Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #38

[Thepoet]

@Mrspratcher

I also wonder if he was really speeding through red lights when he knew his entire family was dead.

Oh, I really believe that was the truth about speeding through the red lights. I don’t know where he was when NUA rang him and told him that she had called LE but I thought he told her that he’d be there in 5 minutes. That would be an excellent reason to drive through red lights. He told NUA that she was going to visit a friend that day, so why the huge rush to get home before LE. It seems to me there was something he absolutely wanted to retrieve from the house before they arrived. Too bad, LE got there first, and lucky for NUA that
They did.

Your last sentence. It's been discussed before and it's scary. If LE hadn't been there, would CW have invited NUA in to look around? Would she have become a victim?

 

[idfinch]

CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #34

Here is the post quote I referenced. It sums up my feelings completely.

Just imagine .. He had to put them down feet first, as he held their arms up high, looking at their contorted faces, as he twisted and shoved their little bodies into total darkness.

Then closed the lid. Twice.

That's right, we don't understand you, CW.

 

[Deleted member 229974]

I do not believe this is accurate.

Oh, I could of sworn I read something to that effect on here.

 

[Layla123]

I do not believe this is accurate.

Can you please share the evidence you’ve found that leads you to believe CW has close friends? I haven’t seen any! Thanks.

 

[MsBetsy]

Makes no sense to me. It seemed like some posters were all over slayer which I found weird. Inside info by some, I guess.

I certainly don't have inside information, nor do I think it's weird to call someone out. It interferes with the discussion and now we don't have to deal with the distraction, thanks to some observant posters.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Your last sentence. It's been discussed before and it's scary. If LE hadn't been there, would CW have invited NAU in to look around? Would she have become a victim?

If he had no qualms murdering his family, why wouldn't he take out someone who could really spill some beans about him. He knew she and Shanann were close friends.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

Your last sentence. It's been discussed before and it's scary. If LE hadn't been there, would CW have invited NUA in to look around? Would she have become a victim?

I believe NUA would have been a victim, too.

 

[NuttMegg]

We know the officer was dispatched to the home at 1:40pm. This was after NUA reported that she called CW asking him to come home since she was worried about SW and the girls.

After the officer's arrival, per the warrentless arrest affidavit, LE called him asking for the code to get access to the house. CW told him he was 5 minutes away and that it was broken.

My guess is that CW was still trying to keep up appearances at work. If he was able to report for work right after murdering his wife and concealing the bodies of his family members, I highly doubt NUA showing up at his door would have been enough to pull him away from a lunch break, or whatever else he was doing.

He was trying to shoo away NUA initially, by telling her SW and the girls were at a friends house, alluding to a separation, and who knows what else. That didn't seem acceptable at all to NUA, which I think led her to calling the police. I think he probably left for work as soon as NUA let him know of that (if she did), which probably left a good amount of time for police to respond to the house, speak with NUA alone to get some background, and walk around the outside of the house looking for an entry way. Jmo

Thanks, then he would have had plenty of time to drive in from Hudson or wherever he was working, in time to be 5 minutes away for her second call. I was just wondering if he said where he was when she first called. She probably knows what he said, it will be in her testimony with lots of details we don't know yet.

 

[MsBetsy]

Can you please share the evidence you’ve found that leads you to believe CW has close friends? I haven’t seen any! Thanks.

The closest person I have seen was his roommate in college, who said the only reason they were friends was because they lived together. He described him as not socializing and that he preferred to stay behind when everyone went out. It did not seem like he knew him well at all. Which makes me think he didn't talk much, either. Jmo

 

[idfinch]

Thanks, then he would have had plenty of time to drive in from Hudson or wherever he was working, in time to be 5 minutes away for her second call. I was just wondering if he said where he was when she first called. She probably knows what he said, it will be in her testimony with lots of details we don't know yet.

From AB last night, it was said that "technology" played a part in finding the burial site, which he identified after seeing the drone pics.

I'm hoping that means GPS records from the truck, which would solidify where he was the night they all died, and what his actions were from the time he got that first call from NUA. It would show if he lied about the timeline that day. That would be interesting to say the least.

 

[NuttMegg]

Just curious....do they call it a "warrantless arrest affidavit" because he is already in custody? Otherwise, would it be just an "arrest affidavit" and then they go pick up the person?

 

[Thepoet]

I recall reading a prior post that pointed out CW didn’t have many close relationships with women, or men.
I wonder about his upbringing and personal family life sometimes. Just what makes a person do what he did.

That's a good question. What does make a person do what he did? We'll probably have to wait until the trial to get some answers.

 

[JudgeJudi]

@MassGuy

“Physical evidence proving that CW killed the girls would be great, but that wouldn’t be necessary to make a case against him.

Absent any physical evidence of SW doing this, the circumstancial case against CW is solid”.

As the saying goes, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

 

[Mrspratcher]

@gitana1 and @Mrspratcher

If I understand the following correctly, if the person is convicted of a felonious killing in a criminal proceeding, after all right to appeal has been exhausted, such conviction is conclusive under the Slayer Statute. Thus, the killer’s right to inherit from the victim is extinguished and the killer is generally treated as though he or she predeceased the victim.

Colorado Revised Statutes 2016 § 15-11-803 – Colorado Probate Code

15-11-803. Effect of homicide on intestate succession, wills, trusts, joint assets, life insurance, and beneficiary designations.

