CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #7

[ZsaZsa]

If they are still engaged, why are they even exchanging the child on Thanksgiving? Wouldn't they be spending it together? Sounds to me they had broken up and PF resents CB as having an influence there.

 

[MyBelle]

The important thing here is she was in Safeway a little after 12 pm. They probably have video of her leaving a few minutes later, but it is probably from her back side and might not show her face. The police want to put out the least information as possible and let them do the investigating. Most of the time this works to their advantage, but sometimes it hurts the investigation. I don't know how they discovered Kelsey was in Safeway (view hours and hours of footage from hundreds of stores?)

They may have found a Safeway grocery bag in her home.

 

[moonlessnight]

I used the car seat for a long time. It is heavy, but it's a good way to contain the child while shopping. Maybe her child was not secure in the child seat of the shopping cart. Or maybe baby was sleeping. not unusual at all.

I work in stores- some parents do bring in a car seat, especially if the child is sleeping or not feeling well.
I did wonder, though, if she might have brought it in because PF said he would meet her there to take the baby from her, so she might have taken the car seat in with the baby in it, to make it easier to give to PF. However, PF has told two different stories, according to media reports- one was that he picked the baby up at Kelsey's, the other was that Kelsey dropped the baby off at his house. It could be that the media got it mixed up, who knows.

 

[scdiv]

I didn't consider the camera angle. probably that. maybe her debit/cc transactions placed her there.

I would imagine that KB also could have a Safeway loyalty card if she shops there often. If so, they can probably look up her account and time of purchase and an itemized list of what she bought that day.

 

[MassGuy]

I’m not sure, but could it be the camera angle would only show her back walking out? Haven’t scoped out my local Safeway, but that would be my guess...

I think that’s exactly what was going on.

This was about showing what she looked like at the last place she was seen.

There was never the implication that she didn’t leave that store, or that something happened to her in the parking lot.

 

[Deleted member 169742]

Or if she was dating someone else, the new SO may have gotten jealous over PF and it escalated. Or maybe she ended things with a new guy as well.

Very good point

 

[NanZDrew]

I really like Charlot123's theory except I think that it could have been someone that she met online that took off with her. I think that he may have told her not to worry that they would get married, but as they knew each other longer, they realized they were not compatible. They seemed to be together after the birth of the child, but sometime after that and 5 months ago when she got the house, they most likely broke up. Possibly she did not want to live on the farm. She remained close in proximity to him for easy access to the child bPut far enough for a little privacy. Possibly she has been dating someone else for a while. It would be natural for them to contact her employer and that person carrying for the child.

Perhaps PF doesn't want to talk to the media and be asked questions that would blow her cover. If he is no longer in love with her, maybe he doesn't feel that he can fake the emotion. I am wanting him to be innocent because I think it will be horrible for the child to lose her mother at the hands of her father. There are other possibilities even though it looks bad for PF.

 

[MesquiteO21]

The important thing here is she was in Safeway a little after 12 pm. They probably have video of her leaving a few minutes later, but it is probably from her back side and might not show her face. The police want to put out the least information as possible and let them do the investigating. Most of the time this works to their advantage, but sometimes it hurts the investigation. I don't know how they discovered Kelsey was in Safeway (view hours and hours of footage from hundreds of stores?)

i thought about this as well, but if someone is missing - only missing at this point - wouldn't you want to put out images of them from the front AND back so people know what they look like at both angles right before they disappeared? seems like the more images you have of them the better to release to the public if you're trying to find someone who could for all purposes still be alive. JMO

 

[WhimsicalWillow]

Just wanted to comment - I never dated online, and I am probably not in your age group, but I know two people who found good husbands on Tinder. So if I hear that someone uses Tinder, it doesn't say anything bad about the person, not at all! An app like any other.

It happens! I found my husband on OkCupid and he went to an Ivy League university and has a masters in engineering. He now works in finance, as do I. We were both focused on our studies, busy, and online dating was the most convenient way for us to find someone.

We told family we met at a Starbucks for a very long time because we didn’t think our families would understand online dating.

Not everyone on the Internet is a creep today. The internet has made dating much easier but unfortunately, it also means women (and men) know less about who they are meeting so there’s always more risk involved.

I think the best thing a parent could do is to tell their adult child that they can tell them anything (yes, even if it means things aren’t good with the spouse & they are having affairs), will not shame them, will not tell anyone, will not “over-worry” or provide unsolicited advice, but as a true crime buff, want to have names, places, and phone numbers of a random date to keep them safe.
Of course, it’s easier to say these things and have behavior that comes across as the opposite. Behavior is more important than words. Many women my age feel their mothers worry too much, provide unsolicited judgmental advice, and that they cannot trust them with a lot, even simple things. They fear judgment, nagging, and even shame.

I am part of a local women’s group on Facebook and every week, it seems like someone is venting because they have a child and their MIL (or mother) is threatening to call CPS because they didn’t approve of their parenting in some way. There is a TON of MIL and grandparent drama thus, why I am not suspicious of PF keeping the baby away from KB’s parents. It didn’t surprise me that Shanann Watts had issues with the MIL either. I am more surprised these days if someone doesn’t have these things going on.

