Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen #10

[flipflop]

That's crazy, imo. All one has to do is move away from the window line of fire.

It's pretty clear from this tragedy that school lockdown procedures need review.

JMO

You try moving 28 kindergarten kids away from a window!!!!!

I don't think it is crazy at all.

My door is closed and locked, the window is covered and someone like AL cannot see me in my classroom hurrying my kids to the safety of our closet, so he leaves our room alone and moves on.

If the window was NOT covered, he could see me and the kids and shoot out the window and bang....we are dead.

Just because the open window idea is ok with your prison school, doesn't mean it is ok everywhere else.

 

[MyBelle]

We're talking about an elementary school here though, not a prison classroom. IMO very, very different situations.

Not really. Security is an issue at any educational facility. As is in any school, we have students who really don't like each other.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

You try moving 28 kindergarten kids away from a window!!!!!

I don't think it is crazy at all.

My door is closed and locked, the window is covered and someone like AL cannot see me in my classroom hurrying my kids to the safety of our closet, so he leaves our room alone and moves on.

If the window was NOT covered, he could see me and the kids and shoot out the window and bang....we are dead.

If the window is covered, cops can't see you. A killer will shoot right through a covered window if he thinks he'll hit a target. Lanza came right through the glass doors. Do you think if they were covered with construction paper, it would have stopped him?

JMO

 

[Quester]

This case gives me light shades of the 1976 Chowchilla CA kidnapping.

Though death of hostages was, presumably, not the Chowchilla perps' end goal, they had an evil plan and a way was found to try to accomplish their goal of ransom money which was later thwarted. In their case a buried moving van was used, in this Sandy Hook case guns were used just for total destruction. The easy targets in both were defenseless children.

So ever fortunate for the Chowchilla children and brave and clever bus driver, all survived in that case.

1976 Chowchilla kidnapping - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


I think there is a lot of blame to be spread about in the Sandy Hook case. NL choosing and making available guns to a long disturbed son. All who knew or should have known and allowed this disturbed young man to further isolate himself. His accessibility to violent video games. Excessively violent tv and movies. Still waiting to hear more about the MI aspect of this case and its/their failed responsibility.

My personal feeling is that these horrible tragedies rarely have and rarely will happen. The only thing we, society, can hope to do is to have in place effective preventative measures to slow them down and get armed good guys/gals there as quickly as possible.

My heart aches for the families of those brutally and senselessly taken in this case.

 

[flipflop]

If the window is covered, cops can't see you. A killer will shoot right through a covered window if he thinks he'll hit a target. Lanza came right through the glass doors. Do you think if they were covered with construction paper, it would have stopped him?

JMO

If we remain silent, with lights out, doors locked, windows covered we will not be a visible target. Cops wouldn't see us in the closet anyways.

Our procedures seem fine to me!!!!

 

[Footwarrior]

If the window is covered, cops can't see you. A killer will shoot right through a covered window if he thinks he'll hit a target. Lanza came right through the glass doors. Do you think if they were covered with construction paper, it would have stopped him?

JMO

The small window in most classroom doors is there so that people on opposite sides of the door can see each other. It lessons the possibility of getting hit by a heavy door when someone shoves it open from the other side. Covering the window with paper makes the door less safe.

 

[MyBelle]

If we remain silent, with lights out, doors locked, windows covered we will not be a visible target. Cops wouldn't see us in the closet anyways.

Our procedures seem fine to me!!!!

I doubt your principal or parents would agree that all outside and inside windows should be covered at all times. If your class is in the closet, it doesn't matter whether the window is covered or not but to expect children to spend all day in a windowless environment is ridiculous.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

The small window in most classroom doors is there so that people on opposite sides of the door can see each other. It lessons the possibility of getting hit by a heavy door when someone shoves it open from the other side. Covering the window with paper makes the door less safe.

I totally agree with you.

 

[newlyminted]

Not really. Security is an issue at any educational facility. As is in any school, we have students who really don't like each other.

