GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #57

[Mitch11]

If she lied to LE and hide evidence then she's not an innocent bystander after all.

I agree. I actually suspect she might not be? But I just wonder what her intent is. The impression I get is she was an avid lover, loved taking nude pics of herself, was dating widely (and possibly having sex with them?) and pretty much comes across as awful (eg telling CW to pawn off his wedding ring, and telling him to close down his facebook). However, what we dont know is the extent of the lies he was telling her, as well as her level of gullibility.

Obviously she googled SW and she would have seen how incredibly gorgeous, positive and lively SW was, as well as the sheer amount of friends SW had. My guess is NK was incredibly threatened by that, but due to her low self esteem and self worth was getting her jollies from taking SW's man. Its absolutely pathetic but I do believe if it wasn't NK it would be someone else at some point.

 

[MassGuy]

Pages 2117 & 2118
From Sunday, August 13
1705 hours: CW's text to the coworker about going directly to the site the next morning alone.
1946 hours: Shanann asked "Hey honey, kids in bed" and asked for pictures. Watts replied "Bella just back in bed." Shanann noted, "They must be exhausted."

Watts resent the images from earlier in the day (at the dinner table). He also added an image of Bella taken at the birthday party earlier that day.

What do we think about the fact that SW asked for pictures and CW re-sent pictures from earlier in the day instead of sending any current pictures of the girls sleeping? Had he already killed the girls? Especially given the text to the coworker insisting he could go to that oil site alone first thing?

There’s still not enough there to convince me that he killed the girls first.

He appears to be lazy, and those pictures were easier to send than going into their rooms and taking photos of them while they were sleeping.

The texts to co workers was apparently standard practice as well.

The DA wasn’t able to to reach a conclusion one way or another, and I can see why.

 

[Deleted member 182072]

I’m torn. After reading the document, unless I am missing something, it appears that the issue of Bolte’s veracity was never settled.

There were things in there that seemed credible, but there were no communications discovered between the two.

There was apparently nothing revealed in his search history, that indicates that CW is in fact gay, or even bisexual.

It’s still a big maybe for me.

IMO, TB was more sincere than NK, and TB wasn't paid by HLN for his story either.
Can't find the exact page, but SW was worried about CW being with another woman "or worse", IIRC.
And NK did do that search about prepping for anal sex.
Hopefully we'll find out for certain.

 

[MsBetsy]

Discovery Page 1278: Trent Bolte.
I initially dismissed it as hogwash, but after reading TB's statement to the FBI I can't help feeling a ring of truth in his description of CW and his sick behavior.
What do y'all think?

moo

I haven't read that far but I'm interested to see what he has to say. Did investigators seem to believe it? I never really believed his story so I'm going to check it out.

 

[Nellie Nelson]

My thought was he wanted her to think she left it behind because she was leaving him a “take this ring back, I don’t want it anymore” scenario.

My primary thought is that he took it off her finger after killing her and didn't have time to hide it [thanks to Shannan's friend Nicole entering the house with LE before he had time to properly 'clean up'.

I’m not sure if this has been discussed yet, but it’s pretty clear from the discovery document where the “Shanann killed the kids” scenario came from.

Many of us assumed that he didn’t come up with that scenario on his own, because he’s a bit of a dumbass.

I speculated that it may have come from the conversation with his father.

If you read the transcript of his interview with police, you can see that they used various methods in order to draw a confession from him.

One of those methods was to give him “an out” or a scenario in which he was not fully responsible.

That’s what happened here. He bit.

 

[MsBetsy]

There’s still not enough there to convince me that he killed the girls first.

He appears to be lazy, and those pictures were easier to send than going into their rooms and taking photos of them while they were sleeping.

The texts to co workers was apparently standard practice as well.

The DA wasn’t able to to reach a conclusion one way or another, and I can see why.

I wonder what he did with the blankets. I was thinking he burned them, but where? They knew where he went.

 

[pinkie60]

this reminds me of Jodie arias and travis alexander

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

My thought was he wanted her to think she left it behind because she was leaving him a “take this ring back, I don’t want it anymore” scenario.

I thought it was probably in his pocket because he'd just gotten home for first time since burying them. Didn't want to get searched with that in his pocket.

I mean why would he bring it to the officer rather than just let them stumble upon it on the nightstand and he could act shocked.

Moo

 

[MassGuy]

I wonder what he did with the blankets. I was thinking he burned them, but where? They knew where he went.

All we know is they never found them. There was no sign of a fire, and time wasn’t on his side.

We know they weren’t in the tanks, weren’t recovered from Shanann’s grave, and weren’t found in that general area.

It’s a mystery.

 

[nwmouse]

I haven't read that far but I'm interested to see what he has to say. Did investigators seem to believe it? I never really believed his story so I'm going to check it out.

He initially lied to investigators about being paid by CW for sex.
Apparently CW did pay TB for sex each time and got very rough.
Tried choking TB with those python-sized biceps.
He also choked his pregnant wife to death with those biceps.
I do hear a tiny tingling of truth in TB's admission after his initial lies.
Obviously he would NOT make a credible witness during a trial if it had come to that.

moo

 

[PommyMommy]

I would love to see Rourk on a podcast!

In the meantime a few of these are answered in the bizillion Discivery pages:

2) The Sat before the murders is the night he had his friend’s dayghter McKenna babysit, said he was going to the Rockie’s game and went out to dinner w/NK.

3). One of the Dad’s (pretty sure it was Mr Rzucek) said the garage door pad had been broken for a while and was broken when he stayed there.

