GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #66

[Tortoise]

What is the letter? Is it confirmed? I haven't seen it in any discovery documents so far or the parents mention it in interviews. I may have missed it though.

That's why I said they claimed to have, not they had.

 

[curiouschat]

That's why I said they claimed to have, not they had.

Where did they claim it?

 

[Tortoise]

Where did they claim it?

I have no idea. It was discussed in the threads here though at the time, and a transcript was posted. Some posters said they had seen a letter. It's up to us whether we choose to believe them and if we choose to believe it was genuine or faked by the Watts. I couldn't see any reason for the Watts to fake a letter saying he would never harm himself, because he wasn't harmed. I choose to believe he wrote the alleged letter with a different plan in mind.

ETA Thinking about it I think it was divulged on the MRS podcasts or channel and we were told by Tricia or liltexans we could discuss the content of those podcasts but not link to it.

 

[Tortoise]

Pg 417 (Discovery pg 476)
MCCOY continued and said WATTS is usually, “a fairly decently dressed man” and said WATTS usually has on tight fitting FR’s (fire resistant clothing), but on Monday WATTS had on a dark blue shirt that was “baggy” and looked like it was an older FR shirt. MCCOY also said WATTS had on a pair of pull on boots, which
MCCOY thought was strange because he knew WATTS had a newer pair of Red Wing boots that he was wearing recently. MCCOY also commented that WATTS normally wore boots that had laces. MCCOY said he even noticed that one of WATTS’ pant legs was tucked inside the top of his boot and the other pant leg was straight. MCCOY said he commented to WATTS, “what, are you slumming it today?” MCCOY said WATTS laughed at his comment. MCCOY said he didn’t notice anything else unusual about WATTS and said WATTS appeared to have his normal demeanor.

I wonder if he disposed of those boots, or if he was wearing them when he got to the house. Seems he'd changed his top from the morning he was filmed loading the truck. I don't remember seeing in discovery that they found a spare set of clothes in the truck, but he must have left home with a change of clothes. Perhaps inside his lunch box?

 

[Tortoise]

It was a weird moment when he presented Shanann's ring at the tip of his finger and not in the palm of his hand. Like it was some kind of magic trick.

He probably spent those minutes in the bedroom polishing off his prints from the outside of the ring so that he wouldn't be accused of removing it from her finger. I expect he thought the officer would whip out an evidence bag right there and then and declare it was a murder investigation.

 

[Gecko100]

The investigators had not seen a letter but that doesn't mean there was no letter. I think there was one and it didn't help his case so the family never passed it on to the police. If there was a letter they probably thought it showed premeditation and the Watts family were certainly not about helping to convict their son.

Quite possibly, no it would not have been useful at all. He is such a transparent loser, once you get a handle on him it's at the point of cringe for him and NK. He is so babyish, probably because I am older and trained, he'd be lucky to get a second look from me from the off.
I can detect a narc at 50 paces, mother brother and sister all narcs, my other brother keeps away like me. It's a no contact deal. Golden children and scapegoats meehh (goat sound)lol.

 

[Gecko100]

I have no idea. It was discussed in the threads here though at the time, and a transcript was posted. Some posters said they had seen a letter. It's up to us whether we choose to believe them and if we choose to believe it was genuine or faked by the Watts. I couldn't see any reason for the Watts to fake a letter saying he would never harm himself, because he wasn't harmed. I choose to believe he wrote the alleged letter with a different plan in mind.

ETA Thinking about it I think it was divulged on the MRS podcasts or channel and we were told by Tricia or liltexans we could discuss the content of those podcasts but not link to it.

Yes it was a MRS podcast, but who knows people have come up with all sorts of bonkers stuff that actually threw the investigators off and wasted time.
Anyone from QLD? The state of despair, not really we are just more laid back and sleepy. Boing boing hey Skippy look out for the nasty drop bears such vicious creatures, crocodiles are way more playful and friendly. lol

 

[Hag]

It was a weird moment when he presented Shanann's ring at the tip of his finger and not in the palm of his hand. Like it was some kind of magic trick.

Seriously weird behaviour. Seemed to have no idea that things were looking bad for him, until the neighbour called him over to view his camera action! Bit nervous then!

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

Hi all. I've seen a few posts stating that NK was homely/ unattractive. In looking at the photo of her online, I'm pretty sure most of us have seen it, she is not unattractive at all, IMO. Is this photo not really of her? TIA.

Pretty is as pretty does?

 

[Tortoise]

I think that was what he was wearing taking the bodies out. Those looked like pull on boots. Really look like galoshes (rain boots, milking boots, the kind you wear where it is muddy). My personal theory is that be would throw away the old clothes and boots. The boot print at the site would not match the new Red Wing Boots. He just did not anticipate NUA calling with all of his work mates around to get suspicious of him.

Good thinking. And his coworkers all noticed him wearing the old boots.

