Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #39

[Best of What's Around]

I agree. I think maybe the suitcase was too heavy for her to carry upstairs and she thought he was asleep upstairs and didn’t want to wake him. She could have opened the suitcase and taken out what she needed and went upstairs with the things, and her phone. I’m wondering if he pretended to be asleep and she was killed in bed, either befor or after falling asleep. In this case, the girls would likely have been killed after her. I also wonder if he didn’t later sit in the loft area to look through her phone and maybe delete some things. Running out of time, he stuck it between the cushions to deal with later that day. IMO

What speaks to me most about this scenario is that it appears the least likely to result in a confrontation, screaming, and things going wrong, and most likely to result in the least amount of struggle and possibly not seeing their faces (if he strangled from behind while they slept). I am not married to any particular scenario, but for a man who in his past seemed to steer away from confrontation from what we have heard of him, it seems most likely to me. The killing of the children before she got home seems way to risky, but then again logical does not appear to be CW's middle name, either.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I hate when killers force their parents and family and friends to spend time and money that they don't have in order to search for your missing family that you know you already killed. Jmo.

He had his dad flying down on heart attack mode for his missing grands. While Cw knew the entire time the grands (grandchildren) weren't missing. Smh

 

[PrimeSuspect]

In the Christopher Vaughn trial, his wife's mental health records and medications were evidence at trial because he blamed her. I don't believe any parent will kill their child without underlying mental health issues and CW absolutely will have a psych exam.

I looked up Christopher Vaughn and there is a difference, he had a gun shot wound to his thigh, later revealed to be self inflicted. CV had a 'better' case than CW and he was still found guilty.
CW sustained no injuries even though he grappled with SW, who had long nails btw, as she was strangling CeCe. This trial will not be complex one, imo.

 

[tmar]

Agreed. The same kind of person who conducts 3 media interviews to lead the world on a wild goose chase, shows no signs of devastation during those, and texts his dead wife within hours of dumping her body all in cover up. What kind of person? A murderer of his entire family IMO.

I hope CW is charged, for money spent by Police, in the initial wild goose chase.
It could come out his food allotments and toiletries : no chocs, no delicacies, basic soap only, until paid.

 

[Lorelei1]

What speaks to me most about this scenario is that it appears the least likely to result in a confrontation, screaming, and things going wrong, and most likely to result in the least amount of struggle and possibly not seeing their faces (if he strangled from behind while they slept). I am not married to any particular scenario, but for a man who in his past seemed to steer away from confrontation from what we have heard of him, it seems most likely to me. The killing of the children before she got home seems way to risky, but then again logical does not appear to be CW's middle name, either.

Yah, I don’t think they had an emotional conversation or whatever he said in the interview. If it were me coming home at 1:48(?) and my husband had to get up at 5 or whatever time he usually got up, I’d be very quiet and try not to wake him. I think he lay there waiting for her to get into bed and maybe fall asleep. IMO

 

[katydid23]

I think he has two routes there to lessen the charges from Murder 1...one, is the defense of another (thought she might still be alive) and passion/rage. From what we have read in the affidavit, I think he could still TRY and make a case for either one. Thankfully, I do not believe he will be successful IMO.

Right, he has two routes, but they are both problematic.

The 'defense of another' route: but he didn't do anything to actually help the girls or get them medical intervention, so it is a difficult way to go for his defense


The 'passion/rage' route: makes sense he would feel rage. But if he is in a rage because she killed his babies, why did he immediately kill his unborn baby in the same way?

 

[tmar]

I looked up Christopher Vaughn and there is a difference, he had a gun shot wound to his thigh, later revealed to be self inflicted. CV had a 'better' case than CW and he was still found guilty.
CW sustained no injuries even though he grappled with SW, who had long nails btw, as she was strangling CeCe. This trial will not be complex one, imo.

I certainly hope you are correct.
I worry, that CW stating SW was murdering her children (which I don't believe) may sway some on jury.
Of coarse, this idea suddenly happened, after conversations with his father!!!!!!

 

[katydid23]

Apologies if this has already been discussed. I'm jumping off your post to ask those that might know(lawyers, LE, SAR) if privately-owned drones were used, what does that do to the chain of custody if evidence is discovered? And if evidence is not discovered, does LE regard the searched area as "ruled out" evidence-wise? Does LE/SAR operate the privately-owned drones for search purposes? Does the jurisdiction being searched determine some of these answers? Thanks in advance!

I am not 100% certain, but I was under the impression that the oil company had the drones and used them for security and to keep watch on their properties and assets. Maybe I imagined that to be true?

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

So much for the Communications course...

LOL!!

 

[MsBetsy]

Right, I get what you're saying. I guess I wasn't very clear. To clarify, I realize he's a liar regarding the affair pre and post murder, but we don't know if he was prior to the affair/murders.

How well do you think he will do in court if he or his lawyers say that until about eight months ago, he was just an honest guy?

 

[PrimeSuspect]

I don’t blame anyone for trying to save their marriage. We don’t know what type of messages CW was sending or if they were double/mixed messages.
jmo

Of course, we know, it's a fact. CW conducted an affair or affairs while married, that is sending mixed messages, he's continuing on as if there is no affair, he's lying to SW about what he does on the side.
CW should have left the marriage and then, begin his relationship with his lover/s to NOT be sending mixed messages that his marriage is ok.

