CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #60

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  • #1,201
Without her though they wouldn’t have known the crime scene, or how this all went down (Nash, Fire, misdirection).

They would know that Kelsey was likely dead, and who did it.

But they couldn’t prove those things. KK would go down for lying to the FBI, and PF might have gone on to raise his daughter and abuse his farm animals.

That wouldn’t be justice.
Yes, but there was a TON of circumstantial. What cb said, the banker, a top cell phone expert, text messages between them (pf and kb), sf2 testimony, the Verizon worker, the neighbor's camera, and the other cameras, CB2 finding blood, pf having financial troubles, etc. Boyfriends are one of the most looked at of all suspects and he was the only one there that day and time she disappeared. I'm no legal eagle, but I would be able to connect the dots. My verdict rendered. Quilty as charged.
 
  • #1,202
But why so much behind the cushions?

While back someone had said that she probably tried to get away from him and I said no no no one blow and she would be done.
Oh dear God it looks like she tried to get away from him!!!

The blood behind the cushions could have occurred in a lot of scenarios, including one in which she is on the ground. It also could have come from when she was standing.

Cast off blood spatter is going to go backwards and forwards. Forwards on the swing, and backwards when he swings it back to strike again.

But yeah, unfortunately those misses are more likely if she was moving to get away. If those words she allegedly spoke are true, then I think that she definitely was.
 
  • #1,203
  • #1,204
I think that’s the obvious implication. Kelsey must have fallen, and he kept delivering blows with the bat.

PF must have missed a few times.
I’m just hoping he missed because he was in a blind rage and wildly swinging and not because his target was trying to get away.
 
  • #1,205
  • #1,206
A truly horrible day of testimony. My heart goes out to all of Kelsey's family and friends, nobody should ever hear that about a loved one's death.

PF is screwed and I have no doubt he'll spend the rest of his life behind bars. That makes me happy, but it doesn't bring Kelsey back.

I want the Berreth's to be able to somehow move forward with little baby K and find some peace. This is beyond anything I could ever imagine.
 
  • #1,207
I have started a nice stiff drink and think I have had my fill of pain today.

Its been awhile since I've cried like this.

I'm making another drink and going to go watch Death in Paradise rerun.

Good night to you all.....
 
  • #1,208
Yes, but there was a TON of circumstantial. What cb said, the banker, a top cell phone expert, text messages between them (pf and kb), sf2 testimony, the Verizon worker, the neighbor's camera, and the other cameras, CB2 finding blood, pf having financial troubles, etc. Boyfriends are one of the most looked at of all suspects and he was the only one there that day and time she disappeared. I'm no legal eagle, but I would be able to connect the dots. My verdict rendered. Quilty as charged.
Yes, but what’s the underlying crime?

Obviously it’s murder, but it’s impossible to prove that without a lot of evidence, or a body.

Look at the Tyler Mook case. Wife goes missing, all sorts of suspicious activity, including a butt dial to law enforcement in which he appears to implicate himself.

His wife’s burned out car is found down the road, a history of conflict, and no alibi.

No murder charges, although he is behind bars for another attempted murder. Drew Peterson and Josh Powell too (before he committed double murder/suicide).

This case may never have gone to trial. Just like those are destined not to.
 
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  • #1,209
NOV 6, 2019
Patrick Frazee trial: 'Please stop,' Kelsey Berreth pleaded as she was beaten to death, says witness
“Please stop.”

[...]

The desperate plea capped an emotional day of testimony from prosecutors’ star witness, Krystal Lee, an Idaho nurse who testified that Frazee personally confessed to the killing, then enlisted her help in trying to cover it up.

Lee — who no longer goes by her former married name of Kenney — broke down in sobs while relaying in a barely audible voice, what Frazee told her about Berreth’s dying words.

[...]

Often choking up and dabbing her face with a tissue, Lee recalled first falling for Frazee in 2006 at a dance in Lake George, west of Colorado Springs.

[...]

Their relationship soured a year and a half later. And Lee described a moment afterward where Frazee threatened to kill a dog he had given her, telling her that the previous owner was demanding the dog back unless he paid for it.

