Dead Folks and Decomp *WARNING: GRAPHIC PHOTOS IN OPENING POST*#2

[kaRN]

Good links, thanks.
It seems a bit odd that the odor of the white trash bag was different than the odor of the trunk. If the odor from the alleged human decomp permeated the entire trunk, why did it not also permeate the white trash bag and its contents?

Because plastic isn't permeable. Thats why trash bags are made of it. Carpet is.

 

[notthatsmart]

The trash bag with its contents contained permeable material. Especially the pizza box. Trash bags do indeed smell even if they are for only recycle. I change mine weekly because of the smell. That pizza box should have been smellin to high heaven of decomp. And that trash bag with contents should have smelled just like the trunk. Ym started to give the long format answer until he was interrupted and gave the short answer, that they did not smell the same. Just another thing that does not make sense to me. IMO

 

[Horace Finklestein]

The trash bag with its contents contained permeable material. Especially the pizza box. Trash bags do indeed smell even if they are for only recycle. I change mine weekly because of the smell. That pizza box should have been smellin to high heaven of decomp. And that trash bag with contents should have smelled just like the trunk. Ym started to give the long format answer until he was interrupted and gave the short answer, that they did not smell the same. Just another thing that does not make sense to me. IMO

Well that's simply incorrect. Pizza just dries up it doesn't decompose. I really can't understand why anyone would state that it does. WFTV did that exact experiment - they put a large 'meat lovers' pizza in a trunk for 20 days and when they opened it, it smelled like pizza. Pizza does NOT ever smell like decomp. No pizza was found anyway. Cindy and George were lying.

 

[Star12]

Pot, Marijuana - what ever you want to call it. Grown in BC - called BC Bud. At least three times stronger than what was around in the late 60's and 70's. Unfortunately has gotten to be big business in BC - the RCMP is constantly busting what are called "grow-ops", where hundreds or thousands of plants are grown in hot house like conditions. The favorite is to rent a large house, demolish the inside, tap into the hydro lines, and grow crop after crop, which ruins the house, because of the sprinkling system to water the plants, combined with the warmth. Then whatever criminal element grew it tries to smuggle it into the States. Fortunately "your people" are very aware of it.

Thanks, LG. I was trying to imagine what you were talking about and all I could think of was Budwiser. Yes, I am aware of grow houses but not about the sprinkler system. For some reason I always thought they were grown with hydroponics.

But back to the topic. Decomposition is a horrible, horrible smell. One summer I was driving with my windows down and passed by a dead, bloated possum on the side of the road. It was disgustingly horrible and it took a while for the stench to get out of my car and out of my nose, and I was going at 45 mpg. Since then I have immediately raised the windows when I have seen a dead animal on the road. It doesn't smell like rotten potatoes or any other putrified garbage. I can only imagine.... and don't want to.

 

[Mamabear1963]

Well that's simply incorrect. Pizza just dries up it doesn't decompose. I really can't understand why anyone would state that it does. WFTV did that exact experiment - they put a large 'meat lovers' pizza in a trunk for 20 days and when they opened it, it smelled like pizza. Pizza does NOT ever smell like decomp. No pizza was found anyway. Cindy and George were lying.

A couple of days ago I posted this link...let me find it again

ETA:
http://www.wftv.com/news/17292628/detail.html

 

[MissJames]

A couple of days ago I posted this link...let me find it again

ETA:
http://www.wftv.com/news/17292628/detail.html

Thanks, LG. I was trying to imagine what you were talking about and all I could think of was Budwiser. Yes, I am aware of grow houses but not about the sprinkler system. For some reason I always thought they were grown with hydroponics.

But back to the topic. Decomposition is a horrible, horrible smell. One summer I was driving with my windows down and passed by a dead, bloated possum on the side of the road. It was disgustingly horrible and it took a while for the stench to get out of my car and out of my nose, and I was going at 45 mpg. Since then I have immediately raised the windows when I have seen a dead animal on the road. It doesn't smell like rotten potatoes or any other putrified garbage. I can only imagine.... and don't want to.

I know people find buzzards creepy, but thank God for them. They keep most of the decomp in check.

 

[magnolia]

The trash bag with its contents contained permeable material. Especially the pizza box. Trash bags do indeed smell even if they are for only recycle. I change mine weekly because of the smell. That pizza box should have been smellin to high heaven of decomp. And that trash bag with contents should have smelled just like the trunk. Ym started to give the long format answer until he was interrupted and gave the short answer, that they did not smell the same. Just another thing that does not make sense to me. IMO

I'm sorry, but,any material that disallows the passage of a liquid is considered to be impermeable.I don't think anyone said the plastic bag did not have an odor. I don't believe the slick, nonporous, impermeable, plastic bag would absorb the odor to the same degree as the more permeable, porous, interior materials & surfaces in the Pontiac. I agree with you. The bag did contain permeable material. However, the permeable contents would not absorb the odor to the same degree, because the trash was "inside" the impermeable bag. All that said, I believe you are incorrect when you say the contents should have smelled "just" like the trunk. The difference in the smell of the trash bag/contents vs. the smell in the Pontiac allowed Detective Melich to determine the odor of the trash bag/contents was not the same as the odor in the trunk. The difference allowed him to determine the contents of the trash bag was not the source of the strong odor that he described as decomp.

