Dylan Redwine Case Discussion Thread/Dylan's Remains Found, #2

[jjenny]

That makes sense as did they not found some of his shoulder blade and a few other bones . I think they needed the skull intact as I think a blow to the head may of killed him (IMO)

I wonder why they stopped searching. Surely the skull is somewhere.

 

[jjenny]

We have had lots of cell ping/towers talk, but I cannot remember all of it. Could Dylan's phone have been ON and UNUSED and disposed of with him , and a day or 2 later ran out of battery and went silent? By the time they track its pings was a bit later and by then the phone might have been moved by someone or by weather or animals and was no longer where it last PINGED but close enough to the area to know it was where the phone should NOT have ever been? They said Dylan's last communication was on Sunday night but IIRC it was never said his phone never made another PING after that . Am I forgetting something important here? tks

LE said all activity on the phone stopped sometime Sunday. So I don't think the phone was pinging anywhere after that time.

 

[prd2bokie]

Not sure of the rules about other sites but I read on another site that maybe a trail camera belonging to a hunter had given police some information. It wasn't stated as fact. It was just something to think about.

 

[gitana1]

I think I do understand what MR was trying to say with regards to the area that he and Brandon were sent to hand out flyers. He is trying to say that the road they were sent on runs up the east side of the mountain. It's not Middle Mountain Rd he's referring to. He's trying to say that in order to get to that area, you'd have to go all the way to Bayfield and then go up that road.

It seemed to me for many weeks in the beginning that MR was trying to indicate that it was his belief that Dylan left the home of his own accord either to go fishing or hiking. Even he knew it would be highly unlikely that he wandered into danger by walking all the way to Bayfield and then onto a road that runs up the east side of the mountain. MR seemed to feel that searching areas that were within range to walk or hike were more likely. Like the lake and the area behind his house. Almost like he was trying to deflect from the possibility of him being anywhere somewhat local that still would require him to have been taken there with a vehicle.

When he did finally start coming around to the possibility that Dylan was taken somewhere by vehicle, because dogs couldn't seem to scent him anywhere close by, he seemed to want to deflect that possibility to him being taken somewhere far from Vallecito.

Interesting.

MOO

Thank you. Now it makes sense to me!

This is my first post, although I've been following various cases on WS for years. I just wanted to share a couple thoughts. I live in a community close to where Jessica Ridgeway disappeared and was subsequently found, and during that time there were all kinds of community meetings with LE and other authorities warning us to keep a close watch on our children. We received many notices from schools and the police about a dangerous, unidentified predator who undoubtedly lived and worked locally and could strike again at any time. It was a frightening time. As far as I know, these types of meetings and warnings did not take place when DR disappeared and are not taking place now. If that is the case, it seems to me LE does not believe other children are in danger, despite the fact that we now know the perp is almost certainly local (based on where DR was found).

I also sadly noted today names of some of the streets around MRs home: Hope Road, Faith Lane, Happy Place, Trust Drive, Loyal Place, and Kind Place.

What an excellent and poignant first post. Welcome!!!!

FYI, re any public danger from a possible perp

Initial press conference by Sheriff

La Plata County Sheriff on Redwine. 9NEWS.com. 06/27/13.
http://www.9news.com/video/default.aspx?bctid=2513818990001

I wanted to quote this so I could always locate it. It's an important bit of information.

Horrid example, but there was no COD for Caylee either.
:moo:

Not a great example, unfortunately, since many believe casey wasn't found guilty because the jury didn't know exactly how she died. (I thought it was well-proved, however). But...

I don't think they had a COD for Lacy Peterson. Am I remembering correctly?

This is a great example because you are right. And the monster is on death row now. So have heart friends!! http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=90600&page=1#.UdIdbdineHQ

I'm hoping LE has a red herring or two up their sleeve !

Ack! A red herring kind of means a dead end!!

Don't those No Body cases generally have something else though, like a scene of a crime? This case doesn't seem to have anything - no scene, no weapon, now no COD. Seems like you'd need to have at least one of these to come up with a theory of a crime.

Now, wrongful death civil suit, that would be something else with a different set of criteria.

I believe there is definitely a crime scene in this case. What was confiscated from the home during the search warrant indicates that to me. i think blood evidence was found.

Listen, there is no statute of limitations on murder cases. It looks to me clear that they had a pretty direct line to the general location of the remains but couldn't pinpoint them before the snows got too heavy. They bided there time until the snows melted.

I agree with Katydid. I think an arrest is likely imminent.

Gitana1, this is a great post.

