Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #30

[borndem]

MollyDDD said: ↑
That made me think of something. I’ve read somewhere that SW made a few references to a friend that she thinks CW may be cheating on her. I don’t know when that was in time, but it made me think how brave she was to leave him alone for five weeks. Sort of like “when the cat’s away, the mice will play”.

You both make excellent points.

It could also be that SW had made her decision to relocate to NC with the girls in the near future, without CW, so she was no longer worried about what CW did re another woman while she was taking several weeks away from him. Maybe she was just "done" with it.

 

[cailleach]

It's the most common method because it is the ultimate act of power and control, I believe.

Bingo! It's often used to control the partner, to send a message, and eventually it will be used to kill them.

 

[Deleted member 230544]

By deleting his Facebook he was pretty much saying “buh bye” to his job with Le-Vel. He definitely had changes in mind.

@Layla123, I think it was more along the lines that CW was pretty much saying "buh bye" to SW.
As for Le-Vel and CW, I don't think Thrive meant anything to him and it definitely was not a job to him as you suggest. He likely was not a big promoter nor made a lot of sales. JMO

 

[Allabouttrial]

2010 -SW & CW met
Nov 2012 -CW and SW married
May 2013 -CW purchased CO home for $399,954
Dec 2013 -Bella was born
June 2015 -Filed bankruptcy
July 2015 -CeCe was born
-----------------------------------------------------
In June, 2015, the couple filed for Chapter 7 bankruptcy protection, saying their year-to-date income in 2015 was $40,491. The filing listed debts more than $400,000 including a mortgage of $378,000. Other debts totaling more than $70,000 included miscellaneous credit card charges in 2015 totaling more than $44,569, and 2015 purchases from Nordstrom for a credit card balance of $3,038, and Macy's for a credit card balance of $1,301. The couple also declared student loan debts of $11,000 and had medical bills for around $2,500.
Frederick Couple Faced Economic Pressure, Had Filed Bankruptcy

Ouch! That's some credit card debt. Thanks for the info.

 

[MassGuy]

I'm confident there will be compelling evidence as to who killed the kids. We don't have cause of death yet.

I think we already have compelling evidence as to who killed the kids. Cause of death will tell us how he did it. My money is on strangulation.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

CW has been charged with 1st degree murder, 5 counts I believe. Which shows me that the prosecutors, who have much more evidence than we do, including Shanann's SM posts, do not believe he is guilty of a sudden heat of passion or a class 2 felony. The evidence they have and that we do not has brought about 1st degree murder charges. Among other charges of course. JMO

Edited to add, charges related to burying his unborn son and wife in a shallow grave and dumping his babies in separate oil tanks.

Also, no bail was set. He has no prior criminal record, so it's surprising maybe he's not given at least a super high bail amount. The state has a nice tight case against him , IMO. Get ready for some big bombshells at the trial. I can't wait.

 

[Best of What's Around]

The way I understand it all evidence is circumstantial evidence except eye witness accounts. I think a string of circumstantial evidence is much more reliable than eye witness accounts. That is why those quick stop stores have height marks on the door facing so clerks can be more accurate when describing a robber fleeing. Have a group of people in a room when someone unexpectably runs through, there will be many different descriptions. As a juror I would most definitely consider circumstantial evidence when deciding guilt or innocence.

Yes, sadly studies have shown eyewitness testimony can be very unreliable despite the best of intentions.

 

[Alethea]

All of this evidence is also used as character evidence. If CW is going to testify in his own defense, both sides will introduce evidence that jurors can use to determine his credibility. Each juror is free to determine the credibility of a witness. If a witness is found to be not credible, the juror can discount or discard entirely their testimony. If a witness is found to be very credible, the juror can give a lot of weight to that person's testimony.

This is true for all witnesses for both sides. You can have a witness that you think will provide very important evidence, but if they do not come off well or they misspeak or they get tripped up, it can end up being not very useful to you.

 

[Backstroke10]

I’ve posted some excerpts below about family annihilators that I found interesting. A common theme was shame and inadequacy. IMO I believe CW murdered his family because he was bisexual and/or gay, hated himself for finally giving into his urges, and couldn’t fathom the thought of losing his family or anyone finding out.

He may have been struggling with this his entire life but never acted on it until recently. I don’t feel that he murdered his wife and kids because he was having an affair. People have affairs, get divorced, and are still able to see their kids, have joint custody, etc. Coming out as gay, while married with two kids and a baby on the way, IMO is looked upon by society very differently than having an affair. I think working in the oilfield with tough, rugged type guys would have been very difficult as well.

My 20 yr old son came out as bisexual 5 years ago. A year ago he told me that he was gay not bisexual but was scared to admit it. I love him and all I care about is his happiness. However, his father (we’re divorced) won’t speak to him. My son struggles with this every day, and has stated numerous times that he wishes he was “normal”. My son is 6’ tall, masculine and extremely handsome. The only reason I’m describing his appearance is because by looking at him, nobody would know what he’s struggling with or that he is gay. Once again, this is all JMO and I could be way off. I’m just presenting my theory as to "why".

“Neil Websdale, a professor at Northern Arizona University, argues that such killers share one common trait: a feeling that they've fallen short of societal ideals of manhood.”