JMO

Yes, security is an issue at all schools, however, the criminals you deal with are a bigger threat to you than an outside force is to them. The seven year old in a classroom poses almost no threat to anyone. A teacher can deal with two 6 year olds arguing or fighting.. The construction paper serves as a means of giving teachers a few extra seconds to get kids to safe areas if necessary.

My high school had construction paper over the windows of the doors as well. The goal is to give teachers just a few extra moments if something bad is going down. And, in my school, to prevent other students from distracting their friends who are in class by looking through the window..

Yes, a shooter could shoot through the construction paper, but the shooter is more likely to find a room where he can see the targets to do "maximum damage". The construction paper or covering on the window is aimed at thwarting said madman just long enough to get the kids into a safe spot.

 

[Xavier]

I'm sorry but I seriously doubt Cincinatti has armed guards in every elementary school. Columbine was a high school that had security and it had no impact on the slaughter that occurred there.

There is absolutely no logical rationale for putting armed guards in every school building.

JMO

BELLE--- We don't have security guards everywhere in Cincy,OH.....just trying to make a valid point retired LE officers can solve a lo tof problems and they're not that expensive to hire..

We do not have security guards at all of our elementary schools..

 

[flipflop]

I doubt your principal or parents would agree that all outside and inside windows should be covered at all times. If your class is in the closet, it doesn't matter whether the window is covered or not but to expect children to spend all day in a windowless environment is ridiculous.

JMO

Where did you get the ridiculous idea that my classroom is a windowless environment? Who said all my windows are covered at all times?. I keep my door window covered (which is a thin window on the side of the door) We have bulletin boards that slide on a track over our classroom windows, which we close during a lockdown. And yes the door window does matter, no one can then see us hurrying into the closet. This works for me at my school, you do not have to agree with me, you can just move on.

 

[human]

If we remain silent, with lights out, doors locked, windows covered we will not be a visible target. Cops wouldn't see us in the closet anyways.

Our procedures seem fine to me!!!!

I agree. If they can't see into the room, they don't know what is going on in there. The shooter, I mean.

I had to go into my classroom and figure out the trajectory of possible bullets to find a safe spot to be.

I ,too, put paper over my door window. My wooden door would not stop anyone either if s/he wanted to blast his/her way in.

I had to figure out a spot that could not be easily seen through the egress windows as well.

My sub notes described where the key was kept- hanging on a hook next to the door.

I doubt if many daily subs have lock down training.

Then there is that pesky recess and lunch time where students are out in the halls as well as coming in and going home.

 

[fabvab]

Do you think that it would be easier to have a lockdown button in the main office? Something that would automatically lock all classroom doors in the case of emergency? I know a lot of rich people who have little devices that lock their doors just by switching a little button. So it is possible. I'm trying to figure out things that would save valuable seconds. Teachers have so many things to worry about in the case of an emergency that I don't see how you even cope with a drill. I would be beside myself. In the case of a real emergency, I can see a teacher immediately thinking about the children and wanting to shuffle them to safety before even thinking about a door. I still don't think Victoria Soto had enough time to lock her door. It all happened so fast.

Reading above, and teachers personal accounts, most didn't even think what they were hearing were gunshots. One even thought that it was chairs falling over. Peeked her head into the hallway. I couldn't even imagine. There has to be more done to relieve teachers of so much in case of an emergency. Are there any suggestions you have, as a teacher, that you think would help to lessen how much you have to do in case of an emergency?

That sounds like a great idea, but it could be tragic in a school setting. Children are often out in the hallway...going to bathroom...changing classes...going to Speech class/Resource room. If all doors locked at once then you would be locking children out of the rooms.

 

[joypath]

Lanza was in the morgue for about 16 days unclaimed?

