Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #40

[NuttMegg]

Good Morning everyone. I don't have a lot of time today to post but last night we were discussing the water spraying video and whether it was relevant to the murders. Some said they thought SW looked sad. Others said they sensed anger in the video. It was suggested that possibly the affairs were already ongoing and SW and CW were not happy at the time. These are subjective opinions that anyone is free to have. It seems pointless to argue with opinions about the Watt's family's perceived happiness in a SM video. But I have re-watched it and I'm just stumped on how these conclusions are being drawn and what it has to do with the murders. Here is the video for anyone who has not seen it:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10154470326696935

Here are some facts about the above video that are not based on opinion:
The video is 3 minutes and 17 seconds long.
This video was posted to SW's fb April 24, 2017.
This video happened approx 1 year and 4 months prior to the murders.
Bella would have been only 3 and Cece not yet 2.
Not once do we see SW's face in this video.
Bella was not harmed during this video.
Bella did not have an asthma attack.
CeCe was not harmed during this video.
The dog, Dieter, was not harmed.
CW was watching from inside the house and present inside the door with CeCe throughout the entire video.

My Opinions and Observations Only:
I see a happy giggling child playing a game with her mother.
When SW asks Bella to open her mouth for water, Bella complies and more giggling ensues. When SW asks Bella to show her belly, Bella complies again more than once and giggles and shrieks with joy while her mother squirts her belly with the water bottle.
In the beginning, SW asks CW not to let CeCe outside.
SW squirts the sliding door window pane in front of CeCe and mentions that CeCe doesn't like the water but loves to stay behind the slider and pretend she is getting hit with water.
This shows that SW was aware of how CeCe would react.
SW knows her daughters and has played this game before.
SW even gives the water bottle to Bella at one point so Bella can squirt the glass in front of CeCe. Bella squirts towards CeCe and then turns the water on her mom with glee.
SW only objects to the water coming at her because she has her phone and doesn't want to get it wet. She takes the water bottle back after a couple times of Bella spraying towards her.
In the very last seconds of the video Bella does start to get a little whiny and asks to go in, lifting her arms up to CW to open the door and pick her up. SW says jokingly to CW "no, don't save her". but the video ends as she lets Bella go inside.
SW doesn't force the child to continue when she gets a little upset. The video ends at that point.
At no time do I see any sign Bella is not enjoying the water play until the last seconds.
How some are concluding SW looked sad or may have been angry when we don't see her face once is beyond me.
One cannot possibly judge someone's emotional state from an approx 3 minute video in which you only hear her voice describing her water fight with her children as it occurs.
And that voice is not raised in anger nor yelling any insults during the video which would indicate anger.
She is not professing anything that is sad either-- the opposite is occurring as she describes how they love to play games like this with her kids (my interpretation of SW's saying "This is why we have kids").
To say that SW was sad because she enjoyed making her daughter laugh while spraying water is so far off the mark it would be funny if these were not murder victims we are discussing. Instead, I find that insinuation insulting and disgusting.
There is just no possible way to gauge if SW was actually sad behind her laughter at her child's giggles. Why people are trying to say that is baffling to me. And if she was sad 1 year and 4 months prior to being murdered by her husband, what does that reveal?
This video also offers no evidence of an ongoing affair 1 year and 4 months prior to the murders. That's not to say CW wasn't cheating yet (he is a proven cheater and proven liar now) but if he was cheating it is not revealed by this water spraying video.
We barely see CW. He stays inside behind the sliding door with CeCe and opens the door to let Dieter in once.
Like many of SW's videos, CW is only in the background and doesn't say much.
But he is aware of the situation the entire time it is happening.
Yet CW is not criticized by anyone criticizing SW for spraying Bella with water.
If this water play was so bad and dangerous to Bella, why didn't CW intervene sooner? Why is he given a free pass as to his actions?
What does anything in this video have to with the murders? I fail to see any connection. Aside from the sadly ironic end where SW's JOKES "Don't save her," contrasted with the gruesome reality that 1 year and 4 months later CW did NOT save Bella. CW proceeded to choke the life out of her and hide her body in an oil tank 1 year and 4 months later.
Are some saying SW's joking in a water fun video is a self-fulfilling prophecy? I'll agree it's eerie but it's not indicative of SW telling CW to murder his child and hide the bodies 1 year and 4 months prior to him doing it. Not by a long shot.
Lastly, I'm at a loss to understand how this video could be used in court. I don't think we will see it played but if we do it will be used to show how much JOY SW shared with her children.
A joyful life that was taken away too soon by CW.
MOO.

Thank you for posting that, Gardener. I just can't believe the insinuations they are making regarding that fun video.

 

[NuttMegg]

I think the discussion is that perhaps she did not post videos because she could feel something was wrong. Not because she did not post enough.

Yet we don't know how many videos she took, and she was with the people she filmed a lot of videos for. I can believe her parents tuned in every day to see what she was posting about her family. Why do it when they are literally right there with her?

 

[Gardener1850]

According to HLN (AB) SW was making 14 or more videos a month but it went down to barely nothing after June (I think). The last video CW was in was the SanDiego trip and there was only one shot of him saying "what's going on." His tone of voice was not pleasant in my opinion. AB concludes there was something wrong between them at this point because she was not making as many videos. SW made no videos during her vacation to NC. Now that could have been she wanted to relax with the family or there was trouble with CW.
SW the devoted mom she was would put the needs of her children above everything if there was going to be a separation IMO
IDK maybe he wanted to leave but had no place to go so continued to play devoted dad and husband and charm SW all the while getting angrier and angrier
Interesting that Nico was still going to have his dads middle name Lee and SW looked forward to going home to CW and the girls so I don't think there were any big arguments
Per HLN AB the AP is cooperating completely with the police. It will be interesting what LE finds on the phones and computer.

Good observations. One thing of note-- One of our VI's (Colorado, I think?) told us that AB's analysis of the number of videos was incorrect because some videos were removed from SW's fb by family after the murders. IIRC, this was either so the videos could be used for evidence in court or because the last videos on her news feed were receiving tons of very upsetting comments that family did not wish to see. So we should probably take the number of videos currently up and the meaning behind it will grains of salt. JMO. I agree with your last sentence, I can't wait to see what was on the phones and computer. That will tell a real story IMO.

 

[MerryB]

My point was IRT my view of the spraying video. I felt there was an undercurrent of restlessness in the video. I felt SW seemed unusually not herself, with the spraying in the face, and I wondered what could cause that, and IMO maybe she was stressed because CW was already cheating on her and gaslighting her about it. When someone gaslights you, it distracts you.

To me, it showed hostility toward her child.

 

[Backstroke10]

I've sent you some instructions on how to insert a single quote. Go to your Inbox.

Thank you JudgeJudi that was so nice of you. I followed your instructions and hoping this works now.

 

[human]

Yet we don't know how many videos she took, and she was with the people she filmed a lot of videos for. I can believe her parents tuned in every day to see what she was posting about her family. Why do it when they are literally right there with her?

Posters are saying there are videos out in youtube

 

[Gardener1850]

Thank you for posting that, Gardener. I just can't believe the insinuations they are making regarding that fun video.

Thanks for reading it. I can't believe how long my post ended up being.
I can't believe the things I'm reading either. It's just a mom having fun with her daughters!

 

[mtnlites]

Since these videos are so subjective, I find that having a conversation about them is difficult. I did not see "hostility" towards SW's children in them. Nobody looked scared to me. I would even argue that she wasn't "spraying" her in the face, but squirting her. I think there's a difference. I saw her laughing and squealing in fun-the same thing that my kids do when I literally spray them in the face with the water hose. The same thing I did when I was a kid. "Stop, stop, stop," I'd squeal while the water was hitting me. And then, when the person stopped, "Nooooo!"

The video is more than a year old, too.

 

[NuttMegg]

Posters are saying there are videos out in youtube

I don't know what to say. What difference what that make? We still don't know how many videos she made, during the vacation or ever, so to my mind it's very difficult to analyze SW's feelings towards CW, the AP, the weather, the train schedule, or anything else from guessing how many videos there were. He MURDERED her.

 

[NuttMegg]

Since these videos are so subjective, I find that having a conversation about them is difficult. I did not see "hostility" towards SW's children in them. Nobody looked scared to me. I would even argue that she wasn't "spraying" her in the face, but squirting her. I think there's a difference. I saw her laughing and squealing in fun-the same thing that my kids do when I literally spray them in the face with the water hose. The same thing I did when I was a kid. "Stop, stop, stop," I'd squeal while the water was hitting me. And then, when the person stopped, "Nooooo!"

