GUILTY Denmark - Kim Wall, 30, Copenhagen, 10 Aug 2017

[Vail]

Has anything been said about why he chose Kim?

 

[SATA]

This monster should never set foot on the streets again. He is sick in the head and extremely dangerous. I don't know anything about Danish law but I really hope they'll decide to keep him locked up for life.

The law in Denmark does have such a clause in it.
I am sure they will use it in this case.

He WILL have the possibility of getting out sooner than if he gets a "life sentence" (which is 15 years in Denmark), because he can apply for parole after three years and if denied, he can apply once per year after that.

In my view unlikely he will be granted parole, so I am guessing he will be locked up for life - and in isolation by his own choice, because the other inmates will not be "kind" to a killer of this sort.

 

[SATA]

Has anything been said about why he chose Kim?

No.
Probably opportunity. I think it could have been any woman.

 

[Logical_Inference]

Kim Walls boyfriend reveals terrible details about the last hours before meeting with Peter Madsen

In the hours after Peter Madsen and Kim Wall had left the dock on Refshale Island, she sent several messages to her boyfriend. She expressed her excitement about being aboard the submarine, and there were absolutely no indications that something was going to happen soon.
But suddenly there were no more messages on the girlfriend's phone....

Article here:
https://translate.google.com/transl...e-detaljer-om-de-sidste-timer-foer-moedet-med

 

[Satchie]

No.
Probably opportunity. I think it could have been any woman.

From her photo, which he would likely have looked up, she was very attractive. I agree, he was probably waiting for the 'right victim' to carry out his sick fantasy.

I'll get on my soapbox: I think too many people who participate in what they call 'kinky' lifestyles (not talking about Kim Wall) are very naive about sadists, they think they're exciting, 60 shades of grey types. They try to normalize it and make it out to be harmless fun. But I think this guy demonstrates what sadists are really into, if they thought they could get away with it.

 

[SATA]

From her photo, which he would likely have looked up, she was very attractive. I agree, he was probably waiting for the 'right victim' to carry out his sick fantasy.

I'll get on my soapbox: I think too many people who participate in what they call 'kinky' lifestyles (not talking about Kim Wall) are very naive about sadists, they think they're exciting, 60 shades of grey types. They try to normalize it and make it out to be harmless fun. But I think this guy demonstrates what sadists are really into, if they thought they could get away with it.

You may be right to a certain degree. I don´t know much about S/M and I am not really interested in it, but I think PM is a rare case - fortunately!
There is a huge step from fantasizing, or even living out some fantasies with a consenting partner/partners - to torturing someone to death.
I don´t think we can generalize.

 

[SATA]

Kim Walls boyfriend reveals terrible details about the last hours before meeting with Peter Madsen

In the hours after Peter Madsen and Kim Wall had left the dock on Refshale Island, she sent several messages to her boyfriend. She expressed her excitement about being aboard the submarine, and there were absolutely no indications that something was going to happen soon.
But suddenly there were no more messages on the girlfriend's phone....

Article here:
https://translate.google.com/transl...e-detaljer-om-de-sidste-timer-foer-moedet-med

The translation is so confusing. Mainly because we have the same word for girlfriend and boyfriend in Danish.
Kim Wall had a boyfriend, just to make that clear.

Poor him!!!!! He must feel guilty for not going with her.

P.S. can we be sure it was Kim Wall who sent all the messages?
I don´t know whether KW knew Danish well - or if she wrote to her boyfriend in Swedish.
OR if Peter Madsen knows how to write in Swedish.

Hope this makes sense, it just makes me think. They say the messages came over a period of some hours - so she allegedly had a great time for several hours on the submarine.
A bit odd, isn´t it?

 

[ZaZara]

Kim Walls boyfriend reveals terrible details about the last hours before meeting with Peter Madsen

In the hours after Peter Madsen and Kim Wall had left the dock on Refshale Island, she sent several messages to her boyfriend. She expressed her excitement about being aboard the submarine, and there were absolutely no indications that something was going to happen soon.
But suddenly there were no more messages on the girlfriend's phone....

Article here:
https://translate.google.com/transl...e-detaljer-om-de-sidste-timer-foer-moedet-med

So they are having a farewell party because they both are leaving for Bejing soon when the phone rings and it is Peter Madsen who wants to give an interview.
And Kim Wall invites her boyfriend to join her, but he prefers to stay with their guests, and she will only be gone 2 hours. Normally this would be the right thing to do, but the boyfriend has to live with the cruel consequences of that decision.

