CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #51 *ARREST*

[NanZDrew]

The evidence points to one person, PF.

He lied about when he last saw Kelsey, returning to the house.

He then spent two days with her phone, sending text messages and making phone calls from the same location.

We have a solid time period when Kelsey was killed, a time period that puts KK in Idaho at the time.

Law enforcement would have vetted her account, and verified her location.

You don’t ever take a liar at their word.

KK was in my opinion, fully capable of murder.

But if she ain’t there, she ain’t there.

Yeah! It's hard to find a black cat in a dark room, especially if the cat isn't there!

 

[NanZDrew]

Welcome @keminoak we try to keep it real in here, every now and then a couple of us myself including, go off on a wild goose chase just to keep it interesting , another member usually jerks us back to the reality of the facts.
KK put a target on her back when she admitted to driving 1600 x 3 to attempt to kill KB, she made herself a pariah and easy to dislike. She has proven not to be a good person on more than one occasion. I will add PF must be the best manipulator to date in this case. The power he had over the women in his life is hard to understand, he is a average looking Joe, nothing to write home about. IMO he is cowboy charming at first until he gets them hooked then the real PF takes over, we all know how the best of the best young woman ended up that is why we are here on the thread together <modsnipped>

Many of us have been sucked in by someone like this at least once in our life. Charming and dreamy...then not. When you get ready to kick them to the curb, they turn on the charm again, apologize, tell you that you are the love of your life... blah, blah, blah...but soon the real one is back. That, of course, would be the narcissitic one. From reading KB's Pinterest, I get the feeling that she was going through that yo-yo cycle...you know, you get picked up and dropped down, picked up, dropped over and over.

 

[GordianKnot]

Many of us have been sucked in by someone like this at least once in our life. Charming and dreamy...then not. When you get ready to kick them to the curb, they turn on the charm again, apologize, tell you that you are the love of your life... blah, blah, blah...but soon the real one is back. That, of course, would be the narcissitic one. From reading KB's Pinterest, I get the feeling that she was going through that yo-yo cycle...you know, you get picked up and dropped down, picked up, dropped over and over.

BBM:

Really struggling to envision PF as being able to pull off "charming and dreamy."
Ewwwwwww. No.
He must have somehow convinced KB he was the "strong, silent type."

I do agree with you re: the yo-yo cycle.
PF definitely liked to keep women on a string and yank them around at will.
That type of on-again/off-again vacillation can result in a roller coaster of emotions.
Roller coasters can be exhilarating.
And dangerous.

JMO.

 

[mustloveco]

Hello WebSleuthers!!!! I am excited for the upcoming court dates and will be attending .

Oh PF. Thinks he is "so smart". This couldn't have been sloppier. First of all, a BAT. Bloody mess. Wondering if it was metal or wooden.

All the cameras around town. I have to think he has noticed the next door neighbors' camera at some point, going to KB's.

The fact that he "borrowed a smart phone" from someone to upload those YouTube dog videos. I don't think PF was very tech-savvy . Or understood in the LEAST how phones work. I bet PF has a flip phone.

 

[MassGuy]

Hello WebSleuthers!!!! I am excited for the upcoming court dates and will be attending .

Oh PF. Thinks he is "so smart". This couldn't have been sloppier. First of all, a BAT. Bloody mess. Wondering if it was metal or wooden.

All the cameras around town. I have to think he has noticed the next door neighbors' camera at some point, going to KB's.

The fact that he "borrowed a smart phone" from someone to upload those YouTube dog videos. I don't think PF was very tech-savvy . Or understood in the LEAST how phones work. I bet PF has a flip phone.

Ha!

I’m pretty sure that PF also demonstrated that he didn’t know phones work, when he communicated with Kelsey’s phone, while his phone was in the same area.

Dug his own grave with that one.

Guess he missed that class in cowboy school.

 

[mustloveco]

Ha!

I’m pretty sure that PF also demonstrated that he didn’t know phones work, judging by the fact that he communicated with Kelsey’s phone, while his phone was in the same area.

Dug his own grave with that one.

Guess he missed that class in cowboy school.

I guess he didn't discuss that part with KK. Maybe she assumed he wasn't that dense???? I certainly can't wait for new details.

But speaking of technology, wondering how PF got on a dating site?! Laptop, etc.

I still don't know what these women saw in him!!! He could pass as tall, dark & handsome... until he opens his mouth! Wow, I can't imagine having a lot of deep conversations with him,

If he did, at which point he lovingly ads the term-of-endearment "lil " to the beginning of your name. What a sweetheart (VOMIT).