7). Chris knew the neighbor had the camera because he’d asked him to retrieve info from it before for a truck break-in. What he probably didn’t know is Nate had adjusted the camera angle a bit since then. (not sure the second part is in Discovy docs but Nate (the neighbor) shared that w/me.

14). In at least one of the reports from people there to recover the girls bodies from the tank, it was said they placed the body on a clean white sheet (because of sloughing).

Thanks, Colorado. I haven't been able to keep up and I’ve still only read the discovery in bits and pieces, but I’ve come across a few more answers (in red).

1. What was the significance of the non-porous bag and the footprint?
2. What did CW do with Shanann's engagement and wedding rings? We know from pg 5 of the discovery docs: “Christopher did come up to me [Officer Coonrod] holding Shanann's wedding ring and stated he found it on the night stand.”
3. What did the dogs alert on? From pg 40: While in the home, a track dog was asked to enter, as there had been some indication from the cadaver dog that a struggle or argument may have ensued. Jeff Hiebert and his K9 entered the home. Jeff stated that his dog showed interest in the unmade bed in the basement and an area just below the stairs, but did not do any final trained alerts. We exited the basement and went upstairs to the garage. No indicators were noted in the garage and we exited the home.
4. Will they ever release the police interview with Chris? Link to 8/15 polygraph and interview: Polygraph and Interview with Christopher Watts 08.15.18
5. What is the history about that doll photo on her FB? Pg 1913 – The doll photo was taken by CW and sent to SW. Pg 537 – Coder asks Chris if Bella did it and he said he didn’t recall. Per CW, Shanann thought it was funny.
6. Was NK the only AP or was there evidence he was out trolling for women (or men) on websites?
7. Was the alleged male AP "TB" for real or was he just inserting himself into the investigation?
8. NK "deleted" texts & FB posts before contacting LE. Do we know if LE recovered them?
9. How did Shanann's phone get in the sofa?
10. What was the content of the texts CW sent in the days leading up to the murders? Will they be made public?

See Colorado’s post here for answers to questions on that were previously on the list: CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #57

I will post the remaining questions in just a bit. MOO

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

I actually dont buy his line that they had an 'emotional argument' He lied about so many other things and when you read the communication between him and SW in the last two weeks he barely wanted to speak with her. She was asking him hard questions, he didnt even want to answer.. just walked away or went to bed at various times. I actually think he had no conversation, he just let her go to sleep then strangled her.

This is what I believe too. She came home, fell asleep, he got on top of her in bed. She had no chance to say or do anything.

Moo

 

[Peachykeen]

this reminds me of Jodie arias and travis alexander

Why?

 

[sun16]

There’s still not enough there to convince me that he killed the girls first.

He appears to be lazy, and those pictures were easier to send than going into their rooms and taking photos of them while they were sleeping.

The texts to co workers was apparently standard practice as well.

The DA wasn’t able to to reach a conclusion one way or another, and I can see why.

I’d gone back and forth, but have landed where you have too—just not sure.

 

[Nellie Nelson]

I’m not sure if this has been discussed yet, but it’s pretty clear from the discovery document where the “Shanann killed the kids” scenario came from.

Many of us assumed that he didn’t come up with that scenario on his own, because he’s a bit of a dumbass.

I speculated that it may have come from the conversation with his father.

If you read the transcript of his interview with police, you can see that they used various methods in order to draw a confession from him.

One of those methods was to give him “an out” or a scenario in which he was not fully responsible.

That’s what happened here. He bit.

Yep. It's clearly a very effective tool for LE to use, because it's worked before [I'm sure many of us can think straight away of cases we are familiar with]. It's great that ultimately this false confession lead to a guilty plea [albeit without a true confession] but these days, the false confession will live forever on the internet among those prone to sending hearts and flowers to those that murder their spouse/partner and children.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

I'm sure he did. That's why it would sound suspicious to me. If a mother who cares about her children and who I knew to have financial problems really took off on her own, I would assume she would take the ring as a quick way to make money. Jmo

That would make sense

 

[MassGuy]

I’d gone back and forth, but have landed where you have too—just not sure.

I mean, the DA couldn’t get there and he was privy to everything.

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

I wonder what he did with the blankets. I was thinking he burned them, but where? They knew where he went.

The stuffies too. He claimed they must have blown them away. But if wind is strong enough to blow away toys, why was the sheet still there? And garbage bags.

Moo

 

[kiwilaura]

This post is for @MsBetsy and anyone else is interested. In the last thread I mentioned about how Nichol K told investigators that she encouraged Chris to work on his marriage with Shanann. MsBetsy asked for where this was in the documents. Sorry, I posted several times last night in a rage and never mentioned the page numbers. Will be sure to do that from now on.

Anyway:

Starts at discovery page 569 (document page 502)
It is mentioned several times over the course of the interview that Nichol apparently encouraged Chris to work on his marriage. Chris repeatedly said it was Shanann who wanted out. At one point he apparently told Nichol he his trip to NC was to attempt to work on it with Shanann and find out if the marriage could be saved. He later apparently reported that Shanann's mind was made up and it was over. He also told Nichol that their marriage had been purely contractual for a long time, which we know is not true. The interview also does show that Nichol says she encouraged Chris to read articles about helping children through divorce, and he said "the kids will be fine" (dead).

Of course the texts show a different story to that, poor Shanann was beside herself with fear, pain and confusion.

 

[nwmouse]

Its obvious from reading this document that CW was quite peeved about having to help out with the housework.
He complained to several people.
Poor Baby Bates.
I'm sure Mother and his sister must have been appalled at nasty Shanann, pregnant and sick with lupus, asking him to pull his weight around the house and help out with the toddlers.
UGH. moo