 

[Jennifer17]

I am not 100% certain, but I was under the impression that the oil company had the drones and used them for security and to keep watch on their properties and assets. Maybe I imagined that to be true?

LE can use images from private security cameras so I don't see any difference in using a drone owned by a private company.

 

[tmar]

I would think oil would wash away DNA evidence in a similar way to water washing it away. Maybe not as quickly or thoroughly though. Jmo

I am hoping, it will create a film, like a thickening, an adhesive, around the body, and preserve what is on the skin: perhaps for a short time.
As putting on a film of 'glad wrap' or similar.
When applying oil, to your body: the grime and muck beneath remains, if not initially washed off.
It would be just great, if the oil did something similar.
I have no experience in this. MOO.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Are there photos of the loft area anywhere on SW's social media? I've looked at the house floor plans before and now I'm confused on the layout. TIA.

AB described it as an area at the top of the stairs, like a landing, on the way to the bedrooms. I will check the transcripts for it and post it.
Edit: I'm just catching up in the thread, I see others have provided pics of loft.

 

[Best of What's Around]

I am hoping, it will create a film, like a thickening, an adhesive, around the body, and preserve what is on the skin: perhaps for a short time.
As putting on a film of 'glad wrap' or similar.
When applying oil, to your body: the grime and muck beneath remains, if not initially washed off.
It would be just great, if the oil did something similar.
I have no experience in this. MOO.

Maybe, but he also tampered with all the bodies just by wrapping them up, moving them downstairs (if necessary), into the garage, into his truck, driving for miles, out of his truck, and getting them upstairs and into a small tank hole or into the hole in the ground. That is a lot of movement right there for trace evidence to be removed/attached in the process IMO.

 

[Best of What's Around]

Right, he has two routes, but they are both problematic.

The 'defense of another' route: but he didn't do anything to actually help the girls or get them medical intervention, so it is a difficult way to go for his defense


The 'passion/rage' route: makes sense he would feel rage. But if he is in a rage because she killed his babies, why did he immediately kill his unborn baby in the same way?

Plus, in both cases, strangulation to the point of death is time consuming and unnecessary. She might have been rendered unconscious in 10-15 seconds. And with both stories, none of the rest of what he did really jives with what a reasonable person would have done under either scenario, either. Only a guilty man (of all murders) IMO would have done all he did after the fact.

 

[human]

Thanks, I'm not seeing a separate staircase in those photos. Isn't this the loft area:

In the first photo you can see a bit of green just past the the double doors at the top of the stairs. That looks like it leads to the master bedroom (which is green). In the second photo, you can see the purple walls of another room that would be one of the girl's bedrooms. JMO.

You can also see the house plant that is in the loft through the door to the master bedroom in this photo:

All rooms seem to be on the same floor to me.



Thank you, that clears it up for me. I believe the loft is on the same level as the bedrooms. It is still possible CW hid the phone there but I think it is just as likely SW had a reason to place her phone there on her way to one of the bedrooms or that it ended up there during a struggle. All seem like plausible scenarios IMO.

ETA: I'm slow to post, sorry! I just saw others also came to the same conclusion about the loft.

I read somewhere that a detective (?) ssid the couch was leather and slippery. It looks like ultrasuede to me.

The other day I could not find my comb. I was looking all over for it. I sit on a cushioned chair and comb my hair out on the veranda. My husband had asked if I looked in the chair.

Duh. Of course. I stuck my hand down each side and dug around. Nothing.

My husband came and lifted up th cushion and there it was, stuck further down. There were other things there as well. Popcorn. Hm

Anyway, it is easy to lose stuff in those loose cushions on those couches.

 

[human]

Or he hid the phone so she would not be able to get to it.

How did he get it from her? Maybe she went to the bathroom?

 

[Gardener1850]

AB described it as an area at the top of the stairs, like a landing, on the way to the bedrooms. I will check the transcripts for it and post it.

Thanks. I already figured it out from others posting the real estate listing and the floor plans. I would still like to see photos of the loft area from SW's social media however. AB said the sofa was a leather one and therefore hard for the phone to accidentally get between the cushions but I'm not sure if that leather sofa is actually located in their loft or if it is elsewhere in the house (they have two downstairs living areas plus a finished basement). Are there photos that make it clear where that sofa is located or that are clearly of the loft area? TIA.

 

[Gardener1850]

I read somewhere that a detective (?) ssid the couch was leather and slippery. It looks like ultrasuede to me.

The other day I could not find my comb. I was looking all over for it. I sit on a cushioned chair and comb my hair out on the veranda. My husband had asked if I looked in the chair.

Duh. Of course. I stuck my hand down each side and dug around. Nothing.

My husband came and lifted up th cushion and there it was, stuck further down. There were other things there as well. Popcorn. Hm

Anyway, it is easy to lose stuff in those loose cushions on those couches.

Those photos are from the real estate listing. I'm assuming it's the furniture from before the Watts bought the house. I have seen very different furniture in their SM photos but I have not looked closely before to try to figure out which sofa is where. I know they do have a leather one. It's the one in the the creepy doll photo. But I can't tell from that doll photo where the sofa is in the house.

ETA: PommyMommy has further clarified that those photos are not of their house. It is a different address with the same floor plan. So it is not their furniture.