Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #47

[AbbyG]

I want to know why he thought his defence wouldn't succeed. I think it may be his disgusting disposal of the girls bodies and that he was able to raise a smile and a chuckle the next day.

I am going to guess that autopsy and phone and hard drive and other concrete pieces of evidence make his story absolutely insupportable.

 

[BabyButterfly]

SW’s friend Lauren who was one interviewed by news in Colorado, gave some background info recently that I think gives more insight into CW’s family relationship. She said that SW and CWs mom and sister always had a volatile relationship from the beginning. The mom was used to having say over CW and didn’t like to give up that control. Their relationship was so bad that the mom and sister didn’t go to their wedding or birthday parties but the father did. The father always got along great with SW.

She also said that both CW and SW found out baby was a boy in NC. She could never have predicted CW would do this, she even had CW babysit her kids before. She said there was never any abuse and she thinks he snapped in the heat of the moment. Also the couch where the phone was found was right in front of the bedrooms, so she thinks phone ended up in struggle.

No offense, but I know a link was asked for, and I can't find it? I was scanning, so I may have missed it.

 

[Tortoise]

Thank you gitana. I agree that is most likely. Coward, gaslighter and liar right up to the wire. I was only trying to think what else it could be if not a psych evaluation.

 

[Tortoise]

I am going to guess that autopsy and phone and hard drive and other concrete pieces of evidence make his story absolutely insupportable.

Maybe their clothing. If Shan'ann and the girls weren't in PJs, and she was wearing the clothes she arrived home in and the girls their party clothes say. He's more stupid than I thought if he left behind incriminating internet searches or deleted texts that could ever reveal him as the killer and his planning of this.

 

[RavenCC2020]

Just popping back in to say I heard he took a plea deal. Some people don't like it when a killer is offered plea deals preferring to make him stand trial and allow the evidence to convince a jury that in turn finds him guilty.

In this case I am very happy for Shannon's family that they will be spared a nightmare trial where they would learn details that will only further their pain. The family now is able to give their victim statements and he will be forced to sit there quietly and hear what they have to say. I always felt judges should order the defendant to look DIRECTLY at them when they give them. If they look away or are disrectful in any way, the judge had the authority to allow a guard to slap them upside the head *sigh*

To me, it worked on the best way possible for the family. As it stands they will receive as much justice as they ever would in this case and have the advantage of being spared the lies the defense would attempt to throw out there. Not much solace after such an enormous loss, but solace just the same. My heart goes out to her loved ones and friends.

 

[gitana1]

Exactly. In a normal case you have two options, the suspect did it, or someone else did.

Here, we had a suspect who had a mountain of evidence on top of him.

The only alternative was to ignore the evidence, and blame the victim, based solely on the word of a self admitted liar.

It’s one thing if there is evidence to support his claims, but there was none.

That's true.

I'm aware of the details of every bit of nonsense gossip that was out there about Shanann that I suspect was spread by those close to CW who loathed Shannan. And not one bit of it was evidence that would support his story. None of it. Nothing.

 

[sun16]

I’m looking forward to SW’s brother’s impact statement (if he decides to speak). I’d give CW two earfuls.

 

[gitana1]

Just popping back in to say I heard he took a plea deal. Some people don't like it when a killer is offered plea deals preferring to make him stand trial and allow the evidence to convince a jury that in turn finds him guilty.

In this case I am very happy for Shannon's family that they will be spared a nightmare trial where they would learn details that will only further their pain. The family now is able to give their victim statements and he will be forced to sit there quietly and hear what they have to say. I always felt judges should order the defendant to look DIRECTLY at them when they give them. If they look away or are disrectful in any way, the judge had the authority to allow a guard to slap them upside the head *sigh*

To me, it worked on the best way possible for the family. As it stands they will receive as much justice as they ever would in this case and have the advantage of being spared the lies the defense would attempt to throw out there. Not much solace after such an enormous loss, but solace just the same. My heart goes out to her loved ones and friends.

