Deceased/Not Found CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 *ARRESTS* #42

[kpm]

Patients who have succumbed to carbon monoxide (CO) poisoning, a common cause of toxicological mortality, are usually rejected as organ donors.

To fulfill the increasing demand, selection criteria must be expanded to include CO-poisoned donors.

However, the use of allografts exposed to high CO concentrations is still under debate.


Can carbon monoxide-poisoned victims be organ donors?

 

[MassGuy]

Yes! I mean not the public trial. I mean the REAL trial that occurs in the court where Prosecutor presents his findings. IF the “allegations” were TRUE then we need proof BEYOND REASONABLE DOUBT that he killed Jennifer dulos. I mean why wouldn’t they want to try it? The various factors of case were abetment of suicide so it must be tried to PROVE it!

Why they wouldn’t want to try it:

Because you can’t punish a dead guy.

Lack of legal precedent.

The incredible cost to the taxpayer.

The pain and suffering inflicted on the victim’s family.

The fact that it would be a charade, and serve absolutely no purpose.

Other than those things, I think it’s a lovely idea.

 

[MsBetsy]

Wait you all said he was guilty, state said he’s guilty so now you want to give up on the case simply because he’s dead? Like your goal was NOT to find out if he killed jennifer dulos but it was that somehow he must die so we don’t have to try the case? If that wasn’t the case then this case MUST be tried because everyone I knew on this forum and in the world believed he had killed her. So now! PROVE IT!

Can you explain how the evidence points to anyone other than FD?

You keep saying it's unfair that the public thought he was guilty but you haven't offered any alternative theories or explained
why you think he is innocent.

 

[Herat]

Umm...The side by side photos of MT are really telling. JMO

Glad that the Anna Curry story, with lots of pretty photos of her and her very wealthy friends got exposed.

I hope MT gets to res

This evening -- really, throughout the coming weekend, as information is shared with the five Dulos children (can't even wrap one's mind around such difficult conversations) -- may we be keeping them in our thoughts and prayers. After 8+ months of sheer evil, and such trauma inflicted upon them and their young lives, they will definitely be needing prayers for comfort and for great healing of soul... All such prayers are offered on their behalf by the *many* who have followed this tragic case, and who feel the greatest of compassion for these five young people and their futures.

May unimaginable good bless their lives in the days and years to come, despite the unthinkable evil that has occurred in the past year. May each one of them find creative ways to express their profound sadness and loss, and may each one have several trustworthy and wise adults in his/her life who will be an inspiration and a light shining hopefulness along their life pathways...

May GF, their beloved grandmother, be granted continuing wisdom, understanding, and great comfort, as she herself is still grieving the untimely passing of her own dear daughter/Jennifer.

I mentally want to whisk them all away to a lovely safe place where they are all together, far far away from pyring eyes of the media, far far away from troubles. In a place where children can grieve, and sisters and grandma's can relax and feel renewed by their wise choices and moves.

 

[gitana1]

Wait you all said he was guilty, state said he’s guilty so now you want to give up on the case simply because he’s dead? Like your goal was NOT to find out if he killed jennifer dulos but it was that somehow he must die so we don’t have to try the case? If that wasn’t the case then this case MUST be tried because everyone I knew on this forum and in the world believed he had killed her. So now! PROVE IT!

Oh most of us knew he killed Jennifer. We didn’t need a trial to convince ourselves of that. However, most of us are interested in justice and the court process and are vested in seeing the state prove their case and the defendant respond with a defense or a guilty plea.

But FD made the decision that the isn’t going to happen. States don’t try corpses. There has to be an actual live human to prosecute.

Finally, we don’t need to prove a thing. FD proved it for us. Innocent people don’t kill themselves before trial. But even without that the evidence in the affidavit was incredibly damning.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

Wait you all said he was guilty, state said he’s guilty so now you want to give up on the case simply because he’s dead? Like your goal was NOT to find out if he killed jennifer dulos but it was that somehow he must die so we don’t have to try the case? If that wasn’t the case then this case MUST be tried because everyone I knew on this forum and in the world believed he had killed her. So now! PROVE IT!

