Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #32

[flourish]

Why not? as long as we dont sleuth her ex husband, I thought that would OK. I also think it may be relevant.

Wouldn't discussing why their marriage ended, by default, include personal information about her ex, though? I would rather err on the side of caution. Imo

 

[MerryB]

Says no tattoos. Pictures show tattoos or are they temporary?

That person people keep referencing (born in OK, no tattoos, went to Miami U to study chemical engineering) has the same name but is not the person we are discussing on this thread.

 

[Jennifer17]

Why not? as long as we dont sleuth her ex husband, I thought that would OK. I also think it may be relevant.

Because we would be sleuthing him and accusing him of something.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I've gotta say this is almost insulting even as your opinion. I can see myself in this woman, I have two small kids, a husband who works hard for us, as do I, we sometimes struggle financially, it's feast or famine in his Iron worker line of work, I have child whom has many health issues requiring weekly infusions (very stressful). I too am very clean and organized, in fact my entire extended family jokes about it and it always stings a little bit, I don't know why, I know they are kidding, but I felt no control growing up for a myriad of reasons and sure maybe that's why I am the way I am now but our experiences throughout life make us who we are and it's insulting to this woman that you can make that jump. If SW is the kind of mom I feel she probably was, she loved those girls more than ANYTHING in this world and they would be her first concern. I'm trying to respect that everyone has an opinion here and you are certainly allowed to have your own, I just feel awful that anyone is even entertaining the idea that she hurt those babies. JMO but if my husband told me in the dead of night/early AM that he was leaving his family for someone else and there's an attack happening, it would 100% be me going after him. I would then pack his sh** and tell him to kick rocks.

Thank you. I totally agree. Totally.

 

[katydid23]

So she could see their necks

Could you find your children necks without turning the lights on? I certainly could.

 

[Nikynoo]

Wouldn't discussing why their marriage ended, by default, include personal information about her ex, though? I would rather err on the side of caution. Imo

not necessarily - there are lots of reasons to divorce, the why, doesnt involve personal information.

 

[MKZoo]

Your theory might hold water if she had committed suicide, or killed him, after killing the children SHE loved more than life itself. But it was too late for him to set up a faux suicide and she did not kill him it seems. I can't understand how you think at all so I will stop debating you.

I totally agree. I think revenge would be for her to kill him. That would eliminate the source of her alleged anger. SW was by all accounts a loving mother so why would she punish herself by hurting her kids when a far better target was available?. I think I’d buy the revenge theory if she was the one left alive. Instead she ended up in a shallow grave. Jmo

 

[MassGuy]

Thank you for letting me join. It’s a relief to find a group that doesn’t spend an inordinate amount of time victim blaming and spinning wild theories without any factual basis!

Ha! For the most part you are correct in your assumption. Those outside forums are horrific.

 

[Nikynoo]

Could you find your children necks without turning the lights on? I certainly could.

perhaps they had night lights?

 

[Kadoober]

Colorado man accused of murdering his wife and two daughters thinks that 'no one understands him'

Aw, poor buddy. Maybe he can be pen pals with Scott Peterson and Jeffrey McDonald. So someone can really know him.
All of my tiny violins are broken.

 

[Layla123]

So imo “he’ll hath no fury like a woman scorned” still could deem equal as a motive to a few thousand a month to a man that imo was in a relationship and could have moved in and shared expenses with AP or got a small efficiency apt instead of spending his life in jail

Since SW told several people that a separation was on the table, isn’t it just as likely that SW told C.W. she’d had enough of his lying cheating ways, she wanted him out, she never wanted to see him again, and she was going to fight him for full custody of the kids? Seems like CWs behavior up to that point was wanting his cake and eating it, too. If he was ready to throw their life together away why would he go to that birthday party? Once their mutual friends found out that he planned to abandon his 15 weeks pregnant wife, he would have been treated like a social pariah. I doubt he would have remained in their social circle. And their social circle was created by Shanann, through Le-Vel, not him, and notice, none of them are standing up for C.W.

 

[Jennifer17]

not necessarily - there are lots of reasons to divorce, the why, doesnt involve personal information.

What reasons that would not include personal info?

 

[Serena Angelique]

Why not? as long as we dont sleuth her ex husband, I thought that would OK. I also think it may be relevant.

Her marriage didn’t last very long (1-2 yrs) and she was very young when she got married the first time. She described in a video that the divorce was very tough on her but she doesn’t mention abuse.

<modsnipped rumor and sleuthing of family>

 

[MsBetsy]

He definitely didn’t seem to show much remorse or empathy in his interviews or in his behavior. The other traits of manipulation, aggressiveness, hostility, and impulsiveness...I feel like we don’t have enough information. Obviously killing SW and (IMO) the children is aggressive, and possibly impulsive (maybe, I’m still on the fence about premeditation) but I don’t know enough about his pre-murder behavior. I know that’s a lame answer. But I would say it’s certainly a possibility that he has some psychopathic traits but unlikely to have APD.