IMO

In regards to the statement made by Detective Melich, what exactly are you implying? Sorry, but, I don't understand. Are you perhaps implying he did not tell the truth?

Btw, I believe you failed to address my reply to one of your posts. Sorry, but,I am confused on this one as well.

How does your comment,"many many people" in OJ's Bronco relate to this case and the decomp odor in the Pontiac?

 

[Tulessa]

Cadaver dogs can also distinguish between human & animal decomp.

They can also distinguish between 100 year old human bones and bones of humans recently deceased. They call them archeological dogs.

http://archaeologydogs.com/

 

[RR0004]

Well that's simply incorrect. Pizza just dries up it doesn't decompose. I really can't understand why anyone would state that it does. WFTV did that exact experiment - they put a large 'meat lovers' pizza in a trunk for 20 days and when they opened it, it smelled like pizza. Pizza does NOT ever smell like decomp. No pizza was found anyway. Cindy and George were lying.

Thanks, HF. I don't want anyone reading here to think that an empty pizza box in a garbage bag reeks of decomposition when left in a car for a long period of time. There has been much discussion early on if any newbies are interested. IIRC it's also been posted on the Myth Busters thread.

 

[magnolia]

The only reason I mentioned the odor of a skunk, is because that is a very strong, and distinct odor. In no way am I comparing its smell to that of a decomposing human. I wanted to know if anyone who had smelled a decomposing human after 2 and a half days of decomposing, thought that the odor of said decomposing human was as DISTINCT as the distinct odor of a skunk.

In regard to the empty food containers. Many think there was no residue, since the CSI said there was no food in the white trash bag. I agree that there was most likely food residue that caused an odor that the maggots would be attracted to. The big difference is I believe there was more than just a residue. I believe there was enough food residue in the empty containers to feed 3 generations of maggots, since mathematically the maggots GA and SB heard and saw living and making a popping sound in the white trash bag had to be third generation maggots, and iirc Dr. Vass mentioned in his report that these were third generation maggots. The other big difference is I think that the odor produced by the food residue in the 90 plus sealed trunk was much stronger than just an unpleasant odor.

I know it is possible that the odor from a decomposing body can permeate an area as small as the trunk. Once the decomposing body is removed, the odor will dissipate, however, the smell will remain on the permeated areas. I have tried to find information in regards to the following question, and I have had no luck at all. Once the source of the odor has been removed, will the odor in the permeated areas increase substantially in intensity? All I could find is that once the source is removed, the odor will dissipate, but may linger for a long, long time in the permeated areas. I can find nothing that shows the odor increases once the source is removed. Since GA did not notice the awful odor the day KC returned his gas cans, nor did her boyfriend the day before, I am having trouble figuring out how the odor was so much worse 3 weeks later. As always, my entire post is
MOO

The five key major compounds associated with human decomp. + constant high humidity & heat. IMO

 

[Nore]

Thanks, HF. I don't want anyone reading here to think that an empty pizza box in a garbage bag reeks of decomposition when left in a car for a long period of time. There has been much discussion early on if any newbies are interested. IIRC it's also been posted on the Myth Busters thread.

-------------------------------
Hi. Just wanted to say Forensic Botany thread is an excellent read also. :woohoo:

 

[logicalgirl]

Thanks, LG. I was trying to imagine what you were talking about and all I could think of was Budwiser. Yes, I am aware of grow houses but not about the sprinkler system. For some reason I always thought they were grown with hydroponics.

But back to the topic. Decomposition is a horrible, horrible smell. One summer I was driving with my windows down and passed by a dead, bloated possum on the side of the road. It was disgustingly horrible and it took a while for the stench to get out of my car and out of my nose, and I was going at 45 mpg. Since then I have immediately raised the windows when I have seen a dead animal on the road. It doesn't smell like rotten potatoes or any other putrified garbage. I can only imagine.... and don't want to.

Yes,you are correct, the sophisticated ones use hydroponics - but they are there for the longer haul than those who gut houses - they are much more careless.

 

[notthatsmart]

Well that's simply incorrect. Pizza just dries up it doesn't decompose. I really can't understand why anyone would state that it does. WFTV did that exact experiment - they put a large 'meat lovers' pizza in a trunk for 20 days and when they opened it, it smelled like pizza. Pizza does NOT ever smell like decomp. No pizza was found anyway. Cindy and George were lying.

Was talking about the box. thanks

 

[The World According]

Thanks, HF. I don't want anyone reading here to think that an empty pizza box in a garbage bag reeks of decomposition when left in a car for a long period of time. There has been much discussion early on if any newbies are interested. IIRC it's also been posted on the Myth Busters thread.

