Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #56

[tresir2012]

Whether he did or didn't, isn't the point. There are millions of children with "underlying health conditions" as yet undiagnosed - because they are children. I am quite certain this child would not have died recently without the CoVid.

At any rate, kids have underlying conditions that are not yet diagnosed and they would be the ones at risk, if it's ever shown that it's mostly kids with underlying conditions.

I don't think we can test every single child for every known illness. We cannot know before the child is ill or dies that they were the one who was going to get the Kawasaki style syndrome. Genetic studies of the suffering children will surely be done when doctors turn to longer term research projects, but in the midst of this pandemic, we're getting epidemiological information that alerts doctors for early signs (and the underlying conditions that do exist don't show any sort of underlying pattern so far).

But to answer your question, in the data available, most of the children with the Kawasaki-style symptoms did not exhibit any known condition, which is why the doctors are reporting and writing about it - in 20 nations now. Since it's rare, the data are in no way conclusive. The 9 newborns who died in China exhibited entirely different symptoms, AFAIK. There also seem to be some outlying cases that are not Kawasaki-style but almost entire involve what are essential heart attacks in children (again, it's the epithelial cell attack that CV makes that seems to be the mechanisms

Usually, the term "underlying health condition" means one that is medically diagnosed before an event, not something that is noticed only after death (which can include "pre-existing" conditions). At any rate, the vast majority of children who are at risk due to strange genes or undiagnosed medical conditions cannot be reasonably found and identified.

Fortunately, as @A Night Watchman pointed out, it's very few children. But the situation is concerning, since these kids are getting this syndrome a month or more after CV diagnosis (or without knowing that they'd had asymptomatic CV). Will it be the only syndrome of its type? Is it related to CV's attack on epithelial cells? (It would seem so). Will adults also be experiencing future attacks on their veins and arteries?

We don't know. And until we know, many parents are going to be very concerned. We know that many places shut their schools early, so CoVid has not yet had a chance to run rampant through a child-population.

Since the few cases of underlying conditions don't form a pattern, parents can't know in advance if their child is vulnerable. The mental stress of this kind of concern can be overwhelming and I think future mental health issues can be sure to follow in the wake of this pandemic.

I don't think he died did he? I may be getting the cases mixed up. I thought he had a condition that they did not know about before he got covid.
Also, if it is not known whether they have a condition unless or until they get CV then what can be done about that? Seems to me that the underlying condition needs to be discovered before they get CV but that doesn't seem to be happening. It is not until the child gets CV (or meningitis or pneumonia or whatever) that they discover the condition. That is the real problem, not CV. They do not appear to have a test for the underlying condition that is to do with the immune system. MOO.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Dr. Seheult is covering what many here have wanted... adding info on Zinc as an ionophore, finally, in studies. It's just a retrospective, but it appears that folks are now catching onto such that we've been posting about for 2 months (zinc needed)..

He also is pointing out that such needs to be given EARLY in the disease or doesn't have effect (e.d. think snake bite venom... only works if done early) .. which really is not good for past and needs to be considered for the future, as we have seen from the beginning that folks couldn't get into the hospital unless they were REALLY downhill and to the point of life saving. HOPEFULLY, that will change. Just like with Tamaflu and antivenom for snake bites, you need to get to the drug FASSSSSSSSSSSSSSST! IYKWIM In other words also, quoting from paper "As such, zinc may have a role in preventing the virus from progressing to severe disease, but once the aberrant production of systemic immune mediators is initiated, known as cytokine storm, the addition of zinc may no longer be effective".

He covers paper and reviews first in vivo evidence that zinc helps with COVID, and how New York changed their protocol to add zinc.

and he also is speaking to Youtube is policing and taking down videos by automated computers e.g. "bots"

Coronavirus Pandemic Update 71: New Data on Adding Zinc to Hydroxychloroquine + Azithromycin

 

[10ofRods]

You need to immediately report these weirdos to the police and your neighbourhood watch and post it on Facebook. (Sounds like it is on Nextdoor but that is not public enough. Take pictures of them and their vehicles, put it on a public Twitter ) Your local police probably has a Twitter page too. They are obviously criminals casing the properties and the occupants.

Yeah, we did. The first police car arrived about 5 minutes after I called the non-emergency line, headed in exactly the direction this dude was walking. Then two more cars arrived 5 minutes after that, one of them circling behind to the railroad tracks, which would be the logical place for this guy to flee if he saw police cars.

I hope they caught him. It's a misdemeanor to go door-to-door in our city, except for licensed charitable causes (of which there are zero right now, as obviously, Girl Scouts are no longer keen on that).

I did not sleep easily, though, as years of working with local police make me wary. What if this guy was part of a larger group? Most likely, he is. What if they're pissed that he got caught? Fortunately, there's little way of such a person remembering exactly who might have called the police. Further, the organizers in these gangs do not want police contact, they're willing to throw their newbies under the bus. Often, the guys sent to case, door to door, don't even know exactly who they're involved with - they suspect, but they are given little information. Guy had a clipboard and was writing something down, and for sure, it was "Which houses had no one answer the door," "Which houses have windows where." I don't think the guy looked capable of doing more than checking off boxes on this form.

I was worried enough that I located my late dad's personal home protection system and kept it near my bed.

 

[10ofRods]

I don't think he died did he? I may be getting the cases mixed up. I thought he had a condition that they did not know about before he got covid.

I'm not keeping track of individual cases. The kid with the heart issue and the CPR did not die (yet). AFAIK, he got out of the hospital after an extended stay. I don't recall nor is there any medical literature on his underlying conditions.

In Italy, France and China, there are published studies on child mortality, which is what sticks in my mind.

I don't think he died did he? I may be getting the cases mixed up. I thought he had a condition that they did not know about before he got covid.
Also, if it is not known whether they have a condition unless or until they get CV then what can be done about that? Seems to me that the underlying condition needs to be discovered before they get CV but that doesn't seem to be happening. It is not until the child gets CV (or meningitis or pneumonia or whatever) that they discover the condition. That is the real problem, not CV. They do not appear to have a test for the underlying condition that is to do with the immune system. MOO.

I addressed this point in my earlier post. It would be impossible to test every child for every underlying condition. While diabetes is an underlying condition in something like 25% of adult deaths, and we can assume that Type I Juvenile Diabetics are at higher risk of a more serious case, there are 1000's of possible "underlying conditions," some of them quite rare and requiring a geneticist to diagnose.

We don't have the resources for that, in the US or planet-wide, IMO.

 

[firebird]

He has a point. We know this is happening in all the numbers right? We need to know the split. Those dying due to CV and those dying with CV.

If you look at the cdc main death numbers and their provisional numbers, you can get a pretty good idea of the split. Last time I posted them, the main death count was about 30k higher than the provisional number verified by an ME.

 

[10ofRods]

Asymptomatic patients still have the Ground Glass Opacities (GGO's) in their lungs

In this study, it was 100% of the asymptomatic CoVid patients who had the ground glass bits in their lungs, distributed toward the back and around the periphery of their lungs. This may cause lifelong health consequences.

For whatever reason, the lesions were predominately on the right side of the lungs, so there's probably some way that the heart/circulation is involved. I do wonder if those things stay put or move around over time.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

The cloths masks that people are encouraged to wear are to protect other people from them. These mask will only work if 80% of people wear them. So encouraging those over 70 only to wear these mask is not going to do any good. What is your objection to masks? You don't want to protect other people?

I think people get a false sense of security with masks - People touch them, don’t wear them properly, wear dirty masks, make-shift masks, etc. I see this in at least half of all mask wearers. IMO

They tell us not to wear masks unless we are sick and now you are supposed to wear a non-medical mask (yep). It’s like being told “ the baby is coming - now go boil some water”. IMO

Masks are not mandated in many places.

 

[dotr]

My favorite meme is Canada's PM "speaking moistly".

 

[Bravo]

Trudeau will never live that one down dotr lol

 

[jjenny]

I think people get a false sense of security with masks - People touch them, don’t wear them properly, wear dirty masks, make-shift masks, etc. I see this in at least half of all mask wearers. IMO

They tell us not to wear masks unless we are sick and now you are supposed to wear a non-medical mask (yep). It’s like being told “ the baby is coming - now go boil some water”. IMO

Masks are not mandated in many places.

Well, I actually purchased some masks so I will be wearing them. I plan to UV sterilize them in the UV box. There are many studies that clearly show masks work (of course you have to wear them properly). So my stimulus money went to good use.

 

[zecats]

Asymptomatic patients still have the Ground Glass Opacities (GGO's) in their lungs

In this study, it was 100% of the asymptomatic CoVid patients who had the ground glass bits in their lungs, distributed toward the back and around the periphery of their lungs. This may cause lifelong health consequences.

For whatever reason, the lesions were predominately on the right side of the lungs, so there's probably some way that the heart/circulation is involved. I do wonder if those things stay put or move around over time.

