Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #50

[katydid23]

I visited Vegas for the first time and wandered through casinos. It was striking how close together people sit. That can be dealt with, but I wonder about all the smoking, since it's a respiratory illness. Maybe owners will ban that temporarily?

Most casinos have a non smoking section. I bet they reverse it, and make the tiny /non smoking section into a small smoking section, in the future.

 

[Strangeworld]

I understand both arguments for helping workers and helping organisations and businesses. But not helping organisations can potentially lead to a greater long term need for helping workers who become unemployed. Here in Queensland we have just had Virgin Australia go into administration. This is potentially what can happen if support isn't given in the right places. It might feel unethical to support organisations in times like this, but the very people that we want to be supported (i.e. workers - put food on the table) could end up suffering for much longer and to a much greater extent if businesses fold or make larger numbers of staff redundant. It's just the reality unfortunately. And governments know this, that's why they need to look at the needs of individuals from a wider perspective.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

I don't know what the loan application process was like, but assuming companies had to prove need? Some companies might have a cushion to see them through the crisis and not need the forgivable loans to survive.

I don't know if that is the case, though, that companies had to show need?

jmo

From my experience any small business (500 employees or less) can apply to borrow the money for up to 125% of average payroll for 8 weeks. It’s a very simple 3 page application. You don’t start paying the note for 6 months and it’s at 1%.

If you can prove that you paid all of your employees for at least 8 weeks, the debt is forgiven. The extra 25% cushion can be used to pay rent and utilities.

IMO

 

[Inthedetails]

One of the most effective ways to help people is to help keep their companies up and running, so they have jobs and an income to care for their families.

Giving out cash to individuals is not as effective , in keeping an economy running, compared to giving out business loans, to keep local businesses afloat. JMO

I think we all agree that we want companies to stay afloat and understand that companies employ people. I think the question is whether some companies took forgivable loan money when they didn't need it, leaving companies that did need the forgivable loans without.

jmo

 

[branmuffin]

I visited Vegas for the first time and wandered through casinos. It was striking how close together people sit. That can be dealt with, but I wonder about all the smoking, since it's a respiratory illness. Maybe owners will ban that temporarily?

Any pictures I see online show lots of people packing the sidewalks and the casinos. I would think the restaurants are the same. The slot machines are really close together, too.

 

[anneg]

More info about the PPP program from the U.S. Small Business Administration is at Paycheck Protection Program. Excerpts below:

"Notice: Lapse in Appropriations
The SBA is currently unable to accept new applications for the Paycheck Protection Program based on available appropriations funding.

Other Assistance
Enhanced Debt Relief is also available in SBA’s other business loan programs to help small businesses overcome the challenges created by this health crisis.

For information on traditional SBA lending options, please click here.

SBA provides local assistance via 68 district offices and a nationwide network of resource partners. To find resources near you, please click here. "

Paycheck Protection Program Loan Information
"The Paycheck Protection Program is a loan designed to provide a direct incentive for small businesses to keep their workers on the payroll.

SBA will forgive loans if all employees are kept on the payroll for eight weeks and the money is used for payroll, rent, mortgage interest, or utilities.

You can apply through any existing SBA 7(a) lender or through any federally insured depository institution, federally insured credit union, and Farm Credit System institution that is participating. Other regulated lenders will be available to make these loans once they are approved and enrolled in the program. You should consult with your local lender as to whether it is participating in the program."

... "Who Can Apply The following entities affected by Coronavirus (COVID-19) may be eligible:

• Any small business concern that meets SBA’s size standards (either the industry based sized standard or the alternative size standard)
• Any business, 501(c)(3) non-profit organization, 501(c)(19) veterans organization, or Tribal business concern (sec. 31(b)(2)(C) of the Small Business Act) with the greater of:
  • 500 employees, or
  • That meets the SBA industry size standard if more than 500
• Any business with a NAICS Code that begins with 72 (Accommodations and Food Services) that has more than one physical location and employs less than 500 per location
• Sole proprietors, independent contractors, and self-employed persons"

... "Through April 16, 2020, the SBA has guaranteed 1,661,367 loans under the Paycheck Protection Program. For more information on loan activity, click here."

Hope this is useful. [Note: I have no personal experience with small businesses or these programs.]

 

[margarita25]

Do you have a link for that?

I think you may be addressing @10ofRods re: the testicular effect, but iirc there was an early article that mentioned this, but it was then redacted/changed/debunked? Moo, google will answer this. Of course we know this is a new virus, and as @Curious Me calls it, a “shapeshifter”...we have Covid toes, anything is possible with this virus imo.

One thing I’m getting some relief from is to see the number of people recovering, including people I know and relatives of those in this forum. We’re losing a lot of lives around the world, but a lot people are recovering.

