There were mentions of PF having an ancient Toyota pickup which was used to bring the body from the hay pile back to the ranch. Maybe at some point on the 24th PF came to the townhome in the 2008 Toyota while KK was cleaning, or just in time for Sonic, and left it there and rode with her back to the ranch where they switched to the old Toyota to then go get the body? At some point then, either before the burn, after the burn, or the next morning before she hit the road, they had to go retrieve his truck at the townhome. JMO MOO

 

[QueenBofOB]

That is stunningly horrific. I can't fathom PF and KK just standing by and watching such a fire.

It absolutely SICKENS me, to know that there are such callous, cruel, demented humans capable of such depravity.

 

[Dave F.]

I don't know that we know that the gun was ever taken away or that KB ever pointed it at her head.

Does anyone recall KB's pregnancy dates? I wonder if she was pregnant when she allegedly pointed the gun at her head?

KB had the baby in October 2017.....at keast three months before the alleged incident. IMO

 

[acutename]

I'm not sure KK ever actually saw her body. Or, at least, she hasn't said so. Just the tote with the silver handles , the blood and a heap.

But yeah, it's incredible. And even if she had seen KB, it probably would not have any difference.

KK says that she never saw the body; just the tote, FWIW