The video is more than a year old, too.

Exactly. The kid was delighted.

 

[mtnlites]

I don't know what to say. What difference what that make? We still don't know how many videos she made, during the vacation or ever, so to my mind it's very difficult to analyze SW's feeling towards CW, the AP, the weather, the train schedule, or anything else from guessing how many videos there were. He MURDERED her.

Some are watching those videos and seeing hostility and child abuse. Others are watching them (ie. me) and seeing a fun, normal family having fun. And around and around it goes.

 

[NuttMegg]

Some are watching those videos and seeing hostility and child abuse. Others are watching them (ie. me) and seeing a fun, normal family having fun. And around and around it goes.

Thank goodness it was only a squirt bottle like I use to mist my houseplants. What if it had been a plastic squirt gun.

 

[mtnlites]

Exactly. The kid was delighted.

I guess I am kind of appalled that, as Bella was being sprayed in the face and terrified, her father didn't step in and try to rescue her or put a stop to it.

 

[Mellowmelly]

Good Morning everyone. I don't have a lot of time today to post but last night we were discussing the water spraying video and whether it was relevant to the murders. Some said they thought SW looked sad. Others said they sensed anger in the video. It was suggested that possibly the affairs were already ongoing and SW and CW were not happy at the time. These are subjective opinions that anyone is free to have. It seems pointless to argue with opinions about the Watt's family's perceived happiness in a SM video. But I have re-watched it and I'm just stumped on how these conclusions are being drawn and what it has to do with the murders. Here is the video for anyone who has not seen it:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10154470326696935

Here are some facts about the above video that are not based on opinion:
The video is 3 minutes and 17 seconds long.
This video was posted to SW's fb April 24, 2017.
This video happened approx 1 year and 4 months prior to the murders.
Bella would have been only 3 and Cece not yet 2.
Not once do we see SW's face in this video.
Bella was not harmed during this video.
Bella did not have an asthma attack.
CeCe was not harmed during this video.
The dog, Dieter, was not harmed.
CW was watching from inside the house and present inside the door with CeCe throughout the entire video.

My Opinions and Observations Only:
I see a happy giggling child playing a game with her mother.
When SW asks Bella to open her mouth for water, Bella complies and more giggling ensues. When SW asks Bella to show her belly, Bella complies again more than once and giggles and shrieks with joy while her mother squirts her belly with the water bottle.
In the beginning, SW asks CW not to let CeCe outside.
SW squirts the sliding door window pane in front of CeCe and mentions that CeCe doesn't like the water but loves to stay behind the slider and pretend she is getting hit with water.
This shows that SW was aware of how CeCe would react.
SW knows her daughters and has played this game before.
SW even gives the water bottle to Bella at one point so Bella can squirt the glass in front of CeCe. Bella squirts towards CeCe and then turns the water on her mom with glee.
SW only objects to the water coming at her because she has her phone and doesn't want to get it wet. She takes the water bottle back after a couple times of Bella spraying towards her.
In the very last seconds of the video Bella does start to get a little whiny and asks to go in, lifting her arms up to CW to open the door and pick her up. SW says jokingly to CW "no, don't save her". but the video ends as she lets Bella go inside.
SW doesn't force the child to continue when she gets a little upset. The video ends at that point.
At no time do I see any sign Bella is not enjoying the water play until the last seconds.
How some are concluding SW looked sad or may have been angry when we don't see her face once is beyond me.
One cannot possibly judge someone's emotional state from an approx 3 minute video in which you only hear her voice describing her water fight with her children as it occurs.
And that voice is not raised in anger nor yelling any insults during the video which would indicate anger.
She is not professing anything that is sad either-- the opposite is occurring as she describes how they love to play games like this with her kids (my interpretation of SW's saying "This is why we have kids").
To say that SW was sad because she enjoyed making her daughter laugh while spraying water is so far off the mark it would be funny if these were not murder victims we are discussing. Instead, I find that insinuation insulting and disgusting.
There is just no possible way to gauge if SW was actually sad behind her laughter at her child's giggles. Why people are trying to say that is baffling to me. And if she was sad 1 year and 4 months prior to being murdered by her husband, what does that reveal?
This video also offers no evidence of an ongoing affair 1 year and 4 months prior to the murders. That's not to say CW wasn't cheating yet (he is a proven cheater and proven liar now) but if he was cheating it is not revealed by this water spraying video.
We barely see CW. He stays inside behind the sliding door with CeCe and opens the door to let Dieter in once.
Like many of SW's videos, CW is only in the background and doesn't say much.
But he is aware of the situation the entire time it is happening.
Yet CW is not criticized by anyone criticizing SW for spraying Bella with water.
If this water play was so bad and dangerous to Bella, why didn't CW intervene sooner? Why is he given a free pass as to his actions?
What does anything in this video have to with the murders? I fail to see any connection. Aside from the sadly ironic end where SW's JOKES "Don't save her," contrasted with the gruesome reality that 1 year and 4 months later CW did NOT save Bella. CW proceeded to choke the life out of her and hide her body in an oil tank 1 year and 4 months later.
Are some saying SW's joking in a water fun video is a self-fulfilling prophecy? I'll agree it's eerie but it's not indicative of SW telling CW to murder his child and hide the bodies 1 year and 4 months prior to him doing it. Not by a long shot.
Lastly, I'm at a loss to understand how this video could be used in court. I don't think we will see it played but if we do it will be used to show how much JOY SW shared with her children.
A joyful life that was taken away too soon by CW.
MOO.

