Does Skyline school bear any responsibility?

[RubyRed]

Well, the front, original part of the school has two floors. Kyron's classroom was on the second floor. The main entrance and the side entrances open to the second floor. Since the school is built against a hill, the first floor is more like a daylight basement.

Janitor Bill Tandy walks past Kyron Horman's classroom at Skyline Elementary School in the early hours of June 7, 2010.
http://photos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/06/kyron_horman_search_attracts_1_3.html



Definitely on the second floor.

 

[eyes4crime]

http://s780.photobucket.com/home/gwenabob/index

I went out to Skyline School today and took lots of photos. Feel free to have a look.

BBM

gwenabob, I'm bumping up the 'best ever' pics you took of the school so nobody misses them. Wonder if they could be put on a sticky? Thanks again!

 

[RubyRed]

BBM

gwenabob, I'm bumping up the 'best ever' pics you took of the school so nobody misses them. Wonder if they could be put on a sticky? Thanks again!

I see them in the reference forum.

 

[RubyRed]

Skyline Elementary School

Parents have reviewed this school and given it an average rating of 4 out of 5 stars.

http://www.greatschools.org/oregon/portland/927-Skyline-Elementary-School/

 

[Lavender]

I'm trying to figure out the location of Kyron when he was last seen by TH.

It helps me to visualize things, and one thing I keep getting tripped up on is the conflict among statements regarding the location of Kyron relative to TH the last time that TH saw Kyron. Here’s what I can’t figure out:

From http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/details_emerge_about_the_day_k.html

~begin snip~
At 8:45 a.m. when the bell rang, Terri walked her stepson down the hall close to his class.

"He told her, 'I'm going back to the classroom, Mom,' and she waves to him and left," Carol Moulton said. "She thought he was safely at school just like he is everyday."
~end snip~

Based on this, I initially pictured them both together on the 2nd floor, they say goodbye to each other, and then he walks to his class. Subsequent articles have mentioned that the classroom and/or Kyron was 150 feet away, so I’ve always pictured the duo at the East end of the 2nd floor hall, farthest away from his classroom, which is on the West end of the 2nd floor hall.

But…that all changed when I listened to this:

From Lt. Mary Lindstrand of MCSO in a telephone interview:
http://www.katu.com/news/local/95691389.html?tab=video

'His stepmother and he were in the school looking at the science fair, had been in 2 or 3 different classrooms. I am told he went up one stairwell, she went up the other stairwell. She saw him walking down the hall toward his classroom, and that’s the last she saw him.” (Transcribed by me from the video containing the phone interview. Statement is at the end of the video.)

If Lt. Lindstrand is correct, then that places TH and Kyron at opposite ends of the 1st floor hall, with each deciding to go up the 2nd floor using separate stairwells.

Kyron’s class is on the 2nd floor, room 213 (IIRC) in the Southwest corner, and is the first classroom near the West stairs. Now, if TH “saw him walking down the hall toward his classroom” that either means:

1) TH is at East end/Kyron is at the West end. TH watches Kyron walk the very short distance between the stairs and the classroom and then she leaves the 2nd floor via the East stairs.

OR

2) TH is at the West end/Kyron is at the East end. This places TH near Kyron’s classroom, and Kyron farthest away from his classroom. If this is the case, TH must have gone down the West stairs when she left, because she didn't cross paths with Kyron when she left.

The use of opposite stairwells seems to jibe with the reports that she was 150 feet away. The school isn’t that big and by looking at the floorplan supplied by RubyRed (I don’t know how to attach the image) in the Skyline School thread, the West and East stairwells appear to be 150 feet apart.

I’m curious how others have been visualizing this. Why do they go up separate staircases from the 1st to the 2nd floor? When and where did the “I’m going back to my classroom, Mom” conversation occur? On the 1st floor before heading to opposite stairways?

Just trying to figure it out.

 

[matou]

So the last time she sees him is walking up one stairwell? (from your bold). How can she see him at all if she's going up or down another stairwell as him? Why take different stairwells at all? I'm thinking the reporting is wrong, or her statement is off. Something is wrong about this scenario, I agree.

 

[Lavender]

So the last time she sees him is walking up one stairwell? (from your bold). How can she see him at all if she's going up or down another stairwell as him? Why take different stairwells at all? I'm thinking the reporting is wrong, or her statement is off. Something is wrong about this scenario, I agree.

I took it to mean that once she got to top of the stairs on the 2nd floor, she looked down the hallway and saw him at the opposite end, where he had come up the other stairs.

 

[miakelly]

That's very interesting Lavender!