 

[NuttMegg]

I really doubt she had that much say, much less direction, over the newspaper shots. I'm not saying it was a great idea for her to do the interview but I'm pretty sure they have professionals that set that up to look serious and somber.

No, they do a little makeup and darken the brows, nothing with all those special lights and angles, not for a TV/Newspaper article. Besides, the photographic contrast was way too extreme for the feature she appeared in. She knew she was going to come over as a floozy and was trying to tell the story on her own terms. Serious woman meets man, had no idea his wife had bun in the oven. She could hardly use all the smiley face snapshots.

 

[Tortoise]

NUA’s son is a very astute young man. Not only was he birddogging CW around his house, he found SW phone in the couch and when CW extended his hand to take it, he gave it to the officer.

He was in the neighbor’s living room while they were watching the CW truck in the driveway video and said that while they were watching, CW kept walking in front of the tv so the cop couldn’t see the left side of the tv.

That is actually pretty amazing. To be looking for her phone in the house while knowing she wasn't in the house. It must be very hard to know someone and put that aside to consider the worst. He was thinking already where might CW have hidden it. I wonder if the Apple watch was under a different cushion.

 

[BrownRice]

Realized another CW lie. CW told Anadarko he needed Friday 8/10 off because he had to take SW to airport. He met Troy McCoy later that day for the firestick and TM saw girls in backseat of Lexus.

Didn’t NUA pick up SW for the airport at 430?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I think this is the outfit CW wore, to dispose of the bodies.
?? CW did not want his good clothes, with smell remnants of deceased bodies.
I think Police also found a pile of CW's old baggy clothes on the floor which he stated he would give to charity.
MOO.

Remember in Discovery we saw that the dogs had interest in the area underneath the stairs. That's exactly where those pair of baggy pants he supposedly was giving to charity in the video.

moo

 

[NuttMegg]

Where did they claim it?

Some of these questions could be better answered at the J4 Justice youtube site. They are part of the group that promoted the letter back when they were mrs. Ask in the comment section, you'll be flooded with help. The letter, if it ever existed, wasn't published on WS to my knowledge.

 

[kaykay543]

Also, in the body cam video that shows Chris first arriving to the scene. Did anyone notice that all the ceiling fans were running? So in the minute between going inside the home and letting LE/NUA in, our dude from hell potentially got her cellphone from the Lexus, turned it off, dumped it under the couch cushions and last but not the least turned on all the ceiling fans (to disperse the odor of murder, I would guess).

That was a busy one minute of activity right there.

ETA:

See at : 29:40, 38:50

The cadaver dog handler talks about the fans making it hard for the dog to get a scent. I think this is part of the reason the dog didn't alert. We know they all died in that house yet the dog didn't really alert. IMO we can't put much into the dog at all because of this.

I worked for the Illinois State Police training center years ago. I watched them train the dogs everyday because I am a huge dog lover. None of their cadaver dogs were handled like this handler did. Which doesn't make her wrong; but it surprised me as it is so opposite of what ISP did. We don't know either how long this dog had been working, how experienced the dog is etc.

 

[Tortoise]

The cadaver dog handler talks about the fans making it hard for the dog to get a scent. I think this is part of the reason the dog didn't alert. We know they all died in that house yet the dog didn't really alert. IMO we can't put much into the dog at all because of this.

I worked for the Illinois State Police training center years ago. I watched them train the dogs everyday because I am a huge dog lover. None of their cadaver dogs were handled like this handler did. Which doesn't make her wrong; but it surprised me as it is so opposite of what ISP did. We don't know either how long this dog had been working, how experienced the dog is etc.

I was surprised at her handling of the dog too, I think that was the trauma-detection dog. I don't know why they didn't switch off the fans before they started.

 

[Tortoise]

Remember in Discovery we saw that the dogs had interest in the area underneath the stairs. That's exactly where those pair of baggy pants he supposedly was giving to charity in the video.

moo

I believe I've read that the dog was interested in the area under the stairs in the basement. But I do think that pair of jeans there was somehow connected with the murder, it's not as if he would only have one item of clothing from his entire wardrobe that he no longer fit.

 

[kaykay543]

I was surprised at her handling of the dog too, I think that was the trauma-detection dog. I don't know why they didn't switch off the fans before they started.

See I kept wondering that too! Why not just turn all the fans off?

She holds the dog very tightly and almost leads him. At ISP they always said you had to give the dog room to work and to never lead the dog. Let the dog lead you. With this kind of work they usually worked off leash. Like I said it may just be a different way of working a dog. It is just very contrary to what I learned.

 

[Bambina]

I’m sorry for the question, but this case leaves me up at night. Can we assume from the lack of defensive wounds that she slept through her murder? Is it possible to sleep through strangulation? I have this hope for her - that she wasn’t aware of this gruesome final betrayal.