However, if MR is guilty, none of these factors can convict him in a court of law, I don't think. Isn't all of this considered circumstantial? Unless there is some evidence that LE physically has now which they are not revealing (which I think is highly possible), then IMO not one of these 17 points includes anything concrete which can directly and certainly link MR to Dylan's death.

*I would say #1 is one of the strongest points.

Well, circumstantial evidence is pretty confusing. Basically, almost every case that goes to trial is built on circumstantial evidence. The exceptions are capacity and insanity cases like the monster out of Colorado who murdered eveyrone at the theater, and the creeps out of Utah who kidnapped Elizabeth Smart.

Circumstantial evidence technically includes blood evidence, DNA, finger prints, etc. This is as opposed to direct evidence which would be a victim or witness who experienced the crime, for example. Most people don;t know that. Even lawyers get it wrong.

But when we hear about a "purely circumstantial case" that usually means without much physical evidence. Those cases do occur with some regularity though and can be successfully prosecuted, although as we have seen, it can be difficult.

Out of the 17 points I listed, several are evidence that can be used to help convict MR if he is guilty. I will bold those:

1. Dad with a history of a volatile temper, abductions of his own kids or violations of child custody orders, domestic violence.
2. A bitter and long divorce case that culminated in the missing child speaking in chambers with the judge about a month before he disappeared, that talk resulting in essentially no communication until the visit during which he disappeared.
3. A kid who did not want to go to his dad's at all.
4. A kid who was a crazy, voracious texter, who suddenly stopped all texting at 9:37 p.m. the night he arrived at his dad's, even though his regular bedtime was between 11:00 p.m. and midnight.
5. A dad who did not contact LE until several hours after he returned home from a morning errand and noticed his newly arrived child was not home. Oh, also, he took a nap before contacting the police.
6. A dad who refused to speak with the mother after Dylan went missing, for months. He notified her by text that Dylan was missing.
7. A dad who reportedly failed his LE polygraph "miserably".
8. A dad who squirmed out of a taking a second one sponsored by the Dr. Phil show.
9. The child went missing in a remote area where not many people live.
10. No credible sighting of Dylan after he arrived at his dad's has been established.
11.A dad who refused to participate in most search efforts or efforts to find Dylan.
12. A dad who has seemed very flat emotionally and concentrating mostly on bolstering his own character or story and bashing the mother, rather than expressing fear or grief about Dylan and who never took responsibility for the fact or expressing remorse that Dylan disappeared in his custody. This is in contrast to a panicky and tearful mother who has been relentless in her efforts to locate her son.
13. A second son who believes the father could have harmed Dylan.
14. Another ex-wife who believes the father could have harmed Dylan.
15. A dad who casually remarked about the condition of his little boy's remains, on the very day it was revealed that the body had been found.
16. A statement by LE that the community has nothing to fear.
17. Zero evidence that LE chose a suspect and forced the evidence to fit.

Some of them would be on the cusp and could be disallowed depending on whatever motions are filed. The worst offender out of the ones I bolded, in that regard, would be number one actually, because prior bad acts cannot be used to prove a person committed the crime they are charged with. But there are exceptions. A lot of the rest of the bolded items would be evidence of consciousness of guilt and definitely have a good chance of coming into evidence.

I think that LE has much more though. I have a strong suspicion they have physical evidence at the home and cell phone evidence. We will see. :moo:

This is very old news, from the start of the investigation, but interesting to note nonetheless:

"The Task Force is asking the general public if they have any recreational video footage that includes vehicles traveling on main routes between Durango and Vallecito Lake, taken between 6:00 p.m. on Sunday, November 18 through noon on Monday November 19, to call dispatch at (970) 385-2900 to make an arrangements to get a copy of the footage to the Task Force."

http://www.pinerivertimes.com/news.asp?artid=1095

Dylan was reportedly last seen by his father at 7:30 AM on Monday, but they wanted film of any traffic as far back as 6PM the previous evening. Hopefully they got some good footage.

To me, everything together indicates they have a prime suspect, are certain about their case and have been pushing him hard. They dragged him up the mountain to the dump site to work on his guilt. They showed him photos of the tragic, little bones. They didn't do this with Elaine. They are working him hard, IMO.

I think they'll likely be pushing him even more tomorrow, just pushing and pushing and trying for a confession. Because that would really help their case.

And if he did it, I hope he does the right thing by letting it go and confessing. He will never have peace in his heart unless he does. He will have to answer to God, if he did this, for the death and disposal of his little boy. But if he comes clean, he can begin the process of washing clean his heart - not to get all religious on everyone. But if he is involved, he needs to do this not just for everyone who loved Dylan, not just for justice, but also for himself. Otherwise, all his years as a father, all his years fighting for Dylan will be meaningless.

