Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #40

[Mellowmelly]

After His Pregnant Wife Vanishes, Husband Said Their Marriage Was Having Problems: Report

That’s when, Atkinson said, Chris allegedly made a surprising disclosure.
“I didn’t find out that they were going to separate or anything like that until I called Chris that morning,” she told ABC. “When I called him and asked him where she was, that’s when he told me and I basically told him that that wasn’t my [concern] at that particular moment, because it wasn’t and that their business was their business, that they would either work it out or they wouldn’t.”​

BBM
I wonder how many weeks CW may have been planning their murders. The VI who was a friend or family member of CW said he had told SW multiple times that he wanted out of their marriage. Maybe he just told HIS family and friends when he went back to NC for that final week. He could have told them not to mention it to SW or her family because she hadn't told them herself because she was still in denial.

Yes, there was the employee at her mom's salon who mentioned a possible separation but SW's closest friends didn't seem to know anything about a separation. NUA was her best friend, had just spent the AZ trip with her and was the last person to see her alive. She first heard from CW about a marital separation the first day they went 'missing'.

Idk, maybe it's just me but I would confide in my best friend before my own family. I never tell a family member something I wouldn't want everyone else in my family to know because they just aren't good at keeping secrets.

Anyway, my theory is that CW was planting the seeds in NC for his family and friends to back up his story about him wanting a separation. I think he even told them that she was threatening to take the girls and he would never see them again if he left her.

And if only his friends and family knew about a separation, that pretty much rules out him killing them in a rage because it means he was planning to kill them for weeks. MOO

I think you could be 100% right, how calculating and cold if true.

 

[JDough]

I do have children. I also work with children & families. In fact, if this video becomes an issue in the case and/or the central theme of hostility I personally find disturbing is a main point of discussion (which it may never be), I might consider becoming verified. As of right now, my career has no bearing on our discussions, other than to say I feel that I have a good point of reference for my opinions on this.

I always enjoy reading your posts, and looking at things from another perspective, Merry. I appreciate your passion, and the experience you bring to the case. I am interested in investigating the concerns you have brought up and looking a little more at things from your perspective. I have read a great deal of information from the AAP (AAP.org) link you provided several threads ago, but have the following questions regarding the case:

If you believe SW was hostile or possibly abusing her daughters in some way, why do you think there are no confirmed reports of investigations for child abuse? (I am assuming that if there were any reports, we would have seen them by now?)

Have you ever witnessed a child having long-term emotional issues from playing a pie-in-the-face game, or having been squirted in the face with water while playing? If so, what type of issues did the child (or children) have? Do you believe, based on your experience, that Bella or CeCe (had they lived) would have had lasting emotional issues from this type of play?

Are there any children (in your personal experience), that have had emotional issues from receiving a time-out (previously discussed)? If so, what kind of issue(s) did they have? Do you believe Bella or CeCe would have had emotional issues from receiving time-outs?

Are you aware of any child that suffered negatively from getting too much sleep (also previously discussed)? Does a child have the ability to remain asleep (or sleep as long as reported for Bella and CeCelia), if they are not tired?

I think the potential concerns you have raised may be relevant to the case if brought up at trial. What proof do you think the defense may use to address this? I, personally, do not think SW was abusive in any way based on the information we currently have available, but am very open to looking at things from another perspective. It will be very interesting to see if any of these things enter into the trial, IMO.

Agree. The press doing a interview that quickly seems like they were directed to by LE or Nua to help catch him up in lies.

Or perhaps the media genuinely wanted to get as much information as possible to help find them? It is possible the media received prompts from family, friends, or LE- I'm just not convinced (yet) of this. We also know most media outlets (or reporters) want to "crack the case", or be the one to have exclusive interviews for higher ratings. I do agree that LE used the videos to point out his inconsistencies during questioning, and were probably very pleased that CW gave them.

 

[Gardener1850]

I see an experiment taking place sometime in the near future. I think I know someone who has a very similar sectional sofa.

MOO

I love these types experiments! I hope you will video it.

 

[gitana1]

Wouldn't CW have to mention her mental health on the stand if he wants the court to consider her mental health as a possible factor for his scenario.

Or can the defense just allow a defense witness to open up the possibility while they are on the stand?

No. They can bring it up in opening. Then they can try to put on witnesses to attest to her "bizarre" or "unstable" behavior. The judge will decide whether it's relevant testimony or to allow it in.