So - why did TH go BACK upstairs? If it was to see him to class, then wouldn't she have gone up the same stairwell as him? She went back a different set of stairs from him, to watch him walk 150 ft to class, then did she go back downstairs and leave the school?

This means that he never made it back to class and someone took/lured him or he somehow went missing before he got to the door of his classroom?

Terri watched him walk back to class about the time the bell rang (8:45), sub notices he's missing right after that which means he never got back to class.

Kyron's friend alledgedly saw Kyron at this time (in the hallway as Kyron was walking back to class??) and KH says 'I'm going downstairs to see an electric exhibit'........JUST after he alledgedly told Terri 'bye Mom, I'm going back to class' . KH's friend heard the sub/teacher talking about KH not being back in class, wonder why the friend didn't tell them that KH said he was going to see an 'electric exhibit' downstairs? That may have caused the teacher to go look for him as it is okay to go to the bathroom, but not wander off on his own to see an exhibit, I imagine. Seems odd that KH would tell SM 'Bye Mom, I'm going back to class' then tell a friend right after that 'I'm going downstairs to see an electric exhibit' .

Something doesn't add up here.

 

[miabellamoure]

I took it to mean that once she got to top of the stairs on the 2nd floor, she looked down the hallway and saw him at the opposite end, where he had come up the other stairs.

If so, why were they in opposite stairwells to begin with?

 

[JBean]

I think there are all kinds of floorplans and pictures for this in the Skyline Elementary thread. There are answers there about the physical building and good visual aids

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=106904"]Skyline Elementary School - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[matou]

I took it to mean that once she got to top of the stairs on the 2nd floor, she looked down the hallway and saw him at the opposite end, where he had come up the other stairs.

So this would mean that she was walking around without him before leaving the school. He was going up different stairs in the opposite end of the hall from him. I wonder how busy it was at the time?

 

[BeanE]

He was last seen by his step-mother walking toward his classroom, 150 feet away. He never made it.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Media/kyron-horman-school-crisis-mode-search-continues/story?id=10847733

I never took that as Kyron was 150 feet away from stepmom, but that the classroom was 150 feet away from them.

 

[Lavender]

If that's the case, then he wen't up the stairs RIGHT next to his classroom door and she was at the other end of the hall, otherwise, if it were reversed, she wouldn't have to watch him walk 150 ft to class. (I am visualizing this per the pictures someone posted of Kyron's classroom, with the Janitor walking by and the stairs are RIGHT there by the door.

So, Kyron went up those stairs to class and she saw him at the top of the stairs, but he didn't get into class? I truly find that impossible. Once he got to the top of the stairs, he was literally in front of his classroom door.

I know. That's why the reverse seems more plausible to me at this point...that TH was on the West end and Kyron was on the East end walking toward both her and the classroom. I had just never visualized it that way in the beginning, with her being right next to the classroom and Kyron way on the East end, having come up opposite stairs.

 

[PaulaF513]

I'm trying to figure out the location of Kyron when he was last seen by TH.

It helps me to visualize things, and one thing I keep getting tripped up on is the conflict among statements regarding the location of Kyron relative to TH the last time that TH saw Kyron. Here’s what I can’t figure out:

From http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/details_emerge_about_the_day_k.html

~begin snip~
At 8:45 a.m. when the bell rang, Terri walked her stepson down the hall close to his class.

"He told her, 'I'm going back to the classroom, Mom,' and she waves to him and left," Carol Moulton said. "She thought he was safely at school just like he is everyday."
~end snip~

Based on this, I initially pictured them both together on the 2nd floor, they say goodbye to each other, and then he walks to his class. Subsequent articles have mentioned that the classroom and/or Kyron was 150 feet away, so I’ve always pictured the duo at the East end of the 2nd floor hall, farthest away from his classroom, which is on the West end of the 2nd floor hall.

But…that all changed when I listened to this:

From Lt. Mary Lindstrand of MCSO in a telephone interview:
http://www.katu.com/news/local/95691389.html?tab=video

'His stepmother and he were in the school looking at the science fair, had been in 2 or 3 different classrooms. I am told he went up one stairwell, she went up the other stairwell. She saw him walking down the hall toward his classroom, and that’s the last she saw him.” (Transcribed by me from the video containing the phone interview. Statement is at the end of the video.)

If Lt. Lindstrand is correct, then that places TH and Kyron at opposite ends of the 1st floor hall, with each deciding to go up the 2nd floor using separate stairwells.

Kyron’s class is on the 2nd floor, room 213 (IIRC) in the Southwest corner, and is the first classroom near the West stairs. Now, if TH “saw him walking down the hall toward his classroom” that either means:

1) TH is at East end/Kyron is at the West end. TH watches Kyron walk the very short distance between the stairs and the classroom and then she leaves the 2nd floor via the East stairs.

