GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #60

[kittycat3]

OK gals (and MassGuy ), I installed the Secret Calculator app and made a video, so y‘all know how it looks like:
Secret Calculator - Streamable

You can hide contacts, passwords, photos AND Google searches.

(gone to missing persons again, this thread‘s too fast for me ).

Thanks!! How interesting!

 

[stereopticons]

@stereopticons do you see any signs that CW is on the autism spectrum?

No. I don't think his lack of empathy is indicative of autism. There is a lot of research on empathy in autism and I think that it's different than a lack of empathy in antisocial personality disorder. People on the autism spectrum have difficulty interpreting social cues, understanding what others are feeling, and predicting how they may act. People with antisocial PD have no trouble with social cues and manipulate them to their advantage. They can see what others are feeling, it just doesn't affect them.

 

[curiouschat]

She DID say that she did it so that the child could learn that she couldn't always have what she wanted.

This was a vindictive move, not a careless one.

See I actually imagined some older people in my family brushing things off with that by saying "she can learn from it" without having set out to make it a lesson for her.

 

[Allabouttrial]

I think that's what we all wonder with family annihilators. It always seems to come from nowhere. I think it's a combination of a lot of things--I expect that while he was submissive to women (SW and his mother), he resented them (again, SW and his mother). He's probably never had to take responsibility for his actions. He probably also has limited emotions and ability for empathy. I think he's probably good at modeling caring parenting behavior without actually feeling it. Does that make sense? I would guess he modeled a lot of his behavior after SW's to make it seem like a good dad. Not actually feeling those emotions would make it a lot easier to kill those poor girls. I would guess that he also blames SW and in some ways, NK for his actions. In some way, he may feel that NK spurred him to do this because it was the only way they could be together.

This is an area of study with a huge amount of research and a lot of mixed conclusions. This is all speculation, but again, I think it's a combination of a lot of personality traits combined with events, like the relationship with NK and the conflict with SW and his parents.

Thank you it really does make sense, especially this part:

"I think he's probably good at modeling caring parenting behavior without actually feeling it. Does that make sense? I would guess he modeled a lot of his behavior after SW's to make it seem like a good dad."

I had noticed that although he seemed to take care of the girls it was like he was doing it on auto-pilot but with little feeling. He seemed to look to Shanann a lot for approval. A habit they both probably got used to. I do feel Shanann was the dominant one, but in the end it just became the norm. for them both, so when CW suddenly "found his voice" it came as a huge shock and she found herself questioning her own behaviour, thinking maybe that she had caused this sudden shift, but in actuality that had been their relationship dynamic from the beginning. My own armchair thoughts!!

 

[Tippy Lynn]

No. I don't think his lack of empathy is indicative of autism. There is a lot of research on empathy in autism and I think that it's different than a lack of empathy in antisocial personality disorder. People on the autism spectrum have difficulty interpreting social cues, understanding what others are feeling, and predicting how they may act. People with antisocial PD have no trouble with social cues and manipulate them to their advantage. They can see what others are feeling, it just doesn't affect them.

Makes sense. Thank you.

 

[Jennifer17]

See I actually imagined some older people in my family brushing things off with that by saying "she can learn from it" without having set out to make it a lesson for her.

Grandmothers of young children?

 

[MassGuy]

we'll have to agree to disagree. I've always agreed with the medical examiner months before it was announced.

Did the medical examiner say “pillow” though?

Smothering someone doesn’t require an object, it simply requires you to stop them from breathing.

A hand can be used for this.

 

[ZsaZsa]

Wow I feel totally clueless right now. I haven't been following closely since it's my busy time at work but have been reading a little bit and was surprised to see so much negativity directed at NK but after reading this article I understand why, I had felt bad for her but no more.

Yes. Her boyfriend had just killed his wife and daughters but her thoughts run to book deals and ' what's in it for me?' No victim indeed.

 

[Layla123]

I think she saw her perfect match, a prize to steal from another woman. Some women are just like that. They get a kick out of it.