In these cases we have sometimes seen a lot of latitude given to the defense though. Think about the Jodi arias trial. (And I know she testified but I'm talking in terms of what horrible, unfounded theories they allowed to be explored to dirty the name of the deceased).

They can try to put on "experts" to try to say that video or audio footage or SM posts or texts, voicemails, emails, whatever, evidence abusive behavior. They did that in the arias case.

In order to really prove she had mental health issues that could've led to her going off the deep end they'd likely though, have to have her doctors up there and/or evidence of calls to 911 due to suicidal ideation, threats, etc., attempts at psych holds, etc. Things we've seen in cases where women have annihilated their families.

And I have yet to see one such case where that kind of thing wasn't known and reported on within DAYS of the homicides. Not one.

If they go this route it's going to be a tough row to hoe. Because there's going to be a ton of evidence and testimony that evidences she was stable, IMO. Her close friends like NUA, who saw and spoke with her daily. The Thayers. School staff. Fellow parents. Colleagues in the business. Her doctors. Just the fact that her husband left the kids alone with her regularly.

Her life and how those around her interacted with and reacted to her evidence stability.

There's going to have to be a lot more than, "yeah she was successfully treated for some depression and anxiety issues. She continued with treatment and reported no significant problems."

And as I've said, I've yet to see a female family annihilator case when that stuff didn't come out very quickly.

Impressions or gossip from those desperate to believe CW won't be enough.

 

[mickey2942]

All this and why on earth would the father allow and even participate if his wife's actions toward his children was so abusive?

I do not believe that SW was abusive. There has not been any evidence or indication of this. Or neglectful. I hope that the prosecution comes down on this, if the defense tries to open up this line of questioning.

A strong personality parenting style, may not be everyone's preference, but it is far from abuse.

 

[PommyMommy]

I love these types experiments! I hope you will video it.

I've been trying to find a photo of it to see if it's believed to be comparable to the Watts' loft sofa and I can't find one without family members in it. So, I'm requesting a photo...stay tuned!
MOO

 

[NuttMegg]

Your family was abducted on Monday but you spend the night at a friend's house on Tuesday?

Why?

Did LE force him to sleep somewhere else?

If so than that's strange.

He was just too lonesome to sleep in the house alone. After he murdered 3 people and a fetus, you know, the people who lived there.

 

[MassGuy]

I’ve said this before, but the spirit of this seems to have been lost somewhere.

We can glean some things from social media, specifically those Facebook videos.

But for an alternate theory to be based on those videos and little else, isn’t being “open minded,” it is being blind to hard facts.

Focusing on the small things, and ignoring the “elephant in the room,” is flawed thinking IMO.

 

[gitana1]

I wasn't directing it at anybody as to proving it happened! I just really wanted to read it because it seemed like the media, when they walked up to the door, knew a lot of information. And I just really wanted to see the original press release that was done that morning to the media that made them show up at his door early on Tuesday morning. I'm just curious as to the language and what that original press release had in it.

ETA! I see you posted it in a later post! Thank you so very much! I have never seen it before

"Missing Persons - Be On the Lookout
On August 13, 2018, the Frederick Police Department was notified of 3 missing persons. Shanann Watts 34 years old, and her two daughters that are 3 and 4 years old are missing as well. Shanann is also 15 weeks pregnant. There is no vehicle associated at this time.
If you have any information regarding this case, Please contact the Frederick Police Department at 720-382-5700 or dispatch at 720-652-4222 with any information regarding this BOLO."

It does appear that the media had a lot more information, as they knew she was pregnant and she had just returned from a trip from a trip Etc before they did the interviews.

Smart catch. However, they talked to him before they began filming (recording?) so I imagine they got stuff from him first.

ETA: I think it was just good, journalistic instinct. Innocent people don't act like him. IMO.

 

[TitoTaco]

I apologize if this has been posted. I’m playing catch up....

Tribune opinion: Court must make autopsy reports public in Christopher Watts case

 

[ZsaZsa]

The cutest photo taken by SW I have seen is one taken at "the end of a long day with two very tired, very sick kids" which shows Celeste with a HUGE snot bubble coming from her nose. She is laughing, SW is laughing, and she says "What you gonna do but laugh". No sign of anything but affection and tolerance there.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I do not believe that SW was abusive. There has not been any evidence or indication of this. Or neglectful. I hope that the prosecution comes down on this, if the defense tries to open up this line of questioning.