I have a lot of questions regarding this case. For instance, why would an innocent man be discarding items with JD’s blood on them all over Hartford just hours after she “disappeared”?

 

[gitana1]

Can you explain how the evidence points to anyone other than FD?

You keep saying it's unfair that the public thought he was guilty but you haven't offered any alternative theories or explained
why you think he is innocent.

I know the question was directed to me but if you don’t mind me throwing something out there? I think some people believe that discussion groups like these are wrong because they feel no one can ethically form an opinion prior to trial regardless as to whether we are potential jurors for the case, or not.

We’ve seen that before. Often they are people who may work for defense counsel or sometimes people who have been accused of something they feel they haven’t done, or maybe their kids have been accused.

Who knows. But my sense is that it’s not necessarily that they firmly believe a defendant is innocent.

 

[Seattle1]

@clearskies1 said: ↑
My opinion:

1) yes -- state of Connecticut won't waste money on a trial re FD.
2) yes -- after the fact death of an alleged co-conspirator is not relevant to the charges against the remaining defendants. Current charges against co-defendants can proceed.

Yes, tried to find what was posted on this yesterday but this is close:

https://www.cga.ct.gov/2010/rpt/2010-R-0240.htm

Attempt or conspiracy is a crime “of the same grade and degree as the most serious offense which is attempted or is an object of the conspiracy, except that an attempt or conspiracy to commit a class A felony is a class B felony” (CGC § 53a-51). If someone is convicted of attempt or conspiracy to commit a crime that carries a mandatory minimum sentence other than a class A felony, the offender would be subject to that mandatory minimum sentence (see State v. Moran, 264 Conn. 593 (2003)).

Someone is an accomplice or criminally liable for the acts of another if he or she acts with the mental state required to commit a crime and solicits, requests, commands, or intentionally aids another to engage in criminal conduct. These offenders can be punished as if they were the principal offenders (CGS § 53a-8). It also appears that someone who is an accomplice to a crime that is punishable by a mandatory minimum sentence would be subject to that mandatory minimum.

Glad to know this. The other 2 should still be held accountable and hopefully a plea deal now that they no longer have to fear him or his threats. JMO

Still pondering the fate of MT:

Generally, you can't have a conspiracy without the underlying crime.

What saith CT law?

If no conviction for murder, then there's nothing MT could have conspired to?

Unless we learn otherwise -- I think the only charge that will hold against MT will be tampering with evidence.

MOO

ETA: We know in Colorado at least that tampering with evidence only gets you up to 18 months-- 3 years max if aggravators exist.

I don't think the CT citation above (defines conspiracy) meets the actual facts of this situation-- it does not speak to no underlying crime (after the death and/or no conviction of the defendant).

Generally, you can't have a conspiracy without the underlying crime. Hopefully, the legal answers will appear Friday in new filings by MT attorney AB.

MOO

ETA: Acknowledging that JD was still murdered but State no longer pursuing the murderer.

 

[MsBetsy]

Um I don’t think he can. Remember there is a gag order to ensure defense can’t say anything. A very strategic move.

There is no reason for the defense to say anything. In fact this is the only case I've followed where the defense lawyer has made more then one or two general statements before the trial. Why is it necessary for him to talk to the media at all?

 

[ViolaAnn]

I think this is NP spin. When that coward who murdered Laura Wallen hung himself in jail, the State released all of their evidence.

Laura was my daughter's cheer coach and why I joined WS. Very sad. She was such a sweet person.

I liked what the State did in that case and was thinking that maybe CT could do the same in this case. It appears CT has plenty of evidence against him. Both these men were cowards IMO.

ETA: What MD did in the Wallen case may not work in this case since there are co-conspirators here. In MD, there was not a trial; the prosecutors just showed all their evidence in a press conference.