100% agree. This is a fantastic outcome in my mind. I'm so relieved for her loved ones- friends and family.

 

[gitana1]

I’m looking forward to SW’s brother’s impact statement (if he decides to speak). I’d give CW two earfuls.

That's going to be so hard to hear. He will be crying through it I think. Poor guy.

 

[MsBetsy]

No offense, but I know a link was asked for, and I can't find it? I was scanning, so I may have missed it.

I can't find it either. Not that any of that would surprise me, but I would like to read the source, too.

 

[Thepoet]

I think it was a wise decision to agree to the plea deal, and avoid wasting years and years trying to disprove CW’s sick and vicious lies. It’s so much better for all concerned. It’s not like CW is headed for Disneyland. Listening to CW admit “Guilty” 9 times between sobs had to be very satisfying. It’s over now, they’re off to a better life without having to include CW in their daily thoughts.

I think the only wisdom involved in the plea deal was the defense attorneys and the prosecution. It sounds to me like CW was led into it kicking and screaming. I do believe there is information, that CW is terrified about being revealed, that would have come out at trial, but won't come out now. Probably about his sexuality. Something that would shatter his self image and the image his family has of him. There had to be some leverage, other than the DP, that forced this early plea agreement. From the defense point of view; why now? Why not wait until the DP is announced? Anyway, the sentencing hearing on the 19th should be very interesting and then CW can disappear into "the belly of the beast"!

 

[gitana1]

Reading between the lines, I come away with the idea that the DA didn't learn a thing from the plea process, about CW, beyond what he had finally said in his confession after speaking with his father.
Which is why he said we can't believe anything CW says, because of all the false stories he told in the interviews and, IMO, all the lies he told to LE before the consultation with the father. And the lies, IMO, he told AFTER the consultation. And it seems like at the sentencing on the 19th we won't learn anything new either, nor will the DA.

This must seem obvious to some, I guess I'm slow. It seems weird to me that someone can get a plea accepted for so many murder counts without spilling the beans, so to speak, but that must be the legal system.

Sometimes it's part of the plea deal. "Allocution". But watch Ariel Castro's rage-filled, self-serving statement to the court in his allocution. And tell me what it accomplishes other than giving the guilty a platform for their narcissistic rage, entitlement and self-pity.

I don't care to hear anything that lying baby killer says at this point forward. None of it will be true. He will try to paint himself as the victim or otherwise try to manipulate people into thinking he is not as monstrous as he actually is.

 

[Thepoet]

Pre trial motions are where they try to do things prior to trial like seal autopsy reports until trial, get info like asking the coroner to do certain tests. Etc.

At this stage it's not usually when they file what's called motions in limine to keep certain evidence out. That happens closer to trial.

There would be no reason to file a motion about such a session until closer to trial, I would think. Unless they were seeking to subpoena certain records but didn't want to have unsealed, HIPAA info that was communicated to them by CW that would support the subpoena?

I think they could just subpoena it without revealing anything though. Her mental health status became at issue when he claimed she went nuts and killed the kids.

I'm just not seeing any possibility.

All that stuff about his possible medical condition or whatever, that wouldn't come out publicly anyhow until trial and THAT's when they would file motions to keep certain evidence like that out, as more prejudicial than probative, for example, depending on what it is.

The timing of the motion supports what my law partner said. It was related to competency. Or an insanity defense.

What is your take on the timing of the pleas agreement? Isn't it unusual? I can see if from the prosecutions point of view and of course for SW's family, but why the rush by the defense? Why not wait, at least, until the DA announces the DP? If CW really was yelling, crying, and cursing, then he must have been opposed to the idea. Thanks.

 

[Thepoet]

Sometimes it's part of the plea deal. "Allocution". But watch Ariel Castro's rage-filled, self-serving statement to the court in his allocution. And tell me what it accomplishes other than giving the guilty a platform for their narcissistic rage, entitlement and self-pity.

