Silver Alert CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 #13 *ARRESTS*

[indicolite22]

Except that we already know MT is an accomplice if only after the fact .

I was referring to the morning, but didn't specify it in my post. We don't know when in the afternoon she became involved.

 

[CTGrammy]

So aiding and abetting isn’t a Crime in CT?

That is not what littlebitty was saying.

She was saying that instead of a lesser charge of an 'accomplice after the fact', in CT, MT can be charged with the actual Murder along with FD.

 

[LittleBitty]

So aiding and abetting isn’t a Crime in CT?

It’s a crime. It’s just CT sees it differently. Like if I rob a bank and you just drove the car. I am charged with robbing and bank and even though all you did is just drive you will also be charged with robbing the bank.

MT is in deep doo doo.

So if she knew FoDu was planning to kill JD before JD was killed and helped with any of the planning before or if she knowingly helped with any of the stuff after the fact she is guilty of murder. If the state charges FoDu with murder.

If the state of CT can prove MT was by our definition an accomplice (either before/after or during) then she will be charged with murder not a lesser offense like aiding and abetting. No lesser included offense. Even if MT was nowhere near JD and FoDu when JD was murdered she will be charged with murder if she knowingly helped in any way.

And I think none of us are buying that she had no idea what was going on during the trashbin odyssey of stupidity. Her defense has got to be that FoDu threatened her and by extension her daughter and she was in fear for her life. Otherwise she will be charged with murder. Her lawyer seems to know how serious all this is. Not sure FoDu’s lawyer does. Jmo.

 

[peace9274]

I agree with your thinking about what/when/where/how to avoid surveillance cameras in certain towns, roads, etc.

I keep trying to think like a murderer and what I would do if my plan went wrong. I do think FD was originally planning to make it look like JD was abducted and murdered at Waveny Park.

He did get her car there and was planning to put her body there, also, but then everything (Plan A) went wrong with the amount of blood in the garage. And how it would also be found in his vehicles and on his properties. He had to come up with an alternate plan (B)

Knowing that his vehicles and properties would be the first places LE checked, I doubt JD was ever placed in or at either.

I think FD hired someone to transport JD’s body in their own vehicle, to a place as far from New Canaan, Farmington, Avon... in fact, away from CT, as far as possible.

I hate to say it, but there are a ton of shady characters, including Mafia, in the contracting business. (There are several known Mafia families through-out CT)

I don’t think it would be too hard for FD to find someone that would take JD’s body and place her somewhere where she’d never be found (ala Jimmy Hoffa?)

I’m still not sure if, according to my theory, FD’s plans included someone helping him before the blood spatter in the garage or if he had to come up with finding someone ASAP afterwards.

I tend to be leaning towards he had help, other than MT, from the beginning, for transporting JD to Waveny. But then there had to be the change of plans and the helper placed JD in his vehicle, as originally planned ... but he just kept going, past Waveny Park, and on into NY or NJ and deposited JD’s body, somewhere never to be found.

MOO

New Haven Mafia - Wikipedia

Archives: The Mob In Connecticut

Adding to my above theory:

I’ve always thought from the beginning, and posted on page 1, that FD came to JD’s Welles Ln house from the woods behind. The poison ivy confirmed my theory!

He then waited out of sight for JD to return from dropping kids off at school. When the garage door opened, he quickly entered and hid behind or crouched next to JD’s other vehicle until the garage door closed and JD got out of her car.

He then attacked her, not expecting her to put up a fight, thus he hit her hard with a something that caused the spatter.

At this point FD called (via burner phone) his accomplice to come get her and take her away, while he stayed and tried to clean up.

I still think that the metal banging, heard at FD’s NC property, early the following morning is involved in the murder of JD.

It could be that the accomplice went to that property and placed JD in a metal drum, until he could finish whatever he was going to do with her.

According to my theory, 1 of 2 things happened:

1. JD was placed in a metal drum and left for dead. However, she wasn’t and “came to” at which time she started banging on the drum trying to get out, but eventually died or when the accomplice returned, he “finished her off.”

Or...

2. JD was in fact dead in the drum. Accomplice mixed cement and poured it into the drum. Early next morning, he banged the lid onto the drum and rolled it onto his vehicle where he then drove it out of CT and into NY or NJ. Never to be found!

