Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #36

[MsBetsy]

I believe that although she received many products/supplements for free, she also paid for them too. The family used a lot of Le-Vel’s products which aren’t cheap (a pro-bar alone is $5 a pop). A lot of MLM marketers purchase their own products as an incentive to boost sales and they often
even use their bonuses to purchase additional merchandise in order to offer free give aways and samples. It is therefore unlikely that she was getting all of her Thrive/Le-Vel products for free.

Yes, I read about that too. You can move up simply if you, friends and family members are the only ones purchasing the products. Jmo

Many people live beyond their means and never fail. Some are even able to build fortunes.

Many people are disciplined and frugal and do fail.

Each person and circumstance is different. How each person handles their circumstances is different.

Without seeing the whole picture, we can't understand SW's and CW's situation and, I believe, should keep an open mind.

Yes, I have heard people say being in dept is the "American way" No wonder half the country is in dept. Jmo

 

[Backstroke10]

I concur. I think part of CW's hatred of SW was born out of resentment because she was so much more vivacious and personable and he...he just wasn't. All MOO

IMO He probably felt like this in the beginning but after he lost weight, got in shape, etc; I think he had plenty of women flirting with him, interested in him, etc and his confidence would have soared.

 

[NuttMegg]

I can't give exact details, because they are not my details to give. I can say, the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them, they had an excellent attorney.

Can you disclose that when you mention talking about bankruptcy with Shan'nan, that you are talking only about the bankruptcy they actually underwent? Don't disclose any secrets!

 

[Tippy Lynn]

it is here, but not assets, and she likely made over the income cap so would not qualify for a discount/incentive/tax break, etc.

ETA, I just looked up Colorado, Income max for subsidies for a parent and 2 children is $82K

We don’t know her current income or did I miss that?

 

[molly1255]

Would she be able to get health insurance? I think with all of her issues, it may be impossible or are the preexisting conditions still not allowed to be denied?

Thanks to the Affordable Care Act, pre-existing conditions are no longer an issue, as long as you replace health insurance coverage within 63 days of the date you lost coverage.

If she was covered under CW's employer health plan, she would have been able to extend coverage under COBRA.

In addition, she would have been able to get health insurance on her own through the Health Insurance Marketplace "Obamacare". If she met "low" income requirements under Obamacare, her premiums and even her out-of-pocket expenses would have subsidized. If she met low income requirements, she could have ended up with even more affordable health coverage than what she had under CW's big employer's health plan.

If it were me, and I got a divorce and had a serious, pre-existing expensive health condition, I would want try to meet the low income requirements under Obamacare.

I do have a serious, auto-immune disorder that some medical professionals consider to be a cousin to lupus. My medications alone cost $100,000 every single year, and that is if I say "healthy". Healthy for me is way different than healthy for healthy people and SW may have been in the same boat.

 

[Shekkiec]

@Tippy Lynn You bring up a good point about credit scores and how it could relate to mortgage applications. Could SW's credit score rating have anything to do with the fact that CW was the only registered person on the mortgage of the CO home? Albeit, SW was added to the deed shortly afterward the mortgage finalized but aren't mortgages and deeds two separate things?

They are two separate things imo from being a supervisor at a bank they would have gone through Prequalification for their home and would have been advised the best loan type they would be eligible for based upon area and income (example USDA ) or FHA ( first time buyer) with FHA as long as you have @580 credit score or above.your down payment is only @3.8%. Some people choose this loan because of down payment being lower. This interest rate seems good but you are required to pay an insurance premium to protect your loan on top of that if you pay less than 20% down You also are required to pay 1.75 percent of loan at closing. If C.W. and SW did not have 20% down at closing, plus if they had a lower credit score it could increase interest to 10%. All these fees added to their payment plus property tax and home insurance would imo be more than I would want to pay.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

I can't give exact details, because they are not my details to give. I can say, the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them, they had an excellent attorney.

And attorneys cost money, especially the good ones.

 

[JDough]

I believe that although she received many products/supplements for free, she also paid for them too. The family used a lot of Le-Vel’s products which aren’t cheap (a pro-bar alone is $5 a pop). A lot of MLM marketers purchase their own products as an incentive to boost sales and they often
even use their bonuses to purchase additional merchandise in order to offer free give aways and samples. It is therefore unlikely that she was getting all of her Thrive/Le-Vel products for free.

SW may have purchased Thrive products in the beginning. But after she referred 2 people who began to use the products, she received hers for free. As additional people joined, she continued to earn free product. Once she became a promoter and built her team, she would have been eligible to receive many of the new products at no cost. She then was able to use the product, or give away samples to increase sales.

Although; she could have written many of her expenses (product purchase- if any, home office, cell phone, Apple watch, internet, clothing, etc.) off on business taxes. I (personally) don't believe her business was contributing to any financial hardship at the time of her death.

 

[mickey2942]

We don’t know her current income or did I miss that?

Remember, income is separate from assets. If their cars are leased, no asset, the home is not included, and it was mortgaged, no asset.