“Annihilators are overwhelmingly male (95 percent, he estimates), and mostly white and middle-aged. They feel inadequate as men and have often suffered childhood abuse. Having felt powerless as kids, many try to exert strict control over their households and seek to create an idealized version of family that they never experienced.”

“They murder the people they were trying to deceive. Hence, the prevention of family murders isn't psychotherapy, it's exposing the lie. They murder because they're afraid they are about to be revealed.”

 

[Marli61]

Trinket! That's it knew it started with a T.

I looked through Trinket's posts. I didn't see it. But my eyes are getting tired. I may have missed it.

 

[gitana1]

esayer said: ↑
This makes sense. VI said she had access to all of his accounts FWIW


Trinket78, Sep 10, 2018
There were not multiple affairs. If you knew them it’s easy to understand. She had complete access to his phone. He was always on a schedule.



Bluff
@esayer and @gitana1 ~ here is the VI Trinket78 post referencing that SW had access to all of CW accounts.
Thank you @Tippy Lynn for forwarding me this link.

Thank you so much!

Okay, it does not state she had access to all his accounts. The VI, without substantiation, appears to be claiming that he did not have multiple affairs because SW had "complete access" to his phone. And he was always on schedule.

Well we know he had one affair. That was confirmed by LE. And from what others have said about SW, she started to suspect he was having an affair but did not really think that was happening.

So using basic logic, CW had to be communicating and getting together with his affair somehow. Someone may have "complete access" to a spouse's phone but not have access to a burner phone. Or not have their passwords for accounts, like What'sApp, Facebook, or Snapchat.

It seems apparent that despite having "complete access" to his phone and him supposedly always being on schedule, he still managed to have an affair undetected by his wife. If he had one, he could also have multiple other hookups.

We know at least one occasion where he was supposed to be working and was actually disposing of the corpses of his family, so it is easy for someone we don't know who supports CW to say and believe that he could not have been having multiple affairs without detection, but reality may show otherwise.

And access to someone's phone is not the same as power over their social media accounts.

 

[Marli61]

I have no idea how to search for it.

Go to the very top of this page. Right above your profile picture there is a search box. Click it & inside you can search members by name.

 

[MsBetsy]

The way I understand it all evidence is circumstantial evidence except eye witness accounts. I think a string of circumstantial evidence is much more reliable than eye witness accounts. That is why those quick stop stores have height marks on the door facing so clerks can be more accurate when describing a robber fleeing. Have a group of people in a room when someone unexpectably runs through, there will be many different descriptions. As a juror I would most definitely consider circumstantial evidence when deciding guilt or innocence.

Some cases have been won just on circumstantial evidence. Wasn't Scott Peterson convicted on that alone?

 

[Jennifer17]

esayer said: ↑
This makes sense. VI said she had access to all of his accounts FWIW


Trinket78, Sep 10, 2018
There were not multiple affairs. If you knew them it’s easy to understand. She had complete access to his phone. He was always on a schedule.



Bluff
@esayer and @gitana1 ~ here is the VI Trinket78 post referencing that SW had access to all of CW accounts.
Thank you @Tippy Lynn for forwarding me this link.

I wonder what part of his schedule allowed time for affairs?

 

[MyBelle]

Ouch! That's some credit card debt. Thanks for the info.

Living well beyond their means, as my grandmother used to say. It was all to create an illusion. smh.

 

[Johnny1181]

All of this evidence is also used as character evidence. If CW is going to testify in his own defense, both sides will introduce evidence that jurors can use to determine his credibility. Each juror is free to determine the credibility of a witness. If a witness is found to be not credible, the juror can discount or discard entirely their testimony. If a witness is found to be very credible, the juror can give a lot of weight to that person's testimony.

This is true for all witnesses for both sides. You can have a witness that you think will provide very important evidence, but if they do not come off well or they misspeak or they get tripped up, it can end up being not very useful to you.

For me... his credibility was blown after watching those 3 interviews. Preening in his shirt with a big smile knowing exactly that he'd dumped Bella and CeCe in separate oil tanks and covered Nico and Shanann in dirt. jmo

 

[BelleIsle]

I think I read on here somewhere that SW said that CW asked her to have another child

Yes, we have her word for it, but nothing from him. I believe her word, but it's not been confirmed by him (obviously). Unless we had a window into their conversation about this, there is no way to completely verify it. The closest thing we have is the conversation SW had with Mrs. Theyer (sp?), it was said in private and I don't think SW would have had a reason to divulge this info had it been untrue.

 

[Jennifer17]

Living well beyond their means, as my grandmother used to say. It was all to create an illusion. smh.

Yes and it seems that he was just as involved in it as she was.

 

[esayer]

esayer said: ↑
This makes sense. VI said she had access to all of his accounts FWIW


Trinket78, Sep 10, 2018
There were not multiple affairs. If you knew them it’s easy to understand. She had complete access to his phone. He was always on a schedule.



Bluff
@esayer and @gitana1 ~ here is the VI Trinket78 post referencing that SW had access to all of CW accounts.
Thank you @Tippy Lynn for forwarding me this link.

Nice thank you!

 

[MassGuy]

Some cases have been won just on circumstantial evidence. Wasn't Scott Peterson convicted on that alone?

Great point. That case was almost entirely circumstantial.