If you really talk to them you’ll discover it’s a deep seeded insecurity on their part. It’s really sick to think you’re any better than another woman because some a$$hole is playing the two of you against one another, and in the end you’re going to win something because he picked you.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

I think that is Mother Watts, isn't it?

I thought it was "MIMI" , CW's erhm, mother...

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

Did the medical examiner say “pillow” though?

Smothering someone doesn’t require an object, it simply requires you to stop them from breathing.

A hand can be used for this.

I think DA Rourke said there were no fibers found in the girls mouths or lungs that would indicate any sort of fabric used.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

That secret calculator app has been around for years. There are newer apps now where kids hide things. Parents need to stay on top of this stuff.

what is the specific name of the app on Google Play?

 

[mtnlites]

See I actually imagined some older people in my family brushing things off with that by saying "she can learn from it" without having set out to make it a lesson for her.

That wasn't her place. She was not their mother. By blatantly going against their mother's wishes, she was both disrespecting SW's parental authority and putting the young child's life at risk. What you do to your own child, however you want to "teach" them is one thing, but you don't mess around with someone else's.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

Do we absolutely know that?

Yes, Shan’ann had asked both her family and the Watts to have nut free homes while they were visiting. Cindy had ice cream with nuts it that she gave to all the children there except CeCe which caused her to be upset. Cindy had no alternative for Cece and told her it was a lesson that she did not get everything she wanted. There is a history of conflict between Cindy and Shan’ann.

 

[curiouschat]

Grandmothers of young children?

Yes I really can imagine a grandmother saying or thinking she can just not eat that and learn that she can't always eat what everyone else is eating. And not believing that even being around peanuts without ingesting them could be dangerous. I'm not saying it's kind or how I would do things. But I don't feel ready to say she's a heartless murder accomplice for it.

 

[MassGuy]

Yes I really can imagine a grandmother saying or thinking she can just not eat that and learn that she can't always eat what everyone else is eating. And not believing that even being around peanuts without ingesting them could be dangerous. I'm not saying it's kind or how I would do things. But I don't feel ready to say she's a heartless murder accomplice for it.

Who is calling her a “murder accomplice?”

 

[Layla123]

Yes. Her boyfriend had just killed his wife and daughters but her thoughts run to book deals and ' what's in it for me?' No victim indeed.

I wish you could view this from another angle. NK was suddenly thrust into the public domain, and not by a choice of her own making. Suddenly, she had a brand new identity, and it looked something like Amber Frey. I can understand a curiosity in finding out whatever became of Amber Frey. It’s not fair to assume that NK liked or wanted this new reality she found herself in, but here it was staring her in the face. Did you see the sections in the discovery where she was sobbing and crying? Where her friend said she needed counseling?

 

[mtnlites]

we'll have to agree to disagree. I've always agreed with the medical examiner months before it was announced.

The DA said no fibers were found, indicating that no cloth or fabric was used to smother the girls.

 

[Ilovemy3boys]

I just think that's a leap that it was all malicious. It may be true I just don't think we can say that beyond doubt, Even if she didn't believe the kid had peanut allergies (and is it really not just me that knows a lot of people especially of older generations who are suspicious of all the "newer" diagnoses?) I don't think that means she expected or wanted harm to come to the girls? Tons of mother in laws believe their daughter in laws are blowing things out of proportion or being too fussy or worried about things without being actively instrumental in getting them and all the kids murdered?

Shanann had every right to be mad at MIL. She’s not blowing her daughter’s allergy out of proportion. Like I posted before, she wanted to let SW know who’s boss and piss her off. She was basically being a witch

 

[Jennifer17]

Yes, Shan’ann had asked both her family and the Watts to have nut free homes while they were visiting. Cindy had ice cream with nuts it that she gave to all the children there except CeCe which caused her to be upset. Cindy had no alternative for Cece and told her it was a lesson that she did not get everything she wanted. There is a history of conflict between Cindy and Shan’ann.

And there is also history of CW's family not believing the conditions that the children and SW had.