KB’s mom said she didn’t talk to her much because she was “busy” and I can’t help but feel it was deliberate. There has to be someone she confided in and I’m wondering who it was.

 

[alexwood]

I hadn't seen that. He raised border colliies and Lil Midge is beautiful. I don't think he is creepy either...unless he is guilty. Then he will be creepy due to his actions, not his looks.

Interesting. Scroll forward to 5:36:

 

[TxMother67]

Is anyone else as curious as I am as to why they're only releasing video of her walking into safeway and not out?

MOO~ but I think from a LE prospective, the video of Kelsey walking in shows more of her face and posture than a video that shows her walking away, back to the camera. With how little info has been released in the investigation, I feel this is par for the course. They wanted to release something that may trigger a recollection or a sighting from a different angle/hair style than has been shown in the photos released?

 

[Charlot123]

Which I don’t really understand. I’m not sure how the case could possibly be hurt by saying the relationship between her mom and the baby. That seems like something that wouldn’t really have any way of being sensitive, unless it was a sudden shift in relationship

At one point, KB and PF were close. And honestly, we don't know what KB thinks about her family, her upbringing, her childhood. She might have shared details about her early life with PF that scared him. Whether true or false memories, this might be the reason he does not want his daughter to see his maternal GM. He might be thinking, "anything but that family".
As I have mentioned, it might have been a false memory, or a tiny episode that stuck in KB's head, and yet it might be scary for FP, and the sole reason for not allowing his daughter to see MGM.

 

[MyBelle]

Agreed! Why did she move out on her own in May and purchase the townhouse? It’s been posted the mortgage is deferred to an LLC or estate of her family’s..... This is was brings me back to KB’s family knowing much more the goings on of this relationship with PF than they are willing or able to release at this time. Wow....tough!

ITA. I think that is the reason PF won't let the grandmother see the baby.

 

[Schmitz5100]

i thought about this as well, but if someone is missing - only missing at this point - wouldn't you want to put out images of them from the front AND back so people know what they look like at both angles right before they disappeared? seems like the more images you have of them the better to release to the public if you're trying to find someone who could for all purposes still be alive. JMO

Or perhaps they’re giving out little info with the hope that only the person who did something to Kelsey would expose info only LE knows?

 

[PommyMommy]

@PommyMommy Thanks for the awesome timeline. Is CF supposed to be PF? Just asking for clarification....

Yes, sorry about that.
MOO

 

[Ccging]

Interesting. Scroll forward to 5:36:

Do we know the date of this video?

 

[NanZDrew]

i thought about this as well, but if someone is missing - only missing at this point - wouldn't you want to put out images of them from the front AND back so people know what they look like at both angles right before they disappeared? seems like the more images you have of them the better to release to the public if you're trying to find someone who could for all purposes still be alive. JMO

I have also wondered how they found her at the Safeway. Do the contact banks and credit cards to see where they last shopped?

 

[MassGuy]

I really like Charlot123's theory except I think that it could have been someone that she met online that took off with her. I think that he may have told her not to worry that they would get married, but as they knew each other longer, they realized they were not compatible. They seemed to be together after the birth of the child, but sometime after that and 5 months ago when she got the house, they most likely broke up. Possibly she did not want to live on the farm. She remained close in proximity to him for easy access to the child bPut far enough for a little privacy. Possibly she has been dating someone else for a while. It would be natural for them to contact her employer and that person carrying for the child.

Perhaps PF doesn't want to talk to the media and be asked questions that would blow her cover. If he is no longer in love with her, maybe he doesn't feel that he can fake the emotion. I am wanting him to be innocent because I think it will be horrible for the child to lose her mother at the hands of her father. There are other possibilities even though it looks bad for PF.

No human being is going to expose themselves to law enforcement scrutiny that carries huge implications.

The kind of implications that carry a life sentence.

He is being treated as the prime suspect in what is likely a homicide investigation, even if they aren’t saying it.

His life is effectively on the line.

This wouldn’t simply be unusual behavior, it would be unprecedented.

People don’t do that when they have the answers.

He likely does have the answers, but not in this way.

I want him to be innocent as I want her to be alive.

But conflating hope with the likely reality here, is a dangerous game.

 

[Steelslady]

Good point. I can only come up with this...if someone was making it look like she was going to be away for a week (or so), then by NOT texting mom it would look more like she was headed there. And thinking it was not Kelsey who did the texting, sending one to Mom would be risky and probably require an answer as Mom would text back. I would if my daughter sent me a text saying she was going to be off the grid for a week, or something to that affect.

Well what doesn't make sense to me

There is no basis for that assumption.

Thank you. It keeps popping up on here and other places, so I just wanted to make sure that a family member didn't verify that this has happened before. I really feel she is deceased myself. I pray I am wrong, and would love to be wrong!

 

[alucardsdream]

MOO~ but I think from a LE prospective, the video of Kelsey walking in shows more of her face and posture than a video that shows her walking away, back to the camera. With how little info has been released in the investigation, I feel this is par for the course. They wanted to release something that may trigger a recollection or a sighting from a different angle/hair style that has been shown in the photos released?

She's not very tall, either. If someone taller was walking out at the same time as she was, the camera would have had an obstructed view. MOO.