As for Peter Madsen, he must have considered himself above all human and divine scrutiny. An entire party saw her leave with him, she sent messages and yet he expected to get away with it all.


:gaah:

 

[SATA]

So they are having a farewell party because they both are leaving for Bejing soon when the phone rings and it is Peter Madsen who wants to give an interview.
And Kim Wall invites her boyfriend to join her, but he prefers to stay with their guests, and she will only be gone 2 hours. Normally this would be the right thing to do, but the boyfriend has to live with the cruel consequences of that decision.

As for Peter Madsen, he must have considered himself above all human and divine scrutiny. An entire party saw her leave with him, she sent messages and yet he expected to get away with it all.


:gaah:

He does, doesn´t he.
I hope he get some help to deal with it. It would have seemed completely safe to them.
Peter Madsen a well known and I guess generally respected person (by people who didn´t know him well.)
Book written about him, documentary about him, in the media not often, but enough to be a familiar face.
Furthermore, they would have seen him in the neighbourhood from time to time.

 

[pamelado2]

He does, doesn´t he.
I hope he get some help to deal with it. It would have seemed completely safe to them.
Peter Madsen a well known and I guess generally respected person (by people who didn´t know him well.)
Book written about him, documentary about him, in the media not often, but enough to be a familiar face.
Furthermore, they would have seen him in the neighbourhood from time to time.

Well not only all that but why in the world would anyone feel they were in danger going on a submarine? I mean, look at this: he was well known, numerous people knew where she was going, they had emailed each other regarding it, they were in a very specific place. All those factors would make you feel safe, wouldn't they?

If I were in that situation and were asked to speculate I would say the (absolute) worst that could happen would be he would be a jerk or would make an unwanted pass.

We're always told to watch our surroundings, beware of strangers, hold your purse a certain way, unlock your car a certain way, stay away from certain areas at night, don't give anyone your address, don't give the mechanic your entire key chain, etc, etc, etc. This is such a horrific example of the bizarre that could happen even if you do all those things!

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Logical_Inference]

Has anything been said about why he chose Kim?

There was an article yesterday in one of the newsmedia about that KW and her boyfriend actually lived under 200 meters from PM's workshop, and that the residents in that area sometimes had a bonfire on summer-evenings where he would show up and sit down to chat with the residents.

Unfortunately was that article behind a paywall so I could only see the headline and a few lines of the article before it cut me off.

Anyway it could be that he had noticed her either at the bonfires or in the area, and that when she then contacted him, he might have thought that it wouldbe a great idea to use just her for his very sick idea.

 

[Logical_Inference]

Well not only all that but why in the world would anyone feel they were in danger going on a submarine? I mean, look at this: he was well known, numerous people knew where she was going, they had emailed each other regarding it, they were in a very specific place. All those factors would make you feel safe, wouldn't they?

If I were in that situation and were asked to speculate I would say the (absolute) worst that could happen would be he would be a jerk or would make an unwanted pass.

We're always told to watch our surroundings, beware of strangers, hold your purse a certain way, unlock your car a certain way, stay away from certain areas at night, don't give anyone your address, don't give the mechanic your entire key chain, etc, etc, etc. This is such a horrific example of the bizarre that could happen even if you do all those things!

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Yeah Its true that we wont have a chance to know if we put ourself in danger when we choose to spend time with a male alone. With the whole #meetoo movement it shows that some males - way too many - do take advantage of a woman if no one is watching. Now I could step on a soapbox and say alot about that subject, but I will spare you....lol

There was an article yesterday where a for me unknown author had given an interview in a media I dont read, but where a lot of people had read it and was yelling loudly over all other medias, because that author had said that he thought that Kim Wall was a girl that already seeked danger, and that she shouldnt have entered the submarine with PM alone.
But how the h... should she know? She had been in much more dangerous environments before, so how on earth could she have seen this coming.

 

[Grapey]

Do you think this monsters actions were a reaction (maybe because Kim declined his advances) or it was predatory behaviour (he knew he was going to kill this woman before even asking her along?). Like I know he had everything there to do it, but did he bring those in case he didn't get what he wanted?

With the amount of times he stabbed her and where he stabbed her, it certainly comes across as an act of rage. But to stab her vaginally, was it to get back at all women who had said no in the past?

Trying to think of why he would do this. Maybe he just wanted to kill. But why not do it on land where there would be a slight chance of getting away with it?

I just don't understand. What a vile thing he is.