But they stayed in touch every few years, often through Facebook. Days before her 2010 wedding to another man in 2010, Frazee urged her to back out. She went through with the marriage anyway.

[...]

When her marriage turned rocky in 2015, Lee traveled back to Colorado and began an affair with Frazee — recalling "it was like nothing had changed — same giddy feeling."

Frazee urged her to get a divorce. And in March 2016, Lee became pregnant with Frazee’s child — news that Frazee did not take well.

[...]

Lee had an abortion, and told Frazee it was a miscarriage. Even though she filed for divorce two months later, the two didn't reconnect until October 2017.

In August 2018, Frazee, 33, acknowledged he was in another relationship, and that he had a child. Frazee claimed the mother, 29-year-old Berreth, was abusing their toddler daughter, Kaylee.

[...]

She eventually grew suspicious of Frazee’s claims that Berreth was a poor mother, especially after babysitting the girl and not finding any bruises on her.

She said she never called police out of fear that she’d be blamed, and that Frazee would call someone to kill her, too.

[...]

On Thanksgiving evening, Frazee called Lee and told her she had “a mess to clean up,” she testified.

[...]

When Lee opened the door to Berreth’s apartment on the morning of Nov. 24, she said she found blood splattered everywhere. On the floor, the fireplace, behind the couch. On cookie cutters, on carpets in nearly every room and on the walls higher than Lee could reach. On a windowsill, on stuffed animals and on a family picture of Patrick, Kelsey and Kaylee Frazee.

[...]

Over the next four hours, she cleaned the apartment from top to bottom — she filled six garbage bags with curtains, washcloths, toys and other items stained with blood that she couldn't clean.

Later that day, she accompanied Frazee to property he leased southwest of Cripple Creek, where he had stashed Berreth’s body in a tote atop bales of hay.

[...]

“He just said he swung away, and that it was really hard," Lee said. Frazee added that using the bat wasn't humane. And that in the future, he'd stick to normal weapons … the old fashioned way.”

[...]

“I saw some of those pictures,” Lee said. “And I knew there were people who cared about her. And people were going to look for her.”

Lee is expected back on the stand Thursday for cross examination by Frazee's public defenders.
It is “please stop”.
 
  • #1,210
Yes, but there was a TON of circumstantial. What cb said, the banker, a top cell phone expert, text messages between them (pf and kb), sf2 testimony, the Verizon worker, the neighbor's camera, and the other cameras, CB2 finding blood, pf having financial troubles, etc. Boyfriends are one of the most looked at of all suspects and he was the only one there that day and time she disappeared. I'm no legal eagle, but I would be able to connect the dots. My verdict rendered. Quilty as charged.
You would be able to connect the dots , as a critical thinker.

But I am afraid that a lot of critical thinkers get washed out of the jury pool too early. I think the prosecution needed this testimiony, to literally spell it out for them.
 
  • #1,211
The blood behind the cushions could have occurred in a lot of scenarios, including one in which she is on the ground. It also could have come from when she was standing.

Cast off blood spatter is going to go backwards and forwards. Forwards on the swing, and backwards when he swings it back to strike again.

But yeah, unfortunately those misses are more likely if she was moving to get away. If those words she allegedly spoke are true, then I think that she definitely was.
Here’s a thought perhaps she was seated on the sofa ? And the first blow was struck there and she was knocked over and was crawling and he struck the floor with the bat missing her because she was mobile still? This makes more sense to me since she was blindfolded - you can lose your balance standing blindfolded IMO - I’m guessing now she was seated
JMO and I’m very sorry to be typing this out
 
  • #1,212
So what’s your point? If PF didn’t abuse KB previously then he probably didn’t commit the murder?

I still don't know what PF did or didn't do, which is why I'd like to see evidence that LE confirmed the bloodbath KK describes took place. All they have confirmed that I'm away of is that LE used chemicals and discovered blood throughout the bathroom.

JMO
 
  • #1,213
Yes, but what’s the underlying crime?