(1) Definitions. As used in this section, unless the context otherwise requires:
…
(b) "Felonious killing", except as provided in subsection (7) of this section, is the killing of the decedent by an individual who, as a result thereof, is convicted of, pleads guilty to, or enters a plea of nolo contendere to the crime of murder in the first or second degree or manslaughter, as said crimes are defined in sections 18-3-102 to 18-3-104, C.R.S.

(2) Forfeiture of statutory benefits. An individual who feloniously kills the decedent forfeits all benefits with respect to the decedent's estate, including an intestate share, an elective share, an omitted spouse's or child's share, the decedent's homestead exemption under section 38-41-204, C.R.S., exempt property, and a family allowance. If the decedent died intestate, the decedent's intestate estate passes as if the killer disclaimed his or her intestate share.
…
(b) Severs the interests of the decedent and killer in property held by them at the time of the killing as joint tenants with the right of survivorship or as community property with the right of
survivorship, transforming the interests of the decedent and killer into tenancies in common.
…
(6) Wrongful acquisition of property. A wrongful acquisition of property or interest by a killer not covered by this section shall be treated in accordance with the principle that a killer cannot profit from his or her wrong.

(7) Felonious killing; how determined - time limitations on civil proceedings.
(a) Criminal proceedings. After all right to appeal has been waived or exhausted following the entry of a judgment of conviction establishing criminal accountability for the felonious killing of the decedent, such judgment conclusively establishes the convicted individual as the decedent's killer for purposes of this section.

https://leg.colorado.gov/sites/default/files/images/olls/crs2016-title-15.pdf (page 168)

In your opinion would the property be sold, SW’s share distributed to her parents, and CW’s share held in trust until all appeals have been finalised?

Actually, they wouldn't even need to wait until there was a conviction:

(b) Civil proceedings.  Notwithstanding the status or disposition of a criminal proceeding, a court of competent jurisdiction, upon the petition of an interested person, shall determine whether, by a preponderance of evidence standard, each of the elements of felonious killing of the decedent has been established.  If such elements have been so established, such determination conclusively establishes that individual as the decedent's killer for purposes of this section.

So, theoretically, SW's parents, as the interested persons, can file a petition, and if they prove the elements required for a felonious killing, such a finding would conclusively establish that he is the killer, and CW would be treated as if he predeceased SW, and her estate would go to her next rightful heir (which I believe should be her parents).

A preponderance of the evidence standard is the standard of proof for most civil actions. Normally, a jury is instructed to find for the party that has the strongest evidence - however slight that may be.

If you recall, OJ was found guilty of murdering Nicole and Ron in the civil case. This was because of the preponderance of evidence standard.

Colorado Revised Statutes Title 15. Probate, Trusts, and Fiduciaries § 15-11-803 | FindLaw

 

[PommyMommy]

Can you please share the evidence you’ve found that leads you to believe CW has close friends? I haven’t seen any! Thanks.

I think NT was probably close. He and CW ran together and it was mentioned in their video interview that the two couples got together to play UNO. Of course, the Thayer's were horrified after they realized CW killed his entire family.

NT said, "He fooled us," and "We were duped."
'He fooled us': Friends of man who allegedly killed family speak out after arrest

But I don't think we've seen any close friends of CW come forward to say they believe his nonsensical babble.
MOO

 

[MsBetsy]

If he had no qualms murdering his family, why wouldn't he take out someone who could really spill some beans about him. He knew she and Shanann were close friends.

Right, and then he could have invented some kind of intruder story. It probably would have been more believable than the one he came up with. Jmo

 

[Gardener1850]

That's a good question. What does make a person do what he did? We'll probably have to wait until the trial to get some answers.

I predict we will never get a satisfying "why". Maybe he had motives that will become more clear as we get more info but it won't answer all our questions. JMO.

 

[PommyMommy]

The closest person I have seen was his roommate in college, who said the only reason they were friends was because they lived together. He described him as not socializing and that he preferred to stay behind when everyone went out. It did not seem like he knew him well at all. Which makes me think he didn't talk much, either. Jmo

Yep. Last spoke 13 years ago.

CNN.com - Transcripts
HODGES: I mean, we were buddies but we are not like great, great friends, so we just eventually lost communication. I`d say the last time we spoke to each other was probably around 2005. That was probably about it and Facebook wasn`t really popular back then either. So, we weren`t Facebook friends or anything like that, I just kind a lost all communications with him.

 

[NuttMegg]

From AB last night, it was said that "technology" played a part in finding the burial site, which he identified after seeing the drone pics.

I'm hoping that means GPS records from the truck, which would solidify where he was the night they all died, and what his actions were from the time he got that first call from NUA. It would show if he lied about the timeline that day. That would be interesting to say the least.

I wonder if they can Xray tanks. Looks like there is technology for welds and to assess other construction methods, I know they x-ray the welds on the Alaska Pipeline. And they use it of course in airport lines, and the article says cargo bins. But I can't figure out if they can xray a tank with a liquid inside, and pick up images of bones, which would be denser than the oil but not as dense as the metal of the tank. This would be assuming they couldn't see the girls from that top hole. If they can, it looks like the portable xray unit pictured about half way down and on the right is small and compact. So just maybe it is a technique that the oil companies use, and maybe it could have been to scan the tanks before he admitted (some of) his crimes. Industrial radiography - Wikipedia

 

[Thepoet]

If he had no qualms murdering his family, why wouldn't he take out someone who could really spill some beans about him. He knew she and Shanann were close friends.

You're right. CW would have been a cornered animal and dangerous! And NUA probably knows quite a bit of the truth. It could have been worse.