MOO

ETA: IMO... MT is involved with:
A. The planning.
B. Helping during the attack.
C. Helping afterwards.
D. All of the above.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

It’s a crime. It’s just CT sees it differently. Like if I rob a bank and you just drove the car. I am charged with robbing and bank and even though all you did is just drive you will also be charged with robbing the bank.

MT is in deep doo doo.

So if she knew FoDu was planning to kill JD before JD was killed and helped with any of the planning before or if she knowingly helped with any of the stuff after the fact she is guilty of murder. If the state charges FoDu with murder.

If the state of CT can prove MT was by our definition an accomplice (either before/after or during) then she will be charged with murder not a lesser offense like aiding and abetting. No lesser included offense. Even if MT was nowhere near JD and FoDu when JD was murdered she will be charged with murder if she knowingly helped in any way.

And I think none of us are buying that she had no idea what was going on during the trashbin odyssey of stupidity. Her defense has got to be that FoDu threatened her and by extension her daughter and she was in fear for her life. Otherwise she will be charged with murder. Her lawyer seems to know how serious all this is. Not sure FoDu’s lawyer does. Jmo.

Oh, I’m sure FD lawyer knows this is SO SERIOUS. Can a mod help here so I’m not discussing not the alleged perp or Vic? Bc I’d like to share his lawyer’s comment early on.

 

[CTGrammy]

I find it very strange that he did this - there has to be a better less conspicuous place to discard them.

You and I would think that way.

However, as noted in my previous posts, I believe that FD was trying to cover his tracks by Also framing EE (ex-employee).

There is no other reason to keep and take the evidence to Albany Avenue at 7:10 pm and complete the 'Trash Bin Odyssey of Stupidity' when the attack happened earlier that morning.

That is about 10 1/2 hours. WHY????

What other reason could FD have to hold onto Evidence for that long?

I think the parking of JD's car at Waveny was to make LE Initially think that JD was abducted, so that FD had the time to complete the EE Setup.

 

[peace9274]

Unless I've missed it, we also haven't talked about the incongruity of FD seeming to suddenly stalk the NC area once he was released from lockup... when he was conveniently, supposedly, nowhere near there the day that JD disappeared. I wish I could be more specific, as @LittleBitty is with timelines, but it's all on WS in members' awesomely posted MSM posted clips:

• Almost immediately after he was released, he had an urgent need to go to the Sturbridge (NC) property to "dust up"
• Soon after, he's sighted at Sturbridge (apparently doing some more dusting up with his niece), and then seen walking and eating sushi with his niece in downtown NC
• Then last week, he's back at Sturbridge with his bro from Mass ... more dusting up, presumably?
• And on Saturday, a WS member noted (acknowledging that there's no MSM report to cite) that in the Norwalk Home Depot, an employee mentioned that FD had been there that day. Odd in that there's a HD in Bristol, which is four miles away from Farmington, and guaranteed no more of a hassle to shop at than the 6-or-so miles away craziness of Connecticut Avenue (Rt. 1) where that HD in Norwalk is situated.

I would love to know how much time FD was previously spending in NC. Would neighbors/shopkeepers, etc. recognize him? Would have been nice if, in that news video with the Massachusetts license plates, the reporter (who, regardless, did a great job in capturing an unscripted moment) had asked the neighbor who agreed to be interviewed, "Have you ever seen FD here before? Is it unusual for him to be on-site?"

EBM to include "the neighbor who agreed to be interviewed"

Where was it reported that FD was seen by an employee in the Norwalk Home Depot? Did the HD employee tell this to a WS member, and she/he posted it here on Saturday?

I missed any comments that posted re this. I’m confused again!

TIA

 

[Curious in CT]

Where was it reported that FD was seen by an employee in the Norwalk Home Depot? Did the HD employee tell this to a WS member, and she/he posted it here on Saturday?
I missed any comments that posted re this.

TIA

Silver Alert - CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 #13 *ARRESTS*
Edited to include by @Chessman and also to include that I referenced that there was no MSM article to cite.
Also EBM to tag @peace9274

 

[Midwestmom2019]

Adding to my above theory:

I’ve always thought from the beginning, and posted on page 1, that FD came to JD’s Welles Ln house from the woods behind. The poison ivy confirmed my theory!

He then waited out of sight for JD to return from dropping kids off at school. When the garage door opened, he quickly entered and hid behind or crouched next to JD’s other vehicle until the garage door closed and JD got out of her car.