 

[BeckyF]

Are you sure he wasn’t convicted? Everyone said he killed her!

He wasn't convicted in a court of law.

 

[gitana1]

He a

What are you even saying ?

What’s interesting is regardless as to FD’s status, the case isn’t over. There are two co-defendants.

 

[MemPat]

Place your bets here Pattis announces after the autopsy that FD had CTE like Aaron Hernandez.

 

[rjay]

Patients who have succumbed to carbon monoxide (CO) poisoning, a common cause of toxicological mortality, are usually rejected as organ donors.

To fulfill the increasing demand, selection criteria must be expanded to include CO-poisoned donors.

However, the use of allografts exposed to high CO concentrations is still under debate.


Can carbon monoxide-poisoned victims be organ donors?

Thank you.

This is what I suspected. He died because he poisoned his organs. What doctor would transplant a poisoned organ not knowing how much damage was done?

 

[gitana1]

One juror could hang the jury, but he was never going free.

Ironically, it was the other two that I was most worried about. I was never concerned about FD getting what he deserved, but didn’t feel the same way in regards to MT and KM.

MT is now public enemy number one. Hopefully KM buries her in exchange for a significant but lesser sentence.

So is there an update as to FD? Is he dead?

 

[Chloe_ee]

I agree. And so does Jennifer’s mom based on her smile yesterday.

Absolutely..what he would have done to those 5 kids until he died of old age..shudder, the manipulation, the lying, them feeling guilt, FD lying saying your mom left you...I am satisfied with his demise...it spared those kids a lifetime of further abuse.

 

[gitana1]

This just takes the cake, he is blaming everyone but the killer

Pattis released a statement after his death saying, “Mr. Dulos was tried and convicted in the court of public opinion.

Now he has been executed.

We remain committed to demonstrating he did not murder Jennifer.”


Attorney: Fotis Dulos declared dead after suicide attempt

Ah. Never mind. So he’s been declared dead.

I’m relieved for so many people threatened by that murderer.

 

[acutename]

Doesn't matter if it happened in the past when FD told him (from my understanding).

not familiar with CT law.... could be a continuing situation, but seems complex IMO.

 

[MassGuy]

So is there an update as to FD? Is he dead?

For the second and final time.

 

[sds71]

Shortly before announcing Dulos’ death outside Jacobi Medical Center in New York Thursday, Norm Pattis filed an extraordinary motion seeking to substitute the estate of Dulos as the defendant in the case in what he said is an effort to clear his name. If Pattis were to succeed it would be a trial not only without the body of the victim but also without a living defendant.

In his motion, Pattis referred to Joan of Arc and an outlaw named Henry Plummer as examples of people in history who were tried posthumously and acquitted. However, neither is a Connecticut resident and what Pattis wants to attempt — by all accounts — has never occurred before in this state.
My gut would tell me the only remedy is dismissal,” said David Shepack, retired Litchfield State’s Attorney. “The person is deceased. You [the court] don’t have jurisdiction over the person.”

New Haven attorney William F. Dow was no less surprised by the move.

“Norm is an extremely creative attorney, without argument, but not all of his creations are substantial and worth pursuing,” Dow said. “It opens the door to much uncharted territory with very slender precedent, with due respect to Joan of Arc."

With Dulos dead, the next likely step in the case will be for Stamford prosecutor Richard Colangelo, who was named chief state’s attorney on Thursday, to file a motion to dismiss the murder charges against Dulos.

The prosecutions against his former girlfriend Michelle Troconis and attorney Kent Mawhinney, who both have been charged with conspiracy to commit murder, would continue. It is unclear how Dulos’ death will affect those cases.

But Pattis said rather than see the case against Dulos dismissed, he’d prefer to take it to trial and prove his dead clients’ innocence.


Fotis Dulos has died, but his lawyer wants to proceed with his murder trial anyway. Is that possible?