Bella looks like she is having fun to me, I think SW would be criticised if she didn’t play with her kids, at least she was interacting with them and she sounded as if she was enjoying herself too.

 

[PommyMommy]

My first post! I hope I’m not repeating - as I’ve tried to read through all of the last thread but I’ve got 3 kiddos here )

Regarding the kinder situation. I’ve moved around quite a bit. In Fl, I found it to be unusual for kids to start “school” meaning a private daycare or church offering a curriculum of learning with a teacher before state founded pre-k within the school systems. When I moved to TX my youngest was three- there is no state funded (meaning paid for by the state- not you) pre-K and it was the usual here to put kids starting around 3 in church or private preschools - half days 2, 3 or more days a week. Those schools also offer a kindergarten option. I would imagine her daughter started one of these programs earlier bc they are less strict about age cut offs. Just a clarification for those confused about why the kids would be in daycare or if she was starting kinder in the public schools. Had I not lived here I might be confused about a lot of that.

I also have read the flight to NC was difficult and in my opinion and the opinions of others, his trip out was to help with the flight home.

You guys are great and I’ve really enjoyed reading all your posts, this entire situation in tragic

Welcome to Websleuths, millermills!
Nice of you to join us here and I look forward to reading more of your posts.​

 

[NuttMegg]

Bella looks like she is having fun to me, I think SW would be criticised if she didn’t play with her kids, at least she was interacting with them and she sounded as if she was enjoying herself too.

My main thoughts after seeing that video 1) wow, Bella was having fun, and Cece too. 2) Nostalgia, if only my own parents would have had that technology to record all the times we played with the water hose on hot summer days in coastal PNW.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Thank you for posting that, Gardener. I just can't believe the insinuations they are making regarding that fun video.

IKR? It's turning into a parenting debate again. It appears SW was a 'bad' parent and it's going to be reintroduced again and again, and we fall for it.

There's a warning at the beginning of each thread that the parenting discussion is not on. Everyone has different styles of parenting and basically, it hasn't got anything to do with this appalling tragedy but there's an agenda in play here. If we don't agree, we're bad parents. Talk about an undercurrent.

 

[Backstroke10]

Lol! Now that I know that you can't help it, I will not be offended. I am laughing. Don't worry about it.

Thanks Jennifer17. It's a good thing they closed this thread last night or I could have been tagging you all night lol UGH I think I have the quote thing down now at least. I'm not going to even try the @ or double quotes.

 

[tara83]

To me, it showed hostility toward her child.

To me, it showed hostility toward her child.

Wow.I had better not show a video of me and my son having a food fight.I threw ice cream in his face and we had a great time joking around.

 

[NuttMegg]

IKR? It's turning into a parenting debate again. It appears SW was a 'bad' parent and it's going to be reintroduced again and again, and we fall for it.

There's a warning at the beginning of each thread that the parenting discussion is not on. Everyone has different styles of parenting and basically, it hasn't got anything to do with this appalling tragedy but there's an agenda in play here. If we don't agree, we're bad parents. Talk about an undercurrent.

You are absolutely right. If we don't reply, the insinuation stands, if we do, we fall into the trap. Anyway, it's a very nice sunny Sunday, and the broccoli starts are calling me........