 

[meticulously]

Yeah Its true that we wont have a chance to know if we put ourself in danger when we choose to spend time with a male alone. With the whole #meetoo movement it shows that some males - way too many - do take advantage of a woman if no one is watching. Now I could step on a soapbox and say alot about that subject, but I will spare you....lol

There was an article yesterday where a for me unknown author had given an interview in a media I dont read, but where a lot of people had read it and was yelling loudly over all other medias, because that author had said that he thought that Kim Wall was a girl that already seeked danger, and that she shouldnt have entered the submarine with PM alone.
But how the h... should she know? She had been in much more dangerous environments before, so how on earth could she have seen this coming.

Is it possible naivete ?
If you have ever been on a boat with a captain you might have an idea as to this jeckle and hyde behaviour.
In my experiences it seemed like an imaginary line was crossed once you are on the boat and have set out to sea and you cant get off it . Its well known among boating deckhands that within a short time or distance of the departure a boat captain will change markedly . You then become the subject of the captain...a type of slave.....servant....deckhand....
of varying degree .
These Captains are very good people until you go to sea with them and cross that line, which is soon after departure...
It may not be until you have done a few trips to sea, that you can clearly identify this procedure, that repeats itself over and over again with A Sea Captain .
Its similar to an abduction, when you stop to consider the vulnerable situation...A submarine is an underwater going vessel so a high level of trust should exist to start...
Was Peter Madsen reputed to be very trustworthy?
Did he groom the victim over time before this horrific murder ?
Did the victim even feel safe at all,
was it considered a little bit risky ?
Was KWs boyfriend nearby awaiting her safe return, unable to do anything?
So sad for the boyfriend also, the poor unfortunate friend of Kim....RiP

 

[Logical_Inference]

Do you think this monsters actions were a reaction (maybe because Kim declined his advances) or it was predatory behaviour (he knew he was going to kill this woman before even asking her along?). Like I know he had everything there to do it, but did he bring those in case he didn't get what he wanted?

With the amount of times he stabbed her and where he stabbed her, it certainly comes across as an act of rage. But to stab her vaginally, was it to get back at all women who had said no in the past?

Trying to think of why he would do this. Maybe he just wanted to kill. But why not do it on land where there would be a slight chance of getting away with it?

I just don't understand. What a vile thing he is.

The police believes that he planned to do a thing like this in forehand, but I dont think they feel that he was out to get KW. It seems that it could have been a coincedence that it was to be her, but I think that only PM knows the answer for that.

He was a part of the S/M environment in copenhagen, as people who knew him has reported here in this thread, and the police has also reported that he had dark web videos on his computer, with sexual murders of women, so I believe that he wanted to try it out, no matter who it was.

Yeah its so unbelievable cruel and disgusting what he has done. (I know that he hasnt been convicted yet, but it is unfortunately so obvious that he has done it, so if all in this thread is read then you will see it ver clear that it was him.)

 

[Logical_Inference]

Is it possible naivete ?
If you have ever been on a boat with a captain you might have an idea as to this jeckle and hyde behaviour.
In my experiences it seemed like an imaginary line was crossed once you are on the boat and have set out to sea and you cant get off it . Its well known among boating deckhands that within a short time or distance of the departure a boat captain will change markedly . You then become the subject of the captain...a type of slave.....servant....deckhand....
of varying degree .
These Captains are very good people until you go to sea with them and cross that line, which is soon after departure...
It may not be until you have done a few trips to sea, that you can clearly identify this procedure, that repeats itself over and over again with A Sea Captain .
Its similar to an abduction, when you stop to consider the vulnerable situation...A submarine is an underwater going vessel so a high level of trust should exist to start...
Was Peter Madsen reputed to be very trustworthy?
Did he groom the victim over time before this horrific murder ?
Did the victim even feel safe at all,
was it considered a little bit risky ?
Was KWs boyfriend nearby awaiting her safe return, unable to do anything?
So sad for the boyfriend also, the poor unfortunate friend of Kim....RiP

Interesting. I have never heard of that Captain-syndrome before. Now I will never go out to sail anymore...
Well, the rumors say that he often had women with him on the submarine, and what he did to them knows only they. He apparently didnt kill before, because the police hasnt forund any match with his DNA.

I didnt know PM personally, but it seems that he did had some good deal of trust in his personal environment and in the media, because of what he had done with his rockets and the submarine, so I dont think that KW was at all naive to go with him. No one knew anything about his dark site apparently.

It seems that he didnt know KW before the meeting, but as she lived 200 meters from his workshop so he could have noticed her, without her knowing.

According to her boyfriend she did feel comfortable and exited when they left in the submarine, because she sent him text-messages about it, until the sms suddenly stopped. Which again led her boyfriend to call the police.
If it was considered risky then my guess is that it could have been risky because it was a trip in a homemade submarine, and not so much because it was with PM.