 

[Foxfire]

O/T and unrelated - can someone please start a thread for this boy?
http://www.9news.com/news/article/343061/339/10-year-old-boy-missing-from-Highlands-Ranch

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community > Missing!! > Located Forum Discussion
Found Safe CO - James Thomas, 10 yrs old, Highlands Ranch, 1 July 2013

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214104&highlight=James+Thomas

 

[gitana1]

We have had lots of cell ping/towers talk, but I cannot remember all of it. Could Dylan's phone have been ON and UNUSED and disposed of with him , and a day or 2 later ran out of battery and went silent? By the time they track its pings was a bit later and by then the phone might have been moved by someone or by weather or animals and was no longer where it last PINGED but close enough to the area to know it was where the phone should NOT have ever been? They said Dylan's last communication was on Sunday night but IIRC it was never said his phone never made another PING after that . Am I forgetting something important here? tks

Very smart thinking, Schmae.

I was just reminded of Scott Peterson driving to the bay in which Lacy's body was eventually found. Was it you or someone else who suggested that LE may have put a tracker on MR's truck when they took it in for searching. Who knows....

Also, don't some vehicles have "black boxes" that record data??

He definitely had a tracker on his truck. (scott peterson). he said he located it but could not remove it. That's in his sister Anne Bird's book.

 

[ColdHands]

Not sure of the rules about other sites but I read on another site that maybe a trail camera belonging to a hunter had given police some information. It wasn't stated as fact. It was just something to think about.

I've actually been thinking about that since yesterday - I found an article that said there were (at one time) wildlife cameras up at the gate by Tuckerville - had caught ATV's on camera.

In 2010, a wildlife camera recorded 10 ATVs driving past this closure sign, with a camper in a pickup camped just past the same sign.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/sanjuan/news-events/?cid=STELPRDB5328307

My understanding is that Tuckerville (basically a ghost mining abandoned town) is 12 miles up Middle Mountain Road and the place the remains were found was half that distance.

 

[caffeinejean]

In regards to whether Dylan's phone could have been pinged later, the only reference that I've seen mentioned was from MR himself. If I understand correctly, he is saying the cell phone went to the music prompt or voice mail for days.

TRICIA's TRUE CRIME RADIO - http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleu...t-8-pm-eastern

Sunday, June 9, 2013
Tricia Griffith

Snipped for space
78:35
TG:
Mmm hmm…and so…now you think he’s gone fishing. When did you start…uh…? First of all, did Dylan have…Dylan had a… you assume Dylan had his phone with him because it wasn’t home… he didn’t… it wasn’t anywhere, correct?

78:52
MR:
Well, absolutely, and I had been trying to communicate with him, you know

78:53
TG:
You had been trying to call him?

78:55
MR:
I tried to call and text message him while I was in the Durango area before I came home to see if there was anything that he needed or….you know, maybe talk to him and get some more concrete idea of what we might be doing being I was in town and I’m 45 minutes away, that it’s…you know, if we’re going to have Thanksgiving at the house here, then I want to be able to get a turkey a couple of days in advance and that kind of thing so, you know, there was a need for me to try to communicate to him while I was…before I came home from returning my errands

79:28
TG:
Did it go straight to voice mail or did…were you able to hear it ring and then leave a message?

79:33
MR:
No. It always…it always says, and he has Verizon cell phone service, and it always says

79:38
TG: (interrupts)
Mmm hmm.

79:38
MR:
something like, “Please listen to the music while your party

79:42
TG: (interrupts)
Okay.

79:42
MR:
is trying to be

79:43
TG: (interrupts)
is being reached…

79:43
MR:
reached. Or something along…yeah.

79:45
TG:
Okay.

79:47
MR:
and it was like that for days.

 

[Ronso]

If it rang for days, they would have pings on that phone...because it means the phone was turned on.

 

[SCHMAE]

In regards to whether Dylan's phone could have been pinged later, the only reference that I've seen mentioned was from MR himself. If I understand correctly, he is saying the cell phone went to the music prompt or voice mail for days.

TRICIA's TRUE CRIME RADIO - http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleu...t-8-pm-eastern

Sunday, June 9, 2013
Tricia Griffith

Snipped for space
78:35
TG:
Mmm hmm…and so…now you think he’s gone fishing. When did you start…uh…? First of all, did Dylan have…Dylan had a… you assume Dylan had his phone with him because it wasn’t home… he didn’t… it wasn’t anywhere, correct?

78:52
MR:
Well, absolutely, and I had been trying to communicate with him, you know

78:53
TG:
You had been trying to call him?