That's alot of time

I can imagine the grief, disbelief, shock and alot of anger maybe they were going through and did'nt want to deal with him and could'nt bear to see him ..as sad as that sounds

The post was completed on 12/16, as noted in media information, the family designated, responsible funeral director took possession of the body on 12/27 (inclusive of "holiday" dates). Bodies have remained on site longer while arrangements are completed.
:rocker: As is the policy of the OCME, NO SPECIFICS regarding the identification of the parties involved are released. :rocker:

Confirmation/verification of the responsible parties as presented by the media was done by a "family spokesperson".
http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-adam-lanza-newtown-20121230,0,561090.story

:twocents: :twocents: If I may: the quote applied to H. Wayne Carver, M. D. is an example of the fact that he answers questions as presented in his own style & truthfully! "Connecticut Chief State Medical Examiner H. Wayne Carver, confirmed that Lanza's body is "finally gone"." and as previously noted by me, he is NOT a politician! but what you see.....is what you get! :twocents: :twocents:

:waitasec: Also note that the manner of the phrasing of the article, "The body of Newtown, Conn., shooter (name edit by me!) was claimed by his father last week " makes it appear that PL drove up to Farmington and physically took possession...........NO WAY!

 

[human]

Zero tolerance for what?

People are saying they want to address the warning signs.

What this girl wrote can be a warning sign that needs to be examined.

They removed her from the situation .

What else can they do?

It's too bad if it is innocent, but people are saying mental health issues must be addressed and this girl says she understands why AL did what he did.

I think most of the rest of us do not

 

[Xavier]

The post was completed on 12/16, as noted in media information, the family designated, responsible funeral director took possession of the body on 12/27 (inclusive of "holiday" dates). Bodies have remained on site longer while arrangements are completed.
:rocker: As is the policy of the OCME, NO SPECIFICS regarding the identification of the parties involved are released. :rocker:

Confirmation/verification of the responsible parties as presented by the media was done by a "family spokesperson".
http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-adam-lanza-newtown-20121230,0,561090.story

:twocents: :twocents: If I may: the quote applied to H. Wayne Carver, M. D. is an example of the fact that he answers questions as presented in his own style & truthfully! "Connecticut Chief State Medical Examiner H. Wayne Carver, confirmed that Lanza's body is "finally gone"." and as previously noted by me, he is NOT a politician! but what you see.....is what you get! :twocents: :twocents:

:waitasec: Also note that the manner of the phrasing of the article, "The body of Newtown, Conn., shooter (name edit by me!) was claimed by his father last week " makes it appear that PL drove up to Farmington and physically took possession...........NO WAY!

JOY I'm not sure I understand , expound more on your thought...thanks

 

[human]

That sounds like a great idea, but it could be tragic in a school setting. Children are often out in the hallway...going to bathroom...changing classes...going to Speech class/Resource room. If all doors locked at once then you would be locking children out of the rooms.

The principal may be at a meeting. The secretary is taking care of a vomiting child because the nurse is monitoring an insulin injection.

Lots of things go on everyday at a school.

 

[joypath]

JOY I'm not sure I understand , expound more on your thought...thanks

Just clarifying that AL's remains were undergoing the standard "experience". The statement that they were "unclaimed for 16 days" resonated as if they were abandoned or unidentified or than no plans were generated for them.

The media story emphasized that they were "FINALLY claimed"
and as I read the media story and thought that it might be worthwhile to again clarify that the sanctity of confidentiality remains at the OCME!

In NO WAY do I minimize the anguish that the remaining family experiences over the loss of their loved ones, rather believe that they are struggling!

 

[callyn]

The small window in most classroom doors is there so that people on opposite sides of the door can see each other. It lessons the possibility of getting hit by a heavy door when someone shoves it open from the other side. Covering the window with paper makes the door less safe.

When I was in elementary school (when dinosaurs roamed the earth) we had windows in the doors, but they were high up where the students could not see through them anyway. I don't remember anyone ever being injured by a door. JMO

ETA: I think the chance of getting hit by a door is better than giving a shooter a view of the interior of the classroom. also JMO

 

[Quester]

@ MyBelle - in this particular case, since you have disclosed that you work in a school in a prison, I think it would be very interesting to hear the security measures that you think might be reasonably, frugally and easily applied to public schools to help avert future heartbreaks such as this case.

What security measures are done in your prison school that could be easily adapted to public schools to make them step/s safer? TIA