Her boyfriend was nearby because they lived nearby so he was waiting (she was supposed to only be away for a few hours) and got nervouse when the sms stopped. Yeah he must have been extremely nervous and it has been awful for him in those hours before he called the police, and after also of course.

 

[Grapey]

The police believes that he planned to do a thing like this in forehand, but I dont think they feel that he was out to get KW. It seems that it could have been a coincedence that it was to be her, but I think that only PM knows the answer for that.

He was a part of the S/M environment in copenhagen, as people who knew him has reported here in this thread, and the police has also reported that he had dark web videos on his computer, with sexual murders of women, so I believe that he wanted to try it out, no matter who it was.

Yeah its so unbelievable cruel and disgusting what he has done. (I know that he hasnt been convicted yet, but it is unfortunately so obvious that he has done it, so if all in this thread is read then you will see it ver clear that it was him.)

Oh! I haven't read every page of this thread and didn't know that. Makes this even more sickening. Thankyou for enlightening me!

Wonder the possibility of what would have happened if Kim's partner had of come along. Would he have killed them both? Probably. Maybe not. But her bf will be living with the 'what ifs' for a long time.

PM's actions have negatively affected a lot of lives. I hope he never gets to see the light of day!

Makes me feel ill.

 

[Logical_Inference]

Oh! I haven't read every page of this thread and didn't know that. Makes this even more sickening. Thankyou for enlightening me!

Wonder the possibility of what would have happened if Kim's partner had of come along. Would he have killed them both? Probably. Maybe not. But her bf will be living with the 'what ifs' for a long time.

PM's actions have negatively affected a lot of lives. I hope he never gets to see the light of day!

Makes me feel ill.

It wasnt ment as a enlightning of you. The "you" was a "you all" and it was all ment as a kind of "excuse" for me keeping to write about PM as he is already convicted.

I have thought the same about her boyfriend too. Somehow it would be best to believe that PM wouldnt have done it, but there is that little doubt that say he would probably have killed the boyfriend frist and then after that do what he felt like to do. Fortunately he didnt go, so he is still alive today.

And yes, in this case I would like the death-sentence to be reinstated here!

 

[FlashyHydra]

The translation is so confusing. Mainly because we have the same word for girlfriend and boyfriend in Danish.
Kim Wall had a boyfriend, just to make that clear.

Poor him!!!!! He must feel guilty for not going with her.

P.S. can we be sure it was Kim Wall who sent all the messages?
I don´t know whether KW knew Danish well - or if she wrote to her boyfriend in Swedish.
OR if Peter Madsen knows how to write in Swedish.

Hope this makes sense, it just makes me think. They say the messages came over a period of some hours - so she allegedly had a great time for several hours on the submarine.
A bit odd, isn´t it?

I thought the same too. Perhaps he attacked her right away and sent those messages to her boyfriend. Perhaps PM liked to play games...

 

[SATA]

I too believe PM would have killed the boyfriend first and then Kim Wall, if the bf had decided to go along on the trip.

To me the timing of the killing is crucial.

I have written about this earlier in the thread, so please bear with me.

There were two rocket projects on Refshaleøen. Peter Madsen´s original project from which he was kicked and his new project.
Those two rocket projects were set to have a test launch at the island of Bornholm very shortly after the killing - on the same day no less. In fact, PM had planned to sail to Bornholm the day after with some helpers.
He cancelled that trip by text message to one of his helpers at 11 pm the night of the trip with Kim Wall.
The irony of it is that there were no launches. The other project had some problems...

PM has admitted that he was very much on edge because of the launches. The competition. I think he knew, or was afraid, the other project would do better - AND HE COULD NOT HAVE THAT!
The killing was his way out - out of it all.
For years he had been talking about being the first amateur to send a man into space - he was that man.
I think he knew by then it was never going to happen - closing in on 50 years of age. Probably under-funded compared to the other project.

So, this was his day to live out a dreadful fantasy.


Locical_Inference:

There was an article yesterday where a for me unknown author had given an interview in a media I dont read, but where a lot of people had read it and was yelling loudly over all other medias, because that author had said that he thought that Kim Wall was a girl that already seeked danger, and that she shouldnt have entered the submarine with PM alone.
But how the h... should she know? She had been in much more dangerous environments before, so how on earth could she have seen this coming.​

That just makes me so angry! It was NOT Kim Wall´s fault what happened to her in any shape, size or form.
Victim blaming at it´s "finest" there. ugh