He then attacked her, not expecting her to put up a fight, thus he hit her hard with a something that caused the spatter.

At this point FD called (via burner phone) his accomplice to come get her and take her away, while he stayed and tried to clean up.

I still think that the metal banging, heard at FD’s NC property, early the following morning is involved in the murder of JD.

It could be that the accomplice went to that property and placed JD in a metal drum, until he could finish whatever he was going to do with her.

According to my theory, 1 of 2 things happened:

1. JD was placed in a metal drum and left for dead. However, she wasn’t and “came to” at which time she started banging on the drum trying to get out, but eventually died or the when the accomplice returned, he “finished her off.”

Or...

2. JD was in fact dead in the drum. Accomplice mixed cement and poured it into the drum. Early next morning, he banged the lid onto the drum and rolled it onto his vehicle where he then drove it out of CT and into NY or CT. Never to be found!

MOO

IMHO a drum would be way too small for her to maneuver around and bang on it. She’d be squished in there so tight that she couldn’t move.
BUT, I can agree she might have been alive. Accomplice finished her off. Stuffed her into a drum WHICH HAD TO HAVE BEEN ON HIS VEHICLE bc it would have been too heavy to lift onto anything. Rolling it off at the destination would have been easier.
I think she’s at the bottom of the ocean somewhere.
Rolled off truck. Rolled onto a barge. Some longshoreman owed a favor.
Out to sea.
I do not think she will ever be located. Unfortunately.

 

[LittleBitty]

Oh, I’m sure FD lawyer knows this is SO SERIOUS. Can a mod help here so I’m not discussing not the alleged perp or Vic? Bc I’d like to share his lawyer’s comment early on.

You can share anything that Norm Pattis has said about the case in MSM. We just can’t call him derogatory names as per TOS. Early on NP first said that if FoDu was indeed on Albany Avenue then it was serious. Then NP said if FoDu was on Albany it was a coincidence. Then he said MT had an alibi for the morning of the 24th and she was nowhere near NC and MT also took a polygraph and passed. Then NP said he could account for almost all the time for FoDu on the morning of the 24th. Then NP said there simply wasn’t enough time to kill JD, dump her car, clean the crime scene and dispose of the body. Then NP suggested JD had faked her on disappearance like Gone Girl and had health issues and was really depressed and stuff. Then he said MT was with FoDu most of the day and confirm his alibi. Then NP said MT really loves FoDu and believes in his innocence and wept about it. Then NP and FoDu filed a motion for bond clarification asking to be able to contact MT. MT and Her lawyer went to court and were granted a no contact order from the Judge.

I happen to believe that NP, skilled though he may be, has been grand standing too much in MSM and hasn’t helped his client at all. The interview that FoDu gave was terrible. The Gone Girl theory ticked off the author of the book and several domestic violence groups.

I think that Norm understands this is serious but imo i think that MT’s attorney by staying quiet has adopted a bettter approach. NP wants to try this case in the media...and as such with all the statements he has made he has hurt his client (not that I care at all about FoDu) but the assumption I make is that he is more interested in MSM attention and as such I don’t see him as taking the case as seriously as he should. JMO.

I have a legal degree (J.D.) and don’t practice law now but I did work for a defense attorney at one point and he told me best strategy in defending a client against charges: Keep your client away from the press. As an attorney say very little to the press—mainly, “we are waiting for our day in court” and avoid talking to the police if you possibly can (always have a lawyer present if a meeting does take place). NP is doing th opposite—high profile case/high profile attorney = circus atmosphere. And they have done studies to show that this really doesn’t influence a potential jury pool all that much. NP should just stay quiet imo. But he won’t. Which is fine. So we can tear apart what he says.

 

[BluesClues0]

I think some of it is probably true, but there are some aspects that don't seem possible.

Adding to my above theory:

He then attacked her, not expecting her to put up a fight, thus he hit her hard with a something that caused the spatter.

At this point FD called (via burner phone) his accomplice to come get her and take her away, while he stayed and tried to clean up.

LE should have some video or evidence of someone coming to pick up FD. I wish we had some corroboration of this.

I still think that the metal banging, heard at FD’s NC property, early the following morning is involved in the murder of JD.

It could be that the accomplice went to that property and placed JD in a metal drum, until he could finish whatever he was going to do with her.

According to my theory, 1 of 2 things happened:

1. JD was placed in a metal drum and left for dead. However, she wasn’t and “came to” at which time she started banging on the drum trying to get out, but eventually died or when the accomplice returned, he “finished her off.”