A strong personality parenting style, may not be everyone's preference, but it is far from abuse.

Unless CW pleads Guilty or No Contest than the defense has no choice but to try and prove SW killed or at least capable of killing the kids which lead to CW's self defense or diminished capacity claim for her murder and cover up.

And if I was his family. I wouldn't show up to court if he took this route. No jail visits either. Jmo

 

[NuttMegg]

I wonder if, when he went to the friends' house to sleep on Tuesday night, he locked up the house with the 2 door guards and the key pad that didn't work, so if she showed up she couldn't get in and wouldn't know where he was.

 

[PommyMommy]

I apologize if this has been posted. I’m playing catch up....

Tribune opinion: Court must make autopsy reports public in Christopher Watts case

Thank you, TT. I hadn't seen this article and I've added it to the media thread. I think all of our verified attorney's agree that the autopsy results will most likely be released. I wish we knew when we will hear one way or another.
MOO

 

[DeeMor]

No, not as well, they're the same sheets/pillowcases. The bedding found lying on the floor beside the bed as described in the affidavit and the subsequent time it's found in the trash can is mentioned as August 15 -


On August 13, at approximately 1340 hours Officer Coonrod was dispatched to 2825 Saratoga Trail on a check well-being (CWB) call.
......
At Officer Coonrod's request , Det Baumhover responded to the scene and arrived at approximately 2.35 pm.
.......
Upstairs Det Baumhover observed the bed in the master bedroom had been stripped of its bedding, which was lying on the floor. Officer Coonrod and Det Baumhover both checked the bedding for signs of foul play but found nothing.
......
August 15 - The sheet matched the pattern of several pillow cases and a top sheet recovered from the kitchen trash can from the Watt's residence earlier that day.

https://mediaassets.thedenverchannel.com/document/2018/08/20/arrest affidavit chris watts_95256653_ver1.0.pdf

The actual day and time the pillow cases and top sheet found in the trash can that matched the fitted sheet found at the tank site isn't detailed in the affidavit, it was between August 14-16 - the two day investigation period LE were questioning CW. I don't know if a day and time was reported elsewhere.

Edit: dixiegirl has posted the day was Wednesday, August 15.

Thank you for that explanation, PrimeSuspect.

 

[gitana1]

Bumping...

Thanks for the reminder.

 

[MsBetsy]

I think you could be 100% right, how calculating and cold if true.

I have always thought maybe his telling people about his wanting a separation was part of his plan as well. Especially since he made sure to tell her friend, LE, and the media right after the murder. Not that he came right out and said it during his interview, but hinted by revealing that they had "an emotional conversation," This, and the fact that he seemed to be distancing himself from his family for several weeks. Shanann told her friend he was not the same. He was not giving the children the attention he normally would. He was distant. The woman that waited on line with them at the amusement park noticed that he was not interacting with the family. It seems he was trying to distance himself, or he had already seperated himself from them. Jmo

 

[Deleted member 182072]

I think you could be 100% right, how calculating and cold if true.

It's just a theory but still incredibly disturbing to think how CW might have been laying the groundwork for his own family in NC to back up his absurd claim that Shanann could have just taken the girls and left everything behind because he wanted a separation. IMO, that was his original plan, along with abandoning her car later, once it was dark enough that no one would see who was driving.

And while he was plotting to murder his family, poor unsuspecting Shanann was planning a gender reveal party and a Steeler's theme for baby Nico's room. MOO

 

[LittleFleurDeLys]

He was just too lonesome to sleep in the house alone. After he murdered 3 people and a fetus, you know, the people who lived there.

Do you know what? When he mentioned in his interview his house seemed to him like a "ghost town" and he had the lights up all night just in case they would "return" - I thought he might have been really afraid of their poor souls haunting him. If it was not that sad it would be somehow funny...

 

[NuttMegg]

Do you know what? When he mentioned in his interview his house seemed to him like a "ghost town" and he had the lights up all night just in case they would "return" - I thought he might have been really afraid of their poor souls haunting him. If it was not that sad it would be somehow funny...

I thought of that too. Two ghostly little girls coming in to say "Why did you hurt me, Daddy?"