 

[Colorado303]

Colorado prosecutors don’t go for the death penalty often, but even looking at cases in places where they do go for the death penalty (Texas for instance), they are loath to do it without a body.

I just don’t see it happening here.

But I agree, I’d love to see it.

DP is even less likely in CO now. Newly elected state congress has introduced (or will be soon) abolishment of the death penalty and this time it’s expected to pass. DA probably wamts to get this guy locked up for good and from what I understand DP cases take a lot longer to bring to trial.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I guess he didn't discuss that part with KK. Maybe she assumed he wasn't that dense???? I certainly can't wait for new details.

But speaking of technology, wondering how PF got on a dating site?! Laptop, etc.

I still don't know what these women saw in him!!! He could pass as tall, dark & handsome... until he opens his mouth! Wow, I can't imagine having a lot of deep conversations with him,

If he did, at which point he lovingly ads the term-of-endearment "lil " to the beginning of your name. What a sweetheart (VOMIT).

I'm sure, he has everything you need to have a woman interested in you, the pithy cowboy.
If he has won her over, all he has to do is to whisper alternately about white wedding dresses or to give harsh instructions and occasionally make a few soft-toned statements as to why she is to blame for his bad mood.
The emotional roller-coaster, that women with "lil" added to their first name are exposed to, acts on its own. MOO

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Ha!

I’m pretty sure that PF also demonstrated that he didn’t know phones work, when he communicated with Kelsey’s phone, while his phone was in the same area.

Dug his own grave with that one.

Guess he missed that class in cowboy school.

bbm
I think, he mainly learned ---->

 

[Side Sleuth]

A few people have mentioned how they need to see the text messages from PF to KK soliciting her for murder or they will not believe it. Honestly, I would be shocked if there were text messages or emails with this information as I would think someone would only ask such things orally so as to not leave a trail. I think for that part, we might have to take KK at her word. And yes, although it seems like when she told LE she was only trying to save her own skin, she also told at least two parties closer in time to when she was solicited. This makes me believe her.

 

[Ccging]

Woodland Park Police Department

Woodland PD update, I gotta say I cringed at Sonic, but can’t blame the chain for its tie to KK now, KWIM?

 

[GordianKnot]

A few people have mentioned how they need to see the text messages from PF to KK soliciting her for murder or they will not believe it. Honestly, I would be shocked if there were text messages or emails with this information as I would think someone would only ask such things orally so as to not leave a trail. I think for that part, we might have to take KK at her word. And yes, although it seems like when she told LE she was only trying to save her own skin, she also told at least two parties closer in time to when she was solicited. This makes me believe her.

BBM:

Normally, I think most of us here would agree with you; however, this is PF we're talking about.

Owing to the truly mind-blowing intellect of the man, it is entirely believable to me that he would text and/or email messages to KK very explicity soliciting her to murder KB. I am confident such a written record exists.

PF didn't exactly take great pains to cover his tracks.
He was so supremely confident in his foolproof plan, he had no qualms about leaving a neon flashing trail of bread crumbs for LE leading directly up to his doorstep, including but not limited to: video/camera footage; cell phone tracking data/pings/texts; blood evidence; vehicle tracking/gps data.

The DA would not have just taken KK's word for it that these solicitations occurred.
KK's word alone would not have been enough of a basis for her to receive that sweetie beauty of a deal.
She gave them more than her verbal account. She gave them proof positive.

Frankly, I'm surprised PF didn't use a small aircraft to skywrite the messages to KK asking her to murder KB.
This guy is a genius.
In fact, PF should represent himself in court.
He's much more brilliant than any ol' public defender.

Somebody, order the man some legal pads.


JMO.

 

[Julia966]

I may be in the minority, but I think it happened basically as KK said it did. She may have provided some embellishments about being afraid of him, not seeing the body, etc., but I believe the basic facts and the timeline. Plus, the released evidence and other witnesses support her version of events. I think she cleaned up solely to please PF. I don't think she was the mastermind or that it was her idea to kill KB or anything more complicated than trying to appease and get close to him. Classic brainless desperation. IMO.

 

[GordianKnot]

I may be in the minority, but I think it happened basically as KK said it did. She may have provided some embellishments about being afraid of him, not seeing the body, etc., but I believe the basic facts and the timeline. Plus, the released evidence and other witnesses support her version of events. I think she cleaned up solely to please PF. I don't think she was the mastermind or that it was her idea to kill KB or anything more complicated than trying to appease and get close to him. Classic brainless desperation. IMO.