Or...

2. JD was in fact dead in the drum. Accomplice mixed cement and poured it into the drum. Early next morning, he banged the lid onto the drum and rolled it onto his vehicle where he then drove it out of CT and into NY or NJ. Never to be found!

A drum filled with concrete would be WAY to heavy to lift.

 

[1&2&3]

This is going backwards, but when JD decided to divorce FD, did she move out before she had him served with divorce papers?

In my experience and knowledge, the judge will make the man move out of the home. The wife is allowed to stay in the home with the children. It is much easier for the man to move himself out than to disrupt the children. Also, the man gets the house payment.

Are the rules different in CT?

 

[peace9274]

I think some of it is probably true, but there are some aspects that don't seem possible.



LE should have some video or evidence of someone coming to pick up FD. I wish we had some corroboration of this.


A drum filled with concrete would be WAY to heavy to lift.

@BluesClues0 You said: “LE should have some video or evidence of someone coming to pick up FD. I wish we had some corroboration of this.”

Part of my theory is that FD leaves the same way he came to JD’s house. Back through the woods behind her house and to his car hidden or on an isolated road nearby.

Re the drum being too heavy to lift, maybe he used a dolly (hand truck) and wheeled her up a ramp into his van, truck or a small u-haul enclosed type moving truck? Or maybe he placed acid/lye/chemicals in and added the cement later, after he got the drum onto the truck/van/etc?

MOO

 

[LittleBitty]

Oooh I found the quote from NP that I was looking for:

“Suppose we could not account for him from 9 to 1:30,” said Pattis. “Can you get from Farmington to New Canaan and back and kill somebody and clean up an extensive mess in a garage that included a lot of blood splattered on a couple cars, dispose of a body, dispose of a car… can all that really be accomplished in broad daylight in four and a half hours without a witness?”
Fotis Dulos’s attorney Norm Pattis builds defense for client

Did NP accidentally give us the sequence of events?

He said kill, clean up , DISPOSE of the BODY, then DISPOSE of the car...?

That’s interesting. Was it a slip or nothing? But I had always thought JD’s body was with the trash bags and clean up in the EE’s truck and he drove back with all of it to Farmington and disposed of her there.

This quote reads like her body was disposed of before her car was abandoned at Waveny Park. Hmmmmmm....so she is close to NC, if this was a slip up. Not dismembered and thrown away on Albany Avenue in Hartford and wound up in MIRA.

Do y’all see what I see? Or am I just getting excited again because it is a slow news day? Or both? Can it be both? I was always told NP chooses what and how to say stuff very carefully and he is a brilliant strategist and opponent. Did he slip up here?

<modsnipped off topic>

 

[oviedo]

This is going backwards, but when JD decided to divorce FD, did she move out before she had him served with divorce papers?

In my experience and knowledge, the judge will make the man move out of the home. The wife is allowed to stay in the home with the children. It is much easier for the man to move himself out than to disrupt the children. Also, the man gets the house payment.

Are the rules different in CT?

She packed up the children and left for a "visit" to her deceased father's grave. The next day she filed for divorce. It's all in the media thread.

ETA: Sources: Police found blood in New Canaan home of Jennifer Dulos as search for missing mother intensifies

FD actually called 911 to say she and the children were not responding to him. Her divorce documents (some excerpts have been published in MSM) said that her filing for divorce would enrage him. That has always stuck with me. This is a man who was angry for 2 years IMO. I think it is also possible he used a gun - we know he brought the gun to LE June 17, 2017 (from the same article).

 

[cottow]

Unless I've missed it, we also haven't talked about the incongruity of FD seeming to suddenly stalk the NC area once he was released from lockup... when he was conveniently, supposedly, nowhere near there the day that JD disappeared. I wish I could be more specific, as @LittleBitty is with timelines, but it's all on WS in members' awesomely posted MSM posted clips:

• Almost immediately after he was released, he had an urgent need to go to the Sturbridge (NC) property to "dust up"
• Soon after, he's sighted at Sturbridge (apparently doing some more dusting up with his niece), and then seen walking and eating sushi with his niece in downtown NC
• Then last week, he's back at Sturbridge with his bro from Mass ... more dusting up, presumably?
• And on Saturday, a WS member noted (acknowledging that there's no MSM report to cite) that in the Norwalk Home Depot, an employee mentioned that FD had been there that day. Odd in that there's a HD in Bristol, which is four miles away from Farmington, and guaranteed no more of a hassle to shop at than the 6-or-so miles away craziness of Connecticut Avenue (Rt. 1) where that HD in Norwalk is situated.