OR

2) TH is at the West end/Kyron is at the East end. This places TH near Kyron’s classroom, and Kyron farthest away from his classroom. If this is the case, TH must have gone down the West stairs when she left, because she didn't cross paths with Kyron when she left.

The use of opposite stairwells seems to jibe with the reports that she was 150 feet away. The school isn’t that big and by looking at the floorplan supplied by RubyRed (I don’t know how to attach the image) in the Skyline School thread, the West and East stairwells appear to be 150 feet apart.

I’m curious how others have been visualizing this. Why do they go up separate staircases from the 1st to the 2nd floor? When and where did the “I’m going back to my classroom, Mom” conversation occur? On the 1st floor before heading to opposite stairways?

Just trying to figure it out.

Interesting questions. In your #2 scenerion, that means that TH left as Kyron was approaching her. That is strange. Isn't that the stairwell that leads to an exterior door?

 

[miakelly]

I know. That's why the reverse seems more plausible to me at this point...that TH was on the West end and Kyron was on the East end walking toward both her and the classroom. I had just never visualized it that way in the beginning, with her being right next to the classroom and Kyron way on the East end, having come up opposite stairs.

Okay - I am completely with you on this!
So she was right by his classroom, but she says she watched him walk 150 TO class, so did she watch him walk toward her and then just before he got to class, she turned around and went down the stairs, then he goes missing at that point? What happened in that hallway? When did KH tell his friend that he was going to see a the electric display? I thought I read it was just before 9:00.

So he said to TH "BYE Mom, I'm going to class" then a couple minutes later he tells his friend he's going to see a display downstairs.....if this is true, what made Kyron decide to go downstairs? Based on his parents description of him, he is timid, shy, does what he is told.......doesn't strike me as the type of kid to decide on a whim to go back downstairs to check something out on his own.

 

[Lavender]

Interesting questions. In your #2 scenerion, that means that TH left as Kyron was approaching her. That is strange. Isn't that the stairwell that leads to an exterior door?

Yes, in #2 scenario it places her at Kyron's classroom with Kyron walking toward her from the other end of the hall. That was a new "visual" for me. Based on the diagrams and pictures, those stairs do lead down toward an exterior door.

 

[Chili Fries]

I don't believe there are stairs going from the first to the second floor at the east entrance (the parking lot entrance). Those stairs only go down up to the second floor from the parking lot.

It looks to me there are three sets of stairs going from the first to the second floor:

- The stairs on the west side by Kyron's classroom.

- The stairs at the front of the school main entrance.

- The stairs that go from the music room/cafeteria area on the first floor to the gym on the second floor.

You can look at the floor plans RubyRed provided here:

http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t166/ubrmel/KYRON/Maps%20KYRON/

 

[Lavender]

Okay - I am completely with you on this!
So she was right by his classroom, but she says she watched him walk 150 TO class, so did she watch him walk toward her and then just before he got to class, she turned around and went down the stairs, then he goes missing at that point? What happened in that hallway? When did KH tell his friend that he was going to see a the electric display? I thought I read it was just before 9:00.

So he said to TH "BYE Mom, I'm going to class" then a couple minutes later he tells his friend he's going to see a display downstairs.....if this is true, what made Kyron decide to go downstairs? Based on his parents description of him, he is timid, shy, does what he is told.......doesn't strike me as the type of kid to decide on a whim to go back downstairs to check something out on his own.

BBM

The "Bye, Mom" is the part I can't get to fit. Once they each got to the top of their respective staircases, I don't think they spoke to each other at all. It sounds like she saw him at the other end of the hall (the East side, I'm now guessing), watched him walk toward her on the West side and then left via the West stairs. So the "Bye, Mom" conversation would have had to happen on the 1st floor prior to them both heading toward opposite staircases. Does that make sense? Or how to you see it?

 

[Lavender]

I don't believe there are stairs going from the first to the second floor at the east entrance (the parking lot entrance). Those stairs only go down up to the second floor from the parking lot.

It looks to me there are three sets of stairs going from the first to the second floor:

- The stairs on the west side by Kyron's classroom.

- The stairs at the front of the school main entrance.

- The stairs that go from the music room/cafeteria area on the first floor to the gym on the second floor.

You can look at the floor plans RubyRed provided here:

http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t166/ubrmel/KYRON/Maps%20KYRON/

On the floor plan, I see interior stairs on the East end of the hall near classroom 201. Is that not right? What are the two sets of stairs you think Lt. Lindstrand was referring to?

 

[Chili Fries]

Here you can see the 3 sets of stairs that go from the first floor (basement) to the second (main) floor. I've circled the stairs in red: