Could Bush Have Done More

[Olivia77]

Sec. 302. (a) Immediately upon his declaration of a major disaster or emergency, the President shall appoint a Federal coordinating officer to operate in the affected area.

(b) In order to effectuate the purposes of this Act, the Federal coordinating officer, within the affected area, shall

(1) make an initial appraisal of the types of relief most urgently needed;
(2) establish such field offices as he deems necessary and as are authorized by the President;
(3) coordinate the administration of relief, including activities of the State and local government, the American National Red Cross, the Salvation Army, the Mennonite Disaster Service, and other relief or disaster assistance organizations, which agree to operate under his advice or direction, except that nothing contained in this Act shall limit or in any way affect the responsibilities of the American National Red Cross under the Act of January 5, 1905, as amended (33 Stat. 599); and
(4) take such other action, consistent with authority delegated to him by the President, and consistent with the provisions of this Act, as he may deem necessary to assist local citizens and public officials in promptly obtaining assistance to which they are entitled.

(c) When the President determines assistance under this Act is necessary, he shall request that the Governor of the affected State designate a State coordinating officer for the purposes of coordinating State and local disaster assistance efforts with those of the Federal Government.

Everyone who thinks the President is free and clear of any responsibility needs to read #3, and then read it again.

Thanks for posting tybee.

 

[TexMex]

And if that is true, and the president could invoke the Insurrection Act, but did not, he is not blameless.

IMO. You may not agree.

http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=108297

The Posse Comitatus Act prevents, by federal law, the president of the United States from sending federal troops into any state without the direct request of the elected governor of that state. A frustrated President Bush could only stand by and watch as the horror unfolded until he received the request for help. Despite the finger-pointing at President Bush, there was little that he could do until he was formally asked for assistance.

As the death toll rose and the animalistic behavior of some of those who chose to remain within the city became public knowledge, it was obvious that authorities needed to regain control. As the scenes from New Orleans, now a national disgrace, were being beamed around the world, a shameless Governor Blanco only cared about her own political image.



There is reason to believe that President Bush, running out of patience with Blanco by Saturday morning, used the only option that remained to him. It is being reported that Bush went around Blanco and utilized the Insurrection Act to federalize the National Guard and send in active military troops to take over the rescue and put down the lawlessness that had taken over New Orleans. The forces that Bush had poised to move into the city, swung into action. It was no accident that the major, organized rescues began when the sun came up on Saturday morning. At 6:30 AM, when the sky over New Orleans was suddenly filled with military helicopters and military convoys poured into the streets, they were there because of President Bush, not Governor Blanco.

 

[Ntegrity]

Truthfully Ntegrity I dont understand your sarcasm.

What sarcasm? I'm asking what the he!! all that means. It sounds like it's either DHS or FEMA that would handle those things under orders from the president ... because I seriously doubt if the president is personally expected to attend to each and every item on that list. If you want to think that's a sarcastic remark, that's your prerogative.

 

[Dara]

http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=108297

The Posse Comitatus Act prevents, by federal law, the president of the United States from sending federal troops into any state without the direct request of the elected governor of that state. A frustrated President Bush could only stand by and watch as the horror unfolded until he received the request for help. Despite the finger-pointing at President Bush, there was little that he could do until he was formally asked for assistance.

As the death toll rose and the animalistic behavior of some of those who chose to remain within the city became public knowledge, it was obvious that authorities needed to regain control. As the scenes from New Orleans, now a national disgrace, were being beamed around the world, a shameless Governor Blanco only cared about her own political image.



There is reason to believe that President Bush, running out of patience with Blanco by Saturday morning, used the only option that remained to him. It is being reported that Bush went around Blanco and utilized the Insurrection Act to federalize the National Guard and send in active military troops to take over the rescue and put down the lawlessness that had taken over New Orleans. The forces that Bush had poised to move into the city, swung into action. It was no accident that the major, organized rescues began when the sun came up on Saturday morning. At 6:30 AM, when the sky over New Orleans was suddenly filled with military helicopters and military convoys poured into the streets, they were there because of President Bush, not Governor Blanco.

So, he was able to use the Insurrection Act. Why did he wait so long? I see that he did wait and he got all frustrated and all, but hell, I was frustrated Wednesday. How on earth could he be so patient? If I knew I could save dying people, I'd run out of patience and do it long before then.

BTW, I used that same piece in the first post in this thread. And I realize the author is speculating.

 

[TexMex]

Never mind the link. I found it. It's that opinion piece by Bob Williams. I looked him up. Interesting ties to convservatives. I believe they give a lot of money to his foundation. It's in another thread.

Mr. Williams is president of the Evergreen Freedom Foundation, a free market public policy research organization in Olympia, Wash.

Link to any money Bush gave to him or his orgnization?
TIA

 

[TexMex]

So, he was able to use the Insurrection Act. Why did he wait so long? I see that he did wait and he got all frustrated and all, but hell, I was frustrated Wednesday. How on earth could he be so patient? If I knew I could save dying people, I'd run out of patience and do it long before then.

The elected Gov of the State asked him for more time.

 

[Dara]

The elected Gov of the State asked him for more time.

We can keep going around on this. People were dying and she wasn't getting the job done. She asked. He didn't have to give her the time. That is, imo, an endorsement of the job she was doing, and if it was so bad, why didn't he invoke the IA then?

 

[Dara]

Mr. Williams is president of the Evergreen Freedom Foundation, a free market public policy research organization in Olympia, Wash.

Link to any money Bush gave to him or his orgnization?
TIA

When I claim Bush gave him money, you can ask me for a link. I linked to support for the other claim.

I'll qualify and say it's according to a watchdog society, so perhaps theyre wrong, but from my research last night, I believe them.

 

[Pepper]

What sarcasm? I'm asking what the he!! all that means. It sounds like it's either DHS or FEMA that would handle those things under orders from the president ... because I seriously doubt if the president is personally expected to attend to each and every item on that list. If you want to think that's a sarcastic remark, that's your prerogative.

Everyone who thinks the President is free and clear of any responsibility needs to read #3, and then read it again.
Thanks for posting tybee.

I think what we are seeing is a myriad of acts, declarations, proclamations and even laws that may contradict each other, and may not all have been tested to their Constitutionality. That's not so unusual in a government as complex as ours.

 

[TexMex]

We can keep going around on this. People were dying and she wasn't getting the job done. She asked. He didn't have to give her the time. That is, imo, an endorsement of the job she was doing, and if it was so bad, why didn't he invoke the IA then?

The elected Gov of the State of LA asked him for more time.
Wouldn't you believe the Gov if she told you she had a plan and needed another 24hrs? He believed her. He obviously didn't think she would be playing politics with lives of citizens of her own state on the line.
Blanco blew it.

 

[Pepper]

The elected Gov of the State of LA asked him for more time.
Wouldn't you believe the Gov if she told you she had a plan and needed another 24hrs? He believed her. He obviously didn't think she would be playing politics with lives of citizens of her own state on the line.
Blanco blew it.

AMEN! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

tybee, that's some great information you posted too. My question is the following. When it talks about the president's authorization to do those things, hasn't he fulfilled that responsibility by freeing up assets and agencies when he declared a state of emergency well ahead of time for the affected states?

I agree. Upon reading the linked info in it's entirety, much has to do with the procedures after the Governor does his/her official requests, and how the Feds will then support the State's efforts. To me, it all comes back to, again, the appropriate requests by the Governor and the State. Until we know what happened/when/by whom at the lower levels, we can't pinpoint what the higher levels (i.e., Feds) did wrong, where the delays were, etc. We'll get there, we're just not there yet. JMHO

 

[Dara]

The elected Gov of the State of LA asked him for more time.
Wouldn't you believe the Gov if she told you she had a plan and needed another 24hrs? He believed her. He obviously didn't think she would be playing politics with lives of citizens of her own state on the line.
Blanco blew it.

She may very well have. But if he couldn't tell, with FEMA there and Homeland Security there and people already dead and shooting in the streets, that leaving her in charge was a mistake, then he is incompetent. And he holds blame for this as well.

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

I think what we are seeing is a myriad of acts, declarations, proclamations and even laws that may contradict each other, and may not all have been tested to their Constitutionality. That's not so unusual in a government as complex as ours.

Exactly. That's why there are lawyers reviewing all this (in the past, and now moving forward.)

 

[TexMex]

She may very well have. But if he couldn't tell, with FEMA there and Homeland Security there and people already dead and shooting in the streets, that leaving her in charge was a mistake, then he is incompetent. And he holds blame for this as well.

Your hatred of Bush is blinding you to who is to 'blame'

The National Guard is under the command of the Governor of each state, not the President. The President can Federalize control over a state’s guard on his own order, but doing so without a Governor’s consent to deal with an in state natural disaster would be a supreme insult to the Governor and the state. In addition, using Federal troops for local police actions is against the law and has been since the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878.

Who did what in response to Katrina. President Bush declared the entire Gulf Coast, including New Orleans and Louisiana, a Federal disaster area days before the hurricane hit, to enable Federal aid to get there sooner.

The disaster that struck New Orleans did not become apparent until the morning of Tuesday, August 29, as the levees broke after the brunt of the storm had passed. But that very day, the Army Corps of Engineers was already working on levee repair. And the Coast Guard was already in the air with helicopters rescuing people from rooftops, ultimately employing 300 choppers. These are both Federal agencies under Bush’s command.

Now what about Governor Kathleen Blanco and New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin? President Bush had to get on the phone two days before the hurricane to plead with the Governor to order a mandatory evacuation. In response, she dithered and delayed. Mayor Nagin also had full authority, and responsibility, to order an evacuation. He dithered and delayed as well.

The city’s own written evacuation plan requires the city to provide transportation for the evacuation of those without access to vehicles or with disabilities. But Nagin did absolutely nothing to carry out this responsibility.

Instead, hundreds of city metro and school buses were ruined in the flood, as Nagin left them in low lying areas. Nagin asked residents who couldn’t get out to go to the Superdome. It was his responsibility to then provide water, food, portable bathrooms, and security for them. But, again, Nagin did nothing to carry out this responsibility in service to the poor blacks who primarily exercised this option.

We now know that even though the Red Cross was ready to bring food and water to the Superdome the day after the storm, Governor Blanco actually barred them from doing so. She didn’t want to encourage the survivors to stay at the Superdome due to such relief, but somehow thought they should disperse back into the flooded city once the hurricane passed.

President Bush pleaded with Governor Blanco that same day after the storm to get the National Guard into New Orleans. Not much happened. Seeing this, he asked her to give him Federal authority over the state’s Guard. She refused.

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

IIRC:

Katrina hit landfall on Monday morning.
By Monday night, the hurricane had passed through NO, and people were partying in the French Quarter. In the streets, dry streets, torn and tattered, but dry. Parties.
When did the levy break? Was it Tuesday morning? (I'm having a hard time remembering now.)

When did the civil unrest begin? I don't remember. Was it on Tuesday, when the flooding started?

If that's the case (and please correct me if I am wrong, as I want the timeline clear in my mind), maybe the early Tuesday morning calls between Nagrin, Blanco, FEMA, et al were knowing that there was chaos and assistance needed, but not as bad as what was to come. Levy breaks and all hell really does break lose.

Is anybody clear on WHEN Blanco asked for the 24-hour delay? Was it Tuesday before the levy broke, Tuesday right after the levy broke, or ?

If it was on Tuesday, then 24 hours would make it Wednesday when she did ask for official fed aid.

Just a thought, but may be incorrect. Please correct if not. Thanks.

 

[KrazyKollector]

Because that's what we expect. We expect the best he could do, and if that wasn't done, it's a problem. He couldn't fix everything but what didn't he do that he could have? If Bush could have federalized the guard and chose not to, or chose not to until Saturday, aren't you concerned?

Do you not care if his policies and procedures and decisions made this worse?

I don't know. Let's disect the '99 Hurrican that got Clinton flamed. The Dems bailed him out saying the same thing we are saying now. And that was a minor disater compared to now.

I am sorry but I truly feel that a few people are just trying to make the President look bad, as if it's a goal in life.

"Democrats lost 9/11 to Bush. They don't want to lose two disasters to him"
That is being said over and over and getting proven to be true, over and over.

His policies and procedures are the same as they were for other disasters and with other Presidents.
Even in civil unrest, I am pretty dang sure that the Gov has to ask for help.

Aren't YOU concerned that LA is being run by a Governor who is unable to handle the task at hand? How many people's death will you put into her hands? Nagin's hands?

 

[tipper]

IIRC:

Katrina hit landfall on Monday morning.
By Monday night, the hurricane had passed through NO, and people were partying in the French Quarter. In the streets, dry streets, torn and tattered, but dry. Parties.
When did the levy break? Was it Tuesday morning? (I'm having a hard time remembering now.)

When did the civil unrest begin? I don't remember. Was it on Tuesday, when the flooding started?

If that's the case (and please correct me if I am wrong, as I want the timeline clear in my mind), maybe the early Tuesday morning calls between Nagrin, Blanco, FEMA, et al were knowing that there was chaos and assistance needed, but not as bad as what was to come. Levy breaks and all hell really does break lose.

Is anybody clear on WHEN Blanco asked for the 24-hour delay? Was it Tuesday before the levy broke, Tuesday right after the levy broke, or ?

If it was on Tuesday, then 24 hours would make it Wednesday when she did ask for official fed aid.

Just a thought, but may be incorrect. Please correct if not. Thanks.

The asked for 24 hour delay I heard about was when Bush flew down there. The mayor, gov and Bush were together (on Air Force One?)and the mayor was saying you two have to get your act together. Bush and the gov went off and came back. Bush said he was ready to move but the gov wanted another 24 hours. What day did Bush visit?

 

[Dara]

IIRC:

Katrina hit landfall on Monday morning.
By Monday night, the hurricane had passed through NO, and people were partying in the French Quarter. In the streets, dry streets, torn and tattered, but dry. Parties.
When did the levy break? Was it Tuesday morning? (I'm having a hard time remembering now.)

When did the civil unrest begin? I don't remember. Was it on Tuesday, when the flooding started?

If that's the case (and please correct me if I am wrong, as I want the timeline clear in my mind), maybe the early Tuesday morning calls between Nagrin, Blanco, FEMA, et al were knowing that there was chaos and assistance needed, but not as bad as what was to come. Levy breaks and all hell really does break lose.

Is anybody clear on WHEN Blanco asked for the 24-hour delay? Was it Tuesday before the levy broke, Tuesday right after the levy broke, or ?

If it was on Tuesday, then 24 hours would make it Wednesday when she did ask for official fed aid.

Just a thought, but may be incorrect. Please correct if not. Thanks.

Timeline is important. The 24 hour request was made, I believe, on Thursday.

But while looking to confirm that, I found something else that will make us all (well, some of us) crazy.

In my first post, I put up a snippet that said Bush couldn't use active-duty troops without invoking the Insurrection Act.

I found this:

WASHINGTON — President Bush, seeking to stem criticism that a slow federal response has contributed to needless misery, said today he is ordering additional active duty forces to the hurricane-battered Gulf Coast.

“The enormity of the task requires more resources,” the president said. “In America we do not abandon our fellow citizens in their hour of need.”

Bush said 4,000 active duty troops are already in the area and 7,000 more will arrive in the next 72 hours from the Army’s 82nd Airborne from Fort Bragg, N.C., 1st Cavalry Division from Fort Hood, Texas, and the Marines’ 1st and 2nd Expeditionary forces from Camp Pendleton, Calif., and Camp Lejeune, N.C.

It's dated September 3. He already had 4000 troops in the area.

 

[tybee204]

Friday, Sept 2