I'd like to know this too as this is how DH was first diagnosed, even before test results proved positive (2 days later). Those were the exact words from the ER docs - glass-like particles in his lungs. He was prescribed azithromycin. He's recovered completely now, but since you mentioned lifelong health consequences, perhaps he should be able to get another lung scan.

I haven't been on the main thread for a while, but your post caught my attention for personal reasons. Will def follow up with your link. Thanks.

 

[Bravo]

Happy to hear your DH has recovered. Good to see you here. Yes follow up is important IMO

 

[Cool Cats]

• Sorrento finds a coronavirus antibody that blocks viral infection 100% in preclinical lab experiments

Darrell Etherington
TechCrunch May 15, 2020

Therapeutics company Sorrento has made what it believes could be a breakthrough in potential treatment of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that leads to COVID-19. The company released details of its preclinical research on Friday, announcing that it has found an antibody that provides "100% inhibition of SARS-CoV-2 virus infection of healthy cells after four days incubation."

 

[Inthedetails]

Free Covid tracer training is available online. You can watch the course even if you don't intend to work as a tracer, just to learn about the process, if interested.

COVID-19 Contact Tracing | Coursera

 

[musicaljoke]

Were these people fully employed prior the pandemic and now off work? What changed? Can they not handle work-from-home?

Your quote was regarding those of us who can't remember what day of the week it is. I don't think it's necesarily only related to work schedules. It may have something to do with the fact that our activity schedules are axed. So no longer do we have choir on Monday, kids club on Tuesday, guitar on Wednesday, library on Thursday, TGIF, Hockey Night on Saturday, and church on Sunday.

I just planted some trees this morning, but I had to check the calendar to see how many days it was until Sunday, when we'd get some rain.

 

[musicaljoke]

Idk. Why would the death of a person who happened to test positive for Covid, but who actually died from cancer be classified as a Covid death?

Because they likely died of CoVid.

 

[zecats]

Happy to hear your DH has recovered. Good to see you here. Yes follow up is important IMO

Thanks. Nice to see you are present and accounted for. Hope all is well with you.

I will tell him, though honestly and thankfully, he is 100% healthy as if nothing ever happened to him. Took a while to get his strength going, but he is back to work, seeing clients through phone and tele-counseling. Also exercising, mowing the lawn, etc.

 

[mickey2942]

My grandson is a special ed student. The school district has provided us some support, not a lot. Starting this week someone has called in the afternoon to help him with his online homework for an hour, but yesterday she told us that she has been cut back to 30 minutes a day instead. He has received a few speech therapy lessons. The thing that is really lacking is in the area of social skills, but I realize it is impossible to continue with that at this time. His therapist records little messages for him and has him draw pictures about how he is feeling. For some reason the Anaheim district does not allow any video or face chat or even sending pictures. This week they had me pick up a jar of larvae so we can watch them turn into butterflies and set them free. I keep thinking I will forget about them and they will die in their little jar. Usually I am a fierce advocate for him with respect to his IEP, but I think the teachers, aids, therapists, etc have done their best with what they have to work with. I have come to realize that it is really hard to teach special needs kids and requires a ton of patience, which I am working on.

Yep. I know that the kids I taught, it would have been absolutely impossible to get to wear a mask. Forget about Social Distancing.

In regards to the district not doing Facetime or whatever, it is because of the level of privacy laws. They can't provide a secure connection, so they can't do it.

I don't know where special education services will go from here. We may very well go back to pre 94-142 days. If for no other reason, the money just isn't going to be there for the level of services parents have come to expect as almost entitlement benefits.

Sure, they wanted a Cadillac before, and often got a Volkswagen. Well, now, I think that they are going to be lucky to get a skateboard. If that.

I think that a lot of middle management in school districts may have to change jobs. Or retire.

 

[zecats]

Free Covid tracer training is available online. You can watch the course even if you don't intend to work as a tracer, just to learn about the process, if interested.

COVID-19 Contact Tracing | Coursera

Thanks....Sounds interesting. I'm currently partaking in a course from Yale though Coursera. "The Science of Well-Being."

 

[firebird]

Because they likely died of CoVid.

No. That's not the answer. This is:

"If you were in hospice and had already been given a few weeks to live, and then you also were found to have COVID, that would be counted as a COVID death. It means technically even if you died of a clear alternate cause, but you had COVID at the same time, it's still listed as a COVID death. So, everyone who's listed as a COVID death doesn't mean that that was the cause of the death, but they had COVID at the time of the death." Dr. Ezike outlined.

There's a video of the Illinois Dept of Health Director, Dr. Ezike, saying the quote at the link.

IDPH Director explains how Covid deaths are classified