I don't care to hear anything that lying baby killer says at this point forward. None of it will be true. He will try to paint himself as the victim or otherwise try to manipulate people into thinking he is not as monstrous as he actually is.

Bravo! So true.

 

[Thepoet]

I am going to guess that autopsy and phone and hard drive and other concrete pieces of evidence make his story absolutely insupportable.

Agreed! I think the autopsy results will be devastating. I also believe that premeditation will be incontestable ( as you say; "phone and hard drive and other concrete pieces of evidence") and may well have begun days or weeks before the murders.

 

[Thepoet]

I'm sure that LE has done a very thorough investigation, but I just can't help wondering if someone else in CW's life ever just "disappeared"? Back in NC for instance, and would an investigation extend to NC? We'll know more about the planning of the murders after the next hearing, but for now, it seems the planning wasn't bad and if it hadn't been for the late plane and NUA he probably would have gotten away with it for a much longer time. Did he have practice earlier in his life, like with a girlfriend? Perhaps someone who ridiculed him and was going to dump him? Did succeeding once make him feel he could succeed again? The whole thing is so horrible and hard to understand. What drove him to it and what made him think he could succeed?

 

[gitana1]

What is your take on the timing of the pleas agreement? Isn't it unusual? I can see if from the prosecutions point of view and of course for SW's family, but why the rush by the defense? Why not wait, at least, until the DA announces the DP? If CW really was yelling, crying, and cursing, then he must have been opposed to the idea. Thanks.

I'm very surprised at the timing. It is unusual. Which is part of the reason the plea shocked me.

Defense attorneys don't compel their clients to take pleas. They just don't.

I don't think he went into the plea deal kicking and screaming. I think he came into the understanding that his story was rubbish, kicking and screaming.

His defense counsel would talk to him about what evidence they knew of and ask questions. "Is there going to be any evidence that comes out, Chris, of xyz. Keep in mind they can find stuff you've deleted."

Then they would explain to him the impact of that evidence.

They would talk to him about his story and what works and what doesn't. They would explain what's going to happen during trial and what the consequences of going to trial would likely be, in terms of how information is published, what his family and the world would hear and see in dramatic fashion, like autopsy photos, testimony from the AP, internet searches, text messages, etc., and how likely it would be that he'd be found guilty of first degree murder of the girls and what the results would likely be - death or LWOP.

The timing, after the autopsies, before the state said whether they would seek the death penalty, before the autopsy was released, makes me suspect he wanted to shut it all down quickly because of what he knew was coming out and how it's going to make him look. Perhaps he feels the horror of what he did would seem worse if he kept blaming one of his victims as opposed to admitting guilt.

I don't know. There's a lot we don't know.

But I guarantee you that THAT defense team didn't rush into anything, nor coerce him in any way.

The timing suggests this was all CW. Once he realized there was no way his story would be believed, he wanted to stop the train quickly.

Part of it maybe had to do with what he heard about how the public perceived him. He knows the evidence and he knew that would get worse.

The timing was his. For some reason he was in a hurry to shut it down. Minimize all the long, drawn out appearances. The shame of the arraignment. Pre trial hearings. Then of opening statements. Of testimony over weeks.

And hearing bit by bit what was coming out like the autopsy, maybe must've been too much for him.

He wanted it done once he realized there was no real way out.

I can't wait to hear what evidence there is.

 

[PommyMommy]

That's true.

I'm aware of the details of every bit of nonsense gossip that was out there about Shanann that I suspect was spread by those close to CW who loathed Shannan. And not one bit of it was evidence that would support his story. None of it. Nothing.

If I could do one thing for Shanann's family and friends, I would delete every outrageous, slanderous, and baseless accusation made against her, so many times couched with the caveat of "exploring other possibilities" or "I'm on the fence." Imagine losing your only daughter, your two precious granddaughters, your expectant grandson, and having to read a bunch of psycho-babble about her closet, some spray bottle fun and a Santa Claus video. Where is the outrage for someone who crammed the bodies of his beautiful 3 and 4-year-old toddlers into oil tanks?! Where is the disgust for someone who admittedly strangled his wife and unborn son to death and hid them out in the dirt to rot?! Instead, these apologists chose to attack everything from her parenting to how many pairs of shoes she owned.