As for me, I’ll probably die if I get it since I smoke so much weed.

Which brings me to where I’m at today with all this, as we ease into lifting restrictions in my area.

The Governor did advise if you are in a high risk group, continue to stay home if you can. Keep doing what you’re doing. That’s what I’m going to do, because for me, the consequences outweigh the risk. In other words, yeah I’m deeeeesperate to go the salon, and other places, but then I ask myself, is a haircut worth it? Now this is me and moo. Each person has to make his/her own decisions as to what is worth taking certain risks for.

For me it’s possibly life or death, as I do not feel confident I could survive this. Now am I afraid to die? NO. But who’s going to take care of those I currently care for that I love. Nor I do want to play any part in potential transmission obviously. Nor do I want to be sick in a hospital. Nobody does.

Anyway rambling. Just sayin I’m trying to really “self check” against my own impatience.

Again, not everybody has the option to work from home.

Which brings me to another random musing:

We know that when we see new cases, there is that window of incubation, up to 14 days, so we are looking back in time as to moment of transmission.

Well, while we are seeing reduced numbers in some areas, I still ask myself, and have been over the last month, of infection occurred only two weeks ago, and if they’re not essential workers, and if their nonessential local businesses are closed and they have been respecting stay at home orders, then how are they being infected if nothing is open and they’re not leaving the house to work? While one possibility could be family members who are it there working, but many self isolate while doing this...my point is where are they getting it then if they’re staying at home? It has to be stores JMO. Grocery stores. Gas stations. Moo. (Additionally, surface transmission, if even a lower percentage of cases, whether it be grocery products not properly wiped down then you touch your face, the mail, etc.). I think grocery stores and gas stations have to be the big ones if that’s the only place people have been going over the last weeks.

 

[Inthedetails]

From my experience any small business (500 employees or less) can apply to borrow the money for up to 125% of average payroll for 8 weeks. It’s a very simple 3 page application. You don’t start paying the note for 6 months and it’s at 1%.

If you can prove that you paid all of your employees for at least 8 weeks, the debt is forgiven. The extra 25% cushion can be used to pay rent and utilities.

IMO

Yes, I understand what the loan money is for and what the forgivable criteria are. I'm wondering if there were criteria for "need." Not all companies need the forgivable loan money, but sounds like some well-positioned companies took the opportunity for the money anyway.

jmo

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Reporting from Southern California.
Small business restaurant.
We have not received ANY help.
Not one cent.
Where is the billions of dollars ?
I want to know Exactly where is the money for small businesses??
We've also not received the $1,200.00 per person.
We've not received a penny.
I am so angry,
I Live in Southern California and pay obscene taxes.
What the hell has California done with all of this money?
What about we small businesses?
Nothing, but talk.
From our leaders who live in guarded mansions.
With no financial help to small, medium businesses.
California is going to see a phenomenal unemployment and reduction of its
Bogus Golden State.
Living in California, is no longer Golden.
Thank You Politicians. MOO

You need to apply for a loan under the sba stimulus program. The government isn’t just going to hand small businesses money.

 

[cass523]

The Navy's floating hospital ship USNS Comfort, brought in to assist with the COVID-19 pandemic, is leaving New York City and returning to Norfolk, Virginia.

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo told President Donald Trump during a visit to the White House that his state no longer needed the ship.

Trump confirmed Tuesday that the ship would be headed back to its base in Virginia in preparation to be sent to another state.

Coronavirus NJ: Navy hospital ship Comfort no longer needed in New York, heading home

 

[Inthedetails]

Any pictures I see online show lots of people packing the sidewalks and the casinos. I would think the restaurants are the same. The slot machines are really close together, too.

I think the mayor totally blew that interview. She could've stated her points in a much better way.

Instead of saying "I'm not a casino owner, it's up to the owners to decide how to set up social distance to be competitive," she could've assured the public that she will work with the casinos and other businesses to make sure safety measures are a top priority.

She came off as uncaring and selfish, just thinking about money for her city, rather than taking the opportunity to show Las Vegas as a compassionate, caring, destination spot that cares about visitors and the city's role in the hospitality and entertainment industry.

Whether I agree with her or not (well, I don't think LV is ready to open), she totally blew it from a PR point of view for her city. Really bad, imo.

jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

The Navy's floating hospital ship USNS Comfort, brought in to assist with the COVID-19 pandemic, is leaving New York City and returning to Norfolk, Virginia.

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo told President Donald Trump during a visit to the White House that his state no longer needed the ship.

Trump confirmed Tuesday that the ship would be headed back to its base in Virginia in preparation to be sent to another state.