Another thing to note is that people with antisocial personality disorder and associated traits often have a disregard for authority or the law, which means conduct problems in childhood and run ins with the law. We haven’t heard anything like that from CW.

Have you ever known of a passive type person with APD? For example, someone who may be manipulative or controlling in very subtle ways, making it harder to determine, since there is no aggressive behavior? Maybe someone with enough discipline to control their anger or inpulsivity? Just curious.

 

[human]

When people say that they have OCD, they generally aren’t being literal (some obviously are).

It’s an expression commonly used to mean “I like things very orderly.”

OCD is very hard on a person who has it. I mean the actual diagnosis

 

[MassGuy]

OCD is very hard on a person who has it. I mean the actual diagnosis

Exactly. And my point was that it was likely she wasn’t being literal.

 

[gitana1]

Thinking it over... has there EVER been a case where the woman immediately kills her child/children just after a 'separation' was MENTIONED?

No. And in the rare cases of a mother killings her kids in revenge for a break up, from what I've seen:

1. None have been pregnant to my knowledge.
2. They typically also kill themselves or attempt to.
3. Their husbands or mates don't conceal what they did.
4. Their husbands or mates are incapable of restraining their grief and horror (like CW).
5. They often (but not always) have a history of mental health issues, drug and/or alcohol issues or criminal records.
6. They premeditate the crime for much longer than moments. It's usually days or weeks.
7. Often they are in the middle of custody battles.

"Jason Sheats told police his wife suffered from depression, Nehls said. She was taking "numerous" prescription medications and seeing a therapist. She had been admitted to a private mental health facility three times in recent years for attempted suicide, Nehls said."
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/06/29/us/texas-woman-shoots-daughters/index.html

"When Jason got off work that afternoon, the family went to Charlee’s dance practice in Crawfordsville and returned home for supper. Brandi then left for Walmart, saying she needed pipe cleaners for Tyler’s school project.
Prosecutors say she bought a knife instead, hiding the weapon in Tyler’s bedroom. The couple played with the children on a Murphy Bed in the living room until Jason put the children to bed."
Judge sentences Worley in the stabbing deaths of her two young children

After their separation, Jessica Edens filed for sole custody of their daughter, while Benjamin Edens asked for joint custody, court records show. The requests were filed on Tuesday, July 11, just two days before the deadly shootings.

A custody dispute in Family Court a few days earlier upset Edens badly, Hashe said, citing text messages and other communications deputies found after the killings.
"Mrs. Edens developed a plan in the next couple of days that she felt would cause everlasting consequences for her husband, Benjamin Edens," Hashe said in a statement Monday.
The first step was stealing a .40-calibur handgun from her parents' home the day before the shooting while they were out of town, authorities said.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.greenvilleonline.com/amp/481269001

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cb...ho-killed-kids-self-revealed-motive-in-texts/

 

[Serena Angelique]

Since SW told several people that a separation was on the table, isn’t it just as likely that SW told C.W. she’d had enough of his lying cheating ways, she wanted him out, she never wanted to see him again, and she was going to fight him for full custody of the kids? Seems like CWs behavior up to that point was wanting his cake and eating it, too. If he was ready to throw their life together away why would he go to that birthday party? Once their mutual friends found out that he planned to abandon his 15 weeks pregnant wife, he would have been treated like a social pariah. I doubt he would have remained in their social circle. And their social circle was created by Shanann, through Le-Vel, not him, and notice, none of them are standing up for C.W.

He went to the Birthday Party because it was pre-scheduled and they were friends with the Lindstrom Family. Their daughter was their babysitter (the party was for their son). He likely wanted to be seen and to show everyone that things were normal.

He had not had the kids for that long at that point. They hadn’t even been back a week from their North Carolina trip. It would have been the first weekend that he had been alone with them in several weeks.

I also have noticed that Family Annihilators often do something fun with their kids before they kill them-like take them to amusement parks, take them to have a fun meal or something that is enjoyable-he may have wanted to do the same-but that’s only speculation.

 

[compass]

Don’t know, but she repeatedly referred to herself as such on SM.

I don’t think this was a diagnosis like the lupus. I think it’s often tagged on someone who is very organized and well prepared. There is a disorder that requires medication to manage life when the compulsion is so great life is not normal for instance must check over and over if oven is off, door is locked etc the way I understand it this is a chemical imbalance in the brain, much more serious and debilitating than just wanting to have things organized. MOO

 

[stereopticons]

Have you ever known of a passive type person with APD? For example, someone who may be manipulative or controlling in very subtle ways, making it harder to determine, since there is no aggressive behavior? Maybe someone with enough discipline to control their anger or inpulsivity? Just curious.

I personally don’t know of cases like this, but I think while it is possible, I think it would be difficult based on the criteria you have to meet for antisocial PD.