I would love to know how much time FD was previously spending in NC. Would neighbors/shopkeepers, etc. recognize him? Would have been nice if, in that news video with the Massachusetts license plates, the reporter (who, regardless, did a great job in capturing an unscripted moment) had asked the neighbor who agreed to be interviewed, "Have you ever seen FD here before? Is it unusual for him to be on-site?"

EBM to include "the neighbor who agreed to be interviewed"

a possible reason he is spending so much time at NC property is that its his only chance for some money. its his best chance to get quick money that he now needs. you could be on to something else but just throwing this out there.

 

[soccy]

On a lark, I thought I would look up the meaning of Dulos in Turkey. Dulos is not in the dictionary but "dul" is and it means being left a widow or widower.
dulos - translation into English - dict.com dictionary

 

[Curious in CT]

This is going backwards, but when JD decided to divorce FD, did she move out before she had him served with divorce papers?

In my experience and knowledge, the judge will make the man move out of the home. The wife is allowed to stay in the home with the children. It is much easier for the man to move himself out than to disrupt the children. Also, the man gets the house payment.

Are the rule different in CT?

It sounds like she did move out before or at the time of serving him with the divorce papers in June:

Jennifer Dulos: Inside the Turbulent Marriage of the Missing Connecticut Mother of 5

Jennifer Farber Dulos Missing: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com
"The newspaper reports that the couple lived in Farmington until June 2017, when Jennifer Dulos abruptly left the home and rented a house in New Canaan."

Reading the court documents and reporting, she fled in terror of how divorcing FD would "enrage" him, and she feared for her safety. In that kind of a situation, you can't easily leave it to the courts to ensure the other party will abide by the rules.

I left a bad situation (and home) many years ago, and while it sucked, it was far better than worrying that the ex might just show up at the doorstep of the home that, legally, he and I jointly owned. In that circumstance, it took nearly a year to get him to sign paperwork to put the place on the market (only a month or so to sell).
I'm not sure if it's the case in other states, but in Connecticut, if you move out, it's considered abandonment if you don't pay your portion of the mortgage until everything is resolved. (Before I met my husband, who is a lawyer, he went through this "due diligence.") So if you don't have a divorce decree in place, and are also fearful of being anywhere around a soon-to-be-ex (someone came up with an entertaining acronym for that early on), you are in a hard, hard place.

 

[soccy]

Where was it reported that FD was seen by an employee in the Norwalk Home Depot? Did the HD employee tell this to a WS member, and she/he posted it here on Saturday?

I missed any comments that posted re this. I’m confused again!

TIA

Mr. Clean himself!

 

[cottow]

Oooh I found the quote from NP that I was looking for:

“Suppose we could not account for him from 9 to 1:30,” said Pattis. “Can you get from Farmington to New Canaan and back and kill somebody and clean up an extensive mess in a garage that included a lot of blood splattered on a couple cars, dispose of a body, dispose of a car… can all that really be accomplished in broad daylight in four and a half hours without a witness?”
Fotis Dulos’s attorney Norm Pattis builds defense for client

Did NP accidentally give us the sequence of events?

He said kill, clean up , DISPOSE of the BODY, then DISPOSE of the car...?

That’s interesting. Was it a slip or nothing? But I had always thought JD’s body was with the trash bags and clean up in the EE’s truck and he drove back with all of it to Farmington and disposed of her there.

This quote reads like her body was disposed of before her car was abandoned at Waveny Park. Hmmmmmm....so she is close to NC, if this was a slip up. Not dismembered and thrown away on Albany Avenue in Hartford and wound up in MIRA.

Do y’all see what I see? Or am I just getting excited again because it is a slow news day? Or both? Can it be both? I was always told NP chooses what and how to say stuff very carefully and he is a brilliant strategist and opponent. Did he slip up here?

<modsnipped>

regarding the 4.5 hrs. he isnt driving at 9am...9am the killing would have happened. so he has 4.5 hours to clean up, dispose of body, drop car off at wav park, drop of garage bags at jefferson crossing and be back home at 1:30. VERY DOABLE.