Coronavirus NJ: Navy hospital ship Comfort no longer needed in New York, heading home

I'm so thankful that the ship arrived, and I'm even more thankful it wasn't needed.

Bon voyage and thank you!

jmo

 

[Tillicum]

Coronavirus: 1 million jobs lost in Ohio since March 15, Husted says

Ohio has lost about 1 million jobs since March 15, said Lt. Gov. Jon Husted.

Nationally, that number is over 25 million.

As unemployment goes up, Husted said, so does suicide, drug addiction, homelessness, domestic violence and other health issues.

 

[katydid23]

There's no doubt that companies are essential, but the gov't financial support at this point is an emergency support intended to keep people fed and housed.

That's why we have several programs. We have the cash payouts that go to individuals. And we have the low interest business loans.

I would like to see more of the small businesses getting the loans. But when looking at the big picture, we as a nation, need to find the most effective way to rebuild our economy and keep it from collapsing. So these mid size, successful, profitable companies need to be kept afloat to accomplish that quicker.

The smaller businesses with 5 to 10 people---they will not have the same impact on our economy, positive or negative. And if they fail, it will be much easier for a small business to reorganise and come back, then a very large company. JMO

 

[firebird]

You do understand that at least here in California, it will be mandated?
My employees would wear Easter bunny suits if it meant they could get back to earning a living.

Yes. I understand that. I’m not faulting the business owners who are forced to do it. Just not an experience I would enjoy. Fortunately for me, I don’t think it will be mandatory where I am.

 

[DD8]

The problem I have is there were limits such as maximum number of employees, applying for 2 1/2 times of monthly payroll, etc. It appears to me, IMO, their bankers worked with them to sidestep the requirements and they gobbled up huge chunks of money first and then the smaller businesses who had to gather all the documents required tried to submit and they were shut down. A friend who owns a small business that had to shut completely (not essential) applied the first morning of the program and didn't get it - they were told the money was gone already. So something went on IMO

IMO, It looks like that's what happened. I don't understand how because of the limit on employees etc? We were fortunate enough to get approved (and got the funds-many approved did/have not). The money has to be spent within 8 weeks of receiving it. Payroll and necessary utilities/rent only. Has to be documented accordingly. Not sure what will happen after the 2 months...

 

[The Night Watchman]

I'm not really sure what to make of Las Vegas' mayor, Carolyn Goodman's logic regarding opening up Las Vegas. She's basically on board for opening up all the casinos but doesn't seem to take any responsibility if the plan backfires. She was on CNN today, offering up all of Las Vegas' workers saying they'd all be fine with being the placebo group in an experiment to get them back to work. Yikes.

She's talking about how few cases they have because they have taken the proper measures. However, with 40 million visitors a year how can they gamble with their citizen's lives?

Vegas is probably more economically crippled by this than anywhere else. Opening Las Vegas should not be left in business owners hands, obviously.

I go to Vegas many times a year. I canceled my April trip and rescheduled for August, and can cancel again as needed. Casinos are talking about measures to minimize risk-

Dealers wearing masks.
3 instead of 5 or 6 players at table games.
Every other slot tuned off.
Poker games with half seats removed, and less tables.

I'm not hopeful for the Vegas experiment, unless the brutal heat of summer helps. Amazing low humidity there, unfortunate though for suppressing a virus.

Here is a typical poker room. Players at tables close together and breathing on each other. What could go wrong?

 

[branmuffin]

One of the most effective ways to help people is to help keep their companies up and running, so they have jobs and an income to care for their families.

Giving out cash to individuals is not as effective , in keeping an economy running, compared to giving out business loans, to keep local businesses afloat. JMO

Many companies have spent billions on buying back stock rather than investing in increasing employee benefits, R & D, or as a cushion against hard times. Now these same companies are seeking bailouts, like Boeing. And since the price of their stock is tied to compensation of their CEO's and executives, the windfall only reaches a select few.

 

[Inthedetails]

As unemployment goes up, Husted said, so does suicide, drug addiction, homelessness, domestic violence and other health issues.

Snipped

That is so heartbreaking. Really hurts to read that.

jmo

 

[katydid23]

I think we all agree that we want companies to stay afloat and understand that companies employ people. I think the question is whether some companies took forgivable loan money when they didn't need it, leaving companies that did need the forgivable loans without.

jmo

Right. And I was asking the same question, about large restaurant chains. Why do we assume they don't need these loans? I don't know for sure if they do or don't.

But I am assuming that they are not taking in any money at Ruth Chris right now. And I bet they have a lot of inventory going bad and being thrown out. And a lot of employees needing checks and a lot of vendors and suppliers wanting to be paid.

How long can they go on paying employees without having any income?