Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #31

[dgfred]

I don't think that he did. As far as I know none of my neighbours have cameras, but I am sure some of them would.

Right across the street from the driveway you come and go from every day... I think he would have noticed.

You better behave yourself anyway... keep the running around the house with no clothes on to a minimum. Haha... every camera in the neighborhood will be aimed at your house.

 

[human]

I don't think he planned on the cops showing up hours later. He may have thought he had more time to stage the scene. Jmo

If he killed her later, then to me it was not a plan. If he killed her earlier, it was a plan and he had time.

People have said he was very perfectionist. In one video where he is singing and making breakfast, he wipes down the cabinet.

If he had a plan, how detailed would it be? I would like one that thinks about what I should do with the purse and phone.

I don’t know. Plan or rage. It can go either way

 

[Steelhead]

I don't think that he did. As far as I know none of my neighbours have cameras, but I am sure some of them would.

Yes, but if you were planning a murder, wouldn't you find these things out ahead of time?

 

[mtnlites]

Look at these precious faces!

Tough to imagine the horrible, lonely , nasty place where their own Daddy chose to hide them.

You know, I've written about so many horrible cases that, for my own sanity, I've gotten to where I can write about the crime, talk about it, etc. without getting emotionally attached to the victims. I feel sad for them, of course, but for my own self preservation I can distance my emotions. Doing that with this one, too, until I saw this picture last night. I am fairly desensitized to a lot of things these days but that picture of her little smile hit me like a punch in the gut. I don't believe that CW drugged them with Benadryl or anything, but I am so hoping that I am wrong. I hope they were fast asleep and never knew what happened.

 

[dgfred]

Yes, but if you were planning a murder, wouldn't you find these things out ahead of time?

We have already noticed... if he WAS planning it, he was a terrible planner.

 

[Jennifer17]

Yes, but if you were planning a murder, wouldn't you find these things out ahead of time?

If you could. One of my friends do have a security camera but it looks like an outside light.

 

[Steelhead]

We have already noticed... if he WAS planning it, he was a terrible planner.

Agreed. And a terrible actor. But, I still think he knew the cameras were there.

 

[MassGuy]

I would find fingerprints a reason to convict . I think where my miscommunication has caused problems is simply this.
The list of evidence we have right now as was given to me IMO would not make me vote guilty
Pommy was nice enough to explain the definition of evidence where I misspoke .
The fact that autoposy has not been released, the fact of no witness testimony to consider whether it is testimony of an expert or a friend we have yet to see anything to examine.
The list was given to me I’m paraphrasing
1. baby moniter / if the light was on in the room you can detect color hue change enough to cause me doubt on this fact alone
2. &3 the odds of two people unrelated doing the same crime same manner is unlikely .
*if I consider these charges separately and he confessed to strangling her I am not sure I can apply that method of strangling on one charge in my opinion towards the other charge that’s a legal question I would ask
4. Thru 6 He loved his children passionately did not try to call 911 which is irrational .
We don’t know if he tried CPR or what happened until testimony . Beyond a reasonable doubt not sure without further information from a criminal psychologist .
Didnt run into lawn screaming for help?could he have had Shame since death was accidental ?
Could he have fear no one would believe him? How does shock effect him bc he had no previous crime ? Our assumption on a normal reaction causes doubt to his but is that fact alone unsupported enough? No
7. No screams heard except dog barking that night. I have looked everywhere for time of dog to reference bc to me this is relevant and could be after the deaths. The sad part is this type of death does not make a lot of noise that can be heard from next door and the noise alone doesn’t determine the killer .
8. He didn’t wail before murdering her. If he did this as a reaction to SW murdering girls I can see it plausible anger (rage as he stated) was first emotion not grief.
9&10 the aftermath reaction from rage to control . I’m not again sure about this because what if he did panic afterwards and reacted based on realization of what had unfolded and a sense of shame isolation . Again without professional witness testimony , toxicology was he impaired , and a detailed explanation to consider I can’t base guilt standing alone as a statement without supporting evidence.
11&12the burial method psychology and placement . If he panicked and this was not planned then the only spot would be where he was familiar. This was oil field . We know the kids were not placed with mom. What if that was bc he wanted them away from her bc she did strangle them ? We do not have details of disposal yet. Those details would weigh my decision on this if evident . What if they were in bags or what if disposal was worse ? Guess what he did admit to this so again I need the distinction of how to legally separate my consideration bc this is a different charge.
13 he went to work and monitored his front door . My door app notifies me when someone comes as an alert . I would assume his does the same . No one wants an ap you need to moniter if you use it as security you want one that alerts you packages come or someone is entering your door . We know NU tried to enter bc she mentioned latch
14.one the interview CW stated he left voice texts. We do not know this is a fact yet to consider with a call log
15.&16 called friend and asked calmly what was going on . I would assume he would call because he was alerted to someone gaining entrance and he knew no one was there . I don’t recall the word calmly but I know he urged her to wait till he got there and said garage key code broken . Again this statement to me proves panic and guilt . But he has confessed to killing SW and disposing bodies. So imo this reaction would not prove the death of the girls solely bc I feel it would be the same reaction if only SW killed. He lied to friend and cops bc he had murdered SW and disposed of them . This alone could not make me say hey he killed girls too
17-2o interviews he had to do them it’s a no win , he was paranoid about interviews bc he asked neighbors how he seemed. Ok again she shows a guilty conscious bc he knew he was with holding truth .
So
The charges against the defendant are not evidence

*You must assume innocent until proven guilty

*You must not be influenced by SYMPATHY bias or prejudice reaching this decision

*If you find from the evidence of the prosecution that one or more elements has not been proven by prosecution you should find them not guilty

*the defendant is supposed to be judged by the crime of this case and no other

*each count should be considered separately not linked to previous charges
I want more information . The man has confessed to strangling his wife and disposing of his children . This is a complex case to me. We are all different and these reasons are enough for many I am not here to sway you or argue my opinion .