Yes, friend. I don't think anyone really thinks that. I think some folks are having a little fun making jokes, that is all. imo

 

[notthatsmart]

I'm sorry, but,any material that disallows the passage of a liquid is considered to be impermeable.I don't think anyone said the plastic bag did not have an odor. I don't believe the slick, nonporous, impermeable, plastic bag would absorb the odor to the same degree as the more permeable, porous, interior materials & surfaces in the Pontiac. I agree with you. The bag did contain permeable material. However, the permeable contents would not absorb the odor to the same degree, because the trash was "inside" the impermeable bag. All that said, I believe you are incorrect when you say the contents should have smelled "just" like the trunk. The difference in the smell of the trash bag/contents vs. the smell in the Pontiac allowed Detective Melich to determine the odor of the trash bag/contents was not the same as the odor in the trunk. The difference allowed him to determine the contents of the trash bag was not the source of the strong odor that he described as decomp.

IMO

In regards to the statement made by Detective Melich, what exactly are you implying? Sorry, but, I don't understand. Are you perhaps implying he did not tell the truth?

Btw, I believe you failed to address my reply to one of your posts. Sorry, but,I am confused on this one as well.

How does your comment,"many many people" in OJ's Bronco relate to this case and the decomp odor in the Pontiac?

The bag was in a dumpster for 30 hours. It is contaminated to say the least. Not even sure how that bag is coming into evidence. The bag had an opening at the top and that is why I think the smell could have permeated the cardboard from the pizza box.

I am implying that Det Melich was trying to answer a question and was intterupted.

As far as the comment about many people in the Oj Bronco, in context it was to say that they were able to determine many people were in that vehicle, when Sa was saying they were not. Sa had stated only a couple of people actually came to look at the Bronco, and the defense came up with several witnesses who said they looked at the bronco while it was in police custody.

It applied at the time in context to how many people have looked at Kc's vehicle, how do we know that they didn't contaminate the vehicle. If there are a lot of people, it won't look good for the Sa. IMO

 

[notthatsmart]

Thanks, HF. I don't want anyone reading here to think that an empty pizza box in a garbage bag reeks of decomposition when left in a car for a long period of time. There has been much discussion early on if any newbies are interested. IIRC it's also been posted on the Myth Busters thread.

I was talking about the box. Do you not agree that cardboard is permeable? Kitchen Garbage bag contents do reek of decomposition. There was definately decomp in that garbage bag. Especially the cheese wrappers. IMO

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

As far as the comment about many people in the Oj Bronco, in context it was to say that they were able to determine many people were in that vehicle, when Sa was saying they were not. Sa had stated only a couple of people actually came to look at the Bronco, and the defense came up with several witnesses who said they looked at the bronco while it was in police custody.

It applied at the time in context to how many people have looked at Kc's vehicle, how do we know that they didn't contaminate the vehicle. If there are a lot of people, it won't look good for the Sa. IMO

RSBM. I know; HL was there. lol

 

[RR0004]

The source of human decomposition odor was not a box or plastic bag. JMHO

 

[magnolia]

The bag was in a dumpster for 30 hours. It is contaminated to say the least. Not even sure how that bag is coming into evidence. The bag had an opening at the top and that is why I think the smell could have permeated the cardboard from the pizza box.

I am implying that Det Melich was trying to answer a question and was intterupted.

As far as the comment about many people in the Oj Bronco, in context it was to say that they were able to determine many people were in that vehicle, when Sa was saying they were not. Sa had stated only a couple of people actually came to look at the Bronco, and the defense came up with several witnesses who said they looked at the bronco while it was in police custody.

It applied at the time in context to how many people have looked at Kc's vehicle, how do we know that they didn't contaminate the vehicle. If there are a lot of people, it won't look good for the Sa. IMO

The bag had an opening at the top and that is why I think the smell could have permeated the cardboard from the pizza box.

So,The opening at the top of the "impermeable plastic garbage bag" could have allowed the decomp odor "in the trunk" to permeate the pizza box? So, you agree the source of the odor originated in the trunk, in the environment outside the plastic garbage bag?

In regards to the statement made by Detective Melich? Am I correct that GA also said the odor of the bag & contents were different than the decomp odor in the trunk? Detective Melich very clearly stated the odors were different.





.

 

[Tulessa]

The bag was in a dumpster for 30 hours. It is contaminated to say the least. Not even sure how that bag is coming into evidence. The bag had an opening at the top and that is why I think the smell could have permeated the cardboard from the pizza box.

I am implying that Det Melich was trying to answer a question and was intterupted.

As far as the comment about many people in the Oj Bronco, in context it was to say that they were able to determine many people were in that vehicle, when Sa was saying they were not. Sa had stated only a couple of people actually came to look at the Bronco, and the defense came up with several witnesses who said they looked at the bronco while it was in police custody.

It applied at the time in context to how many people have looked at Kc's vehicle, how do we know that they didn't contaminate the vehicle. If there are a lot of people, it won't look good for the Sa. IMO

But only ONE hair related to decomposition was found and THAT hair was from Casey's DAUGHTER! JMO.