If SW managed her self employment income, that everything was a legitimate business expense, her income would be very little.

 

[Madison418]

IMO He probably felt like this in the beginning but after he lost weight, got in shape, etc; I think he had plenty of women flirting with him, interested in him, etc and his confidence would have soared.

I didn't speak to his confidence, really I meant more personality traits. He could be super confident and still not be personable or extroverted IMO. I think he didn't like that it was effortless for her

 

[Deleted member 230544]

I can't give exact details, because they are not my details to give. I can say, the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them, they had an excellent attorney.

@BabyButterfly I find the comment that the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them (CW & SW) disconcerting.
To my way of thinking the emotional impact and consequences of filing for bankruptcy would cause stress and rightly so ~ it should be stressful and consequences should be set forth in order not to repeat the behaviors that brought on the bankruptcy in the first place. Respectfully, it alarms me that you state SW & CW did not find the bankruptcy a stressful thing.

 

[Shekkiec]

SW may have purchased Thrive products in the beginning. But after she referred 2 people who began to use the products, she received hers for free. As additional people joined, she continued to earn free product. Once she became a promoter and built her team, she would have been eligible to receive many of the new products at no cost. She then was able to use the product, or give away samples to increase sales.

Although; she could have written many of her expenses (product purchase- if any, home office, cell phone, Apple watch, internet, clothing, etc.) off on business taxes. I (personally) don't believe her business was contributing to any financial hardship at the time of her death.

do you know how her income would have been affected by losing Chris as a team member? Imo I have no knowledge if he would stay however moo it seems she recruited him. Would she lose pay on everyone recruited under him if he was no longer on her team?

 

[Shekkiec]

All I can say is, I talked at great lengths to SW about bankruptcy, and how to rebuild their credit afterwards.

was this a current inquiry on bankruptcy or in the past in your opinion

 

[BabyButterfly]

was this a current inquiry on bankruptcy or in the past in your opinion

It was regarding the bankruptcy they had filed.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

@BabyButterfly I find the comment that the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them (CW & SW) disconcerting.
To my way of thinking the emotional impact and consequences of filing for bankruptcy would cause stress and rightly so ~ it should be stressful and consequences should be set forth in order not to repeat the behaviors that brought on the bankruptcy in the first place. Respectfully, it alarms me that you state SW & CW did not find the bankruptcy a stressful thing.

I agree. I would think it would be stressful.
jmo

 

[Shekkiec]

It was regarding the bankruptcy they had filed.

Thank you

 

[BabyButterfly]

@BabyButterfly I find the comment that the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them (CW & SW) disconcerting.
To my way of thinking the emotional impact and consequences of filing for bankruptcy would cause stress and rightly so ~ it should be stressful and consequences should be set forth in order not to repeat the behaviors that brought on the bankruptcy in the first place. Respectfully, it alarms me that you state SW & CW did not find the bankruptcy a stressful thing.

I probably did not word that properly, my apologies. Of course all bankruptcy is stressful, but with a good attorney, it does take some of the stress off. I can say the same for me, even though it was over 20 years ago, mine went very smoothly. All calls and letters go through the attorney, so any creditor calls, etc. You don't have to deal with anymore.

 

[Thepoet]

They are two separate things imo from being a supervisor at a bank they would have gone through Prequalification for their home and would have been advised the best loan type they would be eligible for based upon area and income (example USDA ) or FHA ( first time buyer) with FHA as long as you have @580 credit score or above.your down payment is only @3.8%. Some people choose this loan because of down payment being lower. This interest rate seems good but you are required to pay an insurance premium to protect your loan on top of that if you pay less than 20% down You also are required to pay 1.75 percent of loan at closing. If C.W. and SW did not have 20% down at closing, plus if they had a lower credit score it could increase interest to 10%. All these fees added to their payment plus property tax and home insurance would imo be more than I would want to pay.

We may know their down payment, but I don,'t believe we know the interest rate, their F.I.C.O.s, savings, assets, etc, at the time they purchased house.

 

[JDough]

do you know how her income would have been affected by losing Chris as a team member? Imo I have no knowledge if he would stay however moo it seems she recruited him. Would she lose pay on everyone recruited under him if he was no longer on her team?

We do not know if CW recruited anyone. But no, she would not have lost income. The people CW recruited (if any) would have remained under her.

 

[NuttMegg]

@BabyButterfly I find the comment that the bankruptcy was not a stressful thing for them (CW & SW) disconcerting.
To my why of thinking the emotional impact and consequences of filing for bankruptcy would cause stress and rightly so ~ it should be stressful and consequences should be set forth in order not to repeat the behaviors that brought on the bankruptcy in the first place. Respectfully, it alarms me that you state SW & CW did not find the bankruptcy a stressful thing.

Well, I am not the person you were replying to, but IMO bankruptcy relief can't be just for rich people who exhibit risky business behaviors and don't think twice about 1 bankruptcy after another, constantly burning laborers, construction companies, etc. All of us overspend, most of America carries a lot of debt, and so did CW/SW.