My opinion is that he absolutely did this.

Here’s my question for you: If a person close to the defendant were to give you “inside information” as to SW’s character, perhaps to go as far as besmirching her character while building up that of CW, would that influence you in any way?

What I’m asking is, would you be swayed by another person’s words? A person with a vested interest.

It’s hypothetical of course. But what I’m getting at is, how much weight would you give the account of a witness?

 

[PommyMommy]

Agreed. And a terrible actor. But, I still think he knew the cameras were there.

And that could be exactly why he backed his truck in like he did, but we just don't know.
MOO

 

[dgfred]

@MassGuy

Witnesses... very little

Evidence... very much

 

[Gardener1850]

The love is evident in every video I've seen. Such happy little girls. Here are a few more:
Shanann Watts
Shanann Watts
Shanann Watts
MOO

Yes! And I believe it is also evidence of what a wonderful mom SW was-- in those videos she is encouraging them, telling them she loves them and always using their names (i.e. saying "Go Cece" and "I love you Bella"). I beleive SW was an engaging mom who adored her children. JMO.

 

[MassGuy]

@MassGuy

Witnesses... very little

Evidence... very much

Precisely my point.

 

[kebdal23]

That is highly possible. Some have noted he took nothing of her belongings to dump in the oil tanks or bury. While it is possible he was hyper focused on getting the bodies alone out of the house, he may also have planned to put those items in her car with the car seats...drive it to an iffy part of town in Denver, and leave the keys inside. Just a thought. Then report her missing the next day and say he thought she took off with the kids over his insistence at a separation (he could have even texted with her phone to his this point) and he thought he would let her cool down. But when he didn't hear from her again for 24 hours, he called family and friends, and eventually the police. Just a thought, IMO.

FWIW, I've always suspected that this was his original plan. I'm also not convinced he knew about the neighbor's camera 100%. My neighbors may have cameras, I have no clue. Unless I missed something in one of the threads that proves he knew about it.

 

[dgfred]

I have been around people in my life I just didn't like...
I would hope that would not be a factor if they were charged with murder. Just give me the facts, thank you.

 

[MassGuy]

I have been around people in my life I just didn't like...
I would hope that would not be a factor if they were charged with murder. Just give me the facts, thank you.

That’s my fear. That someone who perhaps doesn’t like the victim, will try to sway the jurors at trial.

Character witnesses certainly have their purpose, but they shouldn’t move the needle.

 

[dgfred]

Haha... he did look a little befuddled mentioning cameras and dogs in his interviews. Maybe both those things gave him a little shock.

 

[Jennifer17]

That’s my fear. That someone who perhaps doesn’t like the victim, will try to sway the jurors at trial.

Character witnesses certainly have their purpose, but they shouldn’t move the needle.

I can't see the point of character witnesses.

 

[pocketaccent]

I do not think he planned this his whole life, nor did he lie about loving his wife and children. I think he started out a happy family man. He didn't lay in wait for this day to murder them all.

I think it is something that slowly built up inside him. He had never had a serious relationship before. This was all new to him. This was his first real girlfriend, and before he knew it, he had 2 little daughters, a big house with big house payments, a pregnant wife, with her own medical issues, lots of medical bills from his family, and a past bankruptcy, with a possible new one looming. He worked hard at a job that was not all that exciting.

He began to greatly dislike his current life. His wife used to cater to him, dote on him, when they were newly in love. But now she had the kids and 'her people' and her sales career and her social media life. And now the pregnancy...was their 3rd child going to have medical issues too?

CW was a quiet, simple man and his life had become chaotic and complicated. His wife liked the finest things in life and he worked hard to try and keep up with their expenses. He wanted to provide for his family so he spared no expense. But soon, he was barely treading water, once again. And there was no end in sight, with the upcoming birth and the new mouth to feed.

His girl friend understood him. She catered to him and gave him a nice quiet place to relax. It became harder and harder to imagine sticking it out in his family life.

He never showed anger or frustration. He just stuffed it and stuffed it...until he couldn't do so anymore...

Great post and I agree. There's a lot of wisdom in this post.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I would think some of SW's family, yes. CW's family more than likely will testify in the sentencing phase.

I was thinking perhaps the prosecution would call the father, to speak about his testimony as to the drive back, and or his interview. Perhaps that would be a hostile witness? Is he on the original witness list?

 

[MassGuy]

I can't see the point of character witnesses.

Say that CW were to testify (highly doubtful IMO). The defense would try and paint him as this great guy, and suggest that a crime like this would be out of character for him.

They would call friends and family to hammer this point home.