78:55
MR:
I tried to call and text message him while I was in the Durango area before I came home to see if there was anything that he needed or….you know, maybe talk to him and get some more concrete idea of what we might be doing being I was in town and I’m 45 minutes away, that it’s…you know, if we’re going to have Thanksgiving at the house here, then I want to be able to get a turkey a couple of days in advance and that kind of thing so, you know, there was a need for me to try to communicate to him while I was…before I came home from returning my errands

79:28
TG:
Did it go straight to voice mail or did…were you able to hear it ring and then leave a message?

79:33
MR:
No. It always…it always says, and he has Verizon cell phone service, and it always says

79:38
TG: (interrupts)
Mmm hmm.

79:38
MR:
something like, “Please listen to the music while your party

79:42
TG: (interrupts)
Okay.

79:42
MR:
is trying to be

79:43
TG: (interrupts)
is being reached…

79:43
MR:
reached. Or something along…yeah.

79:45
TG:
Okay.

79:47
MR:
and it was like that for days.

Awesome ! This is great news and I never heard it before . This means the phone could still PING wherever it was and probably near or with Dylan during the days that it was still ' on' . WOW ! TYVM

 

[paris_paris]

Couple things... I always just randomly post...

If Dylan's phone was pinging for days, wouldn't LE have been looking in the area of those pings? I mean... they would have been trying to ping his phone wouldn't they?

I believe LE found something on the mountain that nobody has been told about.

I don't believe this has been ruled homicide simply because Dylan shouldn't have been on the mountain. I think it relates to my 2nd point.

 

[SammyIam]

The new story....

http://www.9news.com/news/article/343074/222/Redwine-death-will-likely-remain-undetermined

KUSA - The La Plata County coroner says it is unlikely a cause of death will be determined in the Dylan Redwine case. Coroner Jann Smith says she will probably have to rule the cause and manner of death as "undetermined."

The remains of Dylan are still at a Colorado Bureau of Investigations lab, and they may be examined by both the coroner and an anthropologist before an autopsy report is completed.


I am even more sad and disheartened. I hated to read this.

BBM.
Is there any way the family could hire Dr. Bass from UT Knoxville to determine the manner and cause of death?

 

[jjenny]

In regards to whether Dylan's phone could have been pinged later, the only reference that I've seen mentioned was from MR himself. If I understand correctly, he is saying the cell phone went to the music prompt or voice mail for days.




Awesome ! This is great news and I never heard it before . This means the phone could still PING wherever it was and probably near or with Dylan during the days that it was still ' on' . WOW ! TYVM

It wasn't on. There was no activity on it since Sunday evening. I am not sure what MR was trying to say there, but it sounds like the phone was trying to be reached. But was never reached.

 

[caffeinejean]

If it rang for days, they would have pings on that phone...because it means the phone was turned on.

In regards to whether Dylan's phone could have been pinged later, the only reference that I've seen mentioned was from MR himself. If I understand correctly, he is saying the cell phone went to the music prompt or voice mail for days.




Awesome ! This is great news and I never heard it before . This means the phone could still PING wherever it was and probably near or with Dylan during the days that it was still ' on' . WOW ! TYVM

But then you have to ponder where it was.... in the house, where they cordoned off the lake, or on Middle Mountain Road, or anywhere? And was it with the backpack?

 

[jjenny]

BBM.
Is there any way the family could hire Dr. Bass from UT Knoxville to determine the manner and cause of death?

With only a few bones found, nobody can determine cause of death.

 

[Pensfan]

Are there any locals on this thread tonight? Is so, is there current "activity" at Mark's house? lease: (I just read something on another site. It might be very inaccurate, so I'm not posting it.)

 

[cluciano63]

Are there any locals on this thread tonight? Is so, is there current "activity" at Mark's house? lease: (I just read something on another site. It might be very inaccurate, so I'm not posting it.)

Hmm...I had seen something about the Tuesday LE meeting on another site before it showed up here...so could be true.

 

[Confusion]

Couple things... I always just randomly post...

If Dylan's phone was pinging for days, wouldn't LE have been looking in the area of those pings? I mean... they would have been trying to ping his phone wouldn't they?

I believe LE found something on the mountain that nobody has been told about.

I don't believe this has been ruled homicide simply because Dylan shouldn't have been on the mountain. I think it relates to my 2nd point.

I think that the biggest problem is the lack of cell towers in the area. In order to triangulate the signal, you need 3 towers, but there aren't 3 close enough to the area to be used. Without triangulation (or GPS, which his phone didn't have), the pings can tell that the phone is north of a tower, south of one and west of another, etc., but can't tell how far north/south/east/west of a tower it