I can’t even imagine the pain from the enormous loss this family has suffered, much less how they have endured the despicable behavior of people on the internet who never even knew Shanann or her family. These people are appalling. I know CW’s cult-following, fan club, or whatever you want to call “it” is not a first. I mean heck, Charles Manson, Ted Bundy and Richard Ramirez all married after being convicted. There are some sick people in this world. MOO, JMO, IMO

 

[gregjrichards]

If I could do one thing for Shanann's family, I would delete every outrageous, slanderous, and baseless accusation made against her, so many times couched with the caveat of "exploring other possibilities" and "on the fence." Imagine losing your only daughter, your two precious granddaughters, your expectant grandson, and having to read a bunch of psycho-babble about her closet, some spray bottle fun and a Santa Claus video. Where is the outrage for someone who crammed the bodies of his beautiful 3 and 4-year-old toddlers into oil tanks?! Where is the disgust for someone who admittedly strangled his wife and unborn son to death and hid them out in the dirt to rot?! Instead, these apologists chose to attack everything from her parenting to how many pairs of shoes she owned.

I can’t even imagine the pain from the enormous loss this family has suffered, much less how they have endured the despicable behavior of people on the internet who never even knew Shanann or her family. These people are appalling. I know CW’s cult-following, fan club, or whatever you want to call “it” is not a first. I mean heck, Charles Manson, Ted Bundy and Richard Ramirez all married after being convicted. There are some sick people in this world. MOO, JMO, IMO

I’ve thought about that CW getting fan mail and love letters and people putting money in his commissary account it should not be allowed.

 

[Thepoet]

I'm very surprised at the timing. It is unusual. Which is part of the reason the plea shocked me.

Defense attorneys don't compel their clients to take pleas. They just don't.

I don't think he went into the plea deal kicking and screaming. I think he came into the understanding that his story was rubbish, kicking and screaming.

His defense counsel would talk to him about what evidence they knew of and ask questions. "Is there going to be any evidence that comes out, Chris, of xyz. Keep in mind they can find stuff you've deleted."

Then they would explain to him the impact of that evidence.

They would talk to him about his story and what works and what doesn't. They would explain what's going to happen during trial and what the consequences of going to trial would likely be, in terms of how information is published, what his family and the world would hear and see in dramatic fashion, like autopsy photos, testimony from the AP, internet searches, text messages, etc., and how likely it would be that he'd be found guilty of first degree murder of the girls and what the results would likely be - death or LWOP.

The timing, after the autopsies, before the state said whether they would seek the death penalty, before the autopsy was released, makes me suspect he wanted to shut it all down quickly because of what he knew was coming out and how it's going to make him look. Perhaps he feels the horror of what he did would seem worse if he kept blaming one of his victims as opposed to admitting guilt.

I don't know. There's a lot we don't know.

But I guarantee you that THAT defense team didn't rush into anything, nor coerce him in any way.

The timing suggests this was all CW. Once he realized there was no way his story would be believed, he wanted to stop the train quickly.

Part of it maybe had to do with what he heard about how the public perceived him. He knows the evidence and he knew that would get worse.

The timing was his. For some reason he was in a hurry to shut it down. Minimize all the long, drawn out appearances. The shame of the arraignment. Pre trial hearings. Then of opening statements. Of testimony over weeks.

And hearing bit by bit what was coming out like the autopsy, maybe must've been too much for him.

He wanted it done once he realized there was no real way out.

I can't wait to hear what evidence there is.

Thank you so much! Very well stated and I completely agree. I know a great deal is going to be released now, but I can't help wonder if there is something that might not come out until trial,and ending the case now would preclude it from being released? Something he is absolutely terrified of coming out. Thanks again. The 19th should be very interesting.