Obviously it’s murder, but it’s impossible to prove that without a lot of evidence, or a body.

Look at the Tyler Mook case. Wife goes missing, all sorts of suspicious activity, including a butt dial to law enforcement in which he appears to implicate himself.

His wife’s burned out car is found down the road, a history of conflict, and no alibi.

No murder charges, although he is behind bars for another attempted murder. Drew Peterson and Josh Powell too (before he committed double murder/suicide).

This case may never have gone to trial. Just like those are destined not to.
Do you believe that without kk this would have never gone to trial?
 
  • #1,214
Here’s a thought perhaps she was seated on the sofa ? And the first blow was struck there and she was knocked over and was crawling and he struck the floor with the bat missing her because she was mobile still? This makes more sense to me since she was blindfolded - you can lose your balance standing blindfolded IMO - I’m guessing now she was seated
JMO and I’m very sorry to be typing this out
Nothing excludes it. The issue though is that one would expect a great deal of blood on that couch, and I think even PF would have thought about this first.
 
  • #1,215
"This is when the wood floors are brought up. I guess PF had called her while @ KB's house and asked if there was dents or marks in the wood floor. KK said there wasn't. Apparently when she got to Franch he again asked her about marks in the wood floor. She told him she didn't see any marks."

What did he hit the floor with the bat. Or maybe the chair? How else dents to the point he be worried about it
Maybe he kept hitting her when she was on the floor and hit the floor at the same time.
 
  • #1,216
I wonder if PF was surprised about the blood and how really difficult it is to kill someone. I always thought Jodi Arias was surprised how hard she had to work to kill Travis Alexander (she'd been practicing on tires).
I don't think he was surprised at how hard it was to kill someone, but perhaps the method of using the bat surprised him- probably because it took longer than a bullet to the head or a knife. i would imagine that after reading Kelsey saying "please stop", he was not successful in his first swing or two, and she probably tried with everything that she had to get away from him but wasn't able to because the blind fold as well as the element of surprise that he was doing this. I think this monster thought one swing and I'm done, didn't expect it to take so long. I hope it haunts him the rest of his pitiful existence.
 
  • #1,217
I think that’s the obvious implication. Kelsey must have fallen, and he kept delivering blows with the bat.

PF must have missed a few times.
That's what it sounds like and I wonder if LE found dents in some of the floorboards they removed that had blood under them.
 
  • #1,218
He never had any intention of killing her with the the first hit. For reasons we will never know. He hated her and the plan was to make her suffer as much as possible. I believe those were her last words. And i believe he hit her numerous times after that before she was dead. There are a 1000 painless ways he could have killed her. His plan was to inflict as much pain as possible
Welcome to WS. Glad to have you here with us :)
 
  • #1,219
Do you believe that without kk this would have never gone to trial?
Yes. They wouldn’t have discovered the rest of the blood in that house, or found the storage and burn sites.

They wouldn’t know how this happened, or be able to prove a murder occurred.

No way could they have brought this to trial. I’ve read about and followed many no body cases, and this one would have been a loser without KK.

No prosecutor takes that risk. That’s why the conviction rate in these cases is actually higher than cases in which there is a body.

They only take the very strong ones.

That’s why I’m not as angry about her deal as most people, because I am absolutely convinced that PF would never pay without her cooperation.

It was a deal with the devil, but a necessary one.
 
  • #1,220
I call BS! She was a mother herself, plenty of distance between herself and PF...Any "psychological abuse" from him she "suffered" was self-inflicted. The woman was married, had a family, tons of avenues for support. She was a nurse for gods sake!
There is NO excuse for why she didn't alert ANYONE that KK was about to be killed. Yeah, my sympathy for her is less than zero.
Yeah- much as I can see that she was somewhat under his spell, I can't get past the three attempts to kill Kelsey, then cleaning up the blood spatter afterwards instead of calling LE. She went there with the intentions of pleasing him. I am not saying she wasn't afraid of him, but a normal person would have opened the door to the condo, took one look around, and realized that what she was dating was a sick murderer and she at the very least, should have called the cops right there and then.
 
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