Great post!

I don't think you're in the minority here at all.

I think your assessment of KK's involvement is spot on.

 

[GordianKnot]

Woodland Park Police Department

Woodland PD update, I gotta say I cringed at Sonic, but can’t blame the chain for its tie to KK now, KWIM?

I think it's great that Sonic is donating breakfast to the searchers!
It's no fault of theirs that KK darkened the windows of their drive-thru.

I'm sure had the folks at Sonic known KK had just spent hours vigorously putting her elbow grease into concealing KB's bloody murder as well as standing sentinel over the burning of her body, they would have refused her service when she drove up.

JMO.

 

[Kapua]

I may be in the minority, but I think it happened basically as KK said it did. She may have provided some embellishments about being afraid of him, not seeing the body, etc., but I believe the basic facts and the timeline. Plus, the released evidence and other witnesses support her version of events. I think she cleaned up solely to please PF. I don't think she was the mastermind or that it was her idea to kill KB or anything more complicated than trying to appease and get close to him. Classic brainless desperation. IMO.

If you are in the minority, then I am in the minority, too, because I totally agree. MOO

 

[Love Never Fails]

Woodland Park Police Department

Woodland PD update, I gotta say I cringed at Sonic, but can’t blame the chain for its tie to KK now, KWIM?

I loved that Sonic was doing this for them. Just want them to find her, if she is there.

 

[GordianKnot]

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that.
Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
MARTIN LUTHER KING, JR.

 

[SandyQLS]

A few people have mentioned how they need to see the text messages from PF to KK soliciting her for murder or they will not believe it. Honestly, I would be shocked if there were text messages or emails with this information as I would think someone would only ask such things orally so as to not leave a trail. I think for that part, we might have to take KK at her word. And yes, although it seems like when she told LE she was only trying to save her own skin, she also told at least two parties closer in time to when she was solicited. This makes me believe her.

After.

9/23 KK rented a car and drove with her Aunt K to WP to pound on KB's door with a poison cup of coffee and a burner phone number. KK claims she put nothing in the coffee.

10/15 KK drove 1600 miles round trip planning to beat KB to death with a metal pipe

10/21 KK drove 1600 miles round trip planning to beat KB to death with an aluminum baseball bat

10/22 KK tells her friend MS that PF wants her to help murder KB. MS remembers the date due to her son's doctor appt. (AW item#58)

In AW item#59 LE explains their, um, thinking on that.

*
Refs.

Thread 39, page 62
Sam Kraemer tweet:
This coffee ordeal happened on Sept. 23, 2018. @KOAA

Thread 39, page 77
Sam Kraemer tweets:
Slater says he believes Kenney left the pipe at the Frazee residence on Oct. 16.

Slater says Kenney came back about a week after the Oct. 15 incident. She brought a bat from home, parked outside Kelsey’s home & waited.

 

[Detective Miloooosh]

Yeah! It's hard to find a black cat in a dark room, especially if the cat isn't there!

Hi Nanz
Picking up on this do you not feel that there is so much of the story that can only originate from KK and clearly cannot be true either...Lets not forget KK has lied to the police & it's on record.
It seems to me, and sadly was, a love triangle with KK at the heart of it with the most urgent motive ? If he can set her up she can equally have set him up...
Now let's look at motive:
PF has no real motive whilst KK has jealousy...
If PF was planning a murder as is maintained WHY would he do it in such a messy way?
The whole machiatto story sounds like an idea originating from a jealous perspective not one of a macho cowboy not to mention the scented candle incident which sounds more like a genuine moment of intimacy between PF and KB which was retold by KK in the most jealously imagined way possible...ie blindfold then death by baseball battering. It makes no sense...if he was a planner then he wouldn't use such an absurdly messy means....
Now what if PF genuinely was trying to patch up with KB and this pissed off KK....She had the means to set him up calling into account all the 'phone evidence..
But to reiterate someone who plans to the extent of using 'phones etc is not going to throw away all the planning using a messy baseball bat then getting someone else to clean up.
Alternatively we know that there was communication between KK and KB so perhaps the former lured the latter out of the house and shot her with the missing bullet then deposited blood to set PF up. Think about it we have her word against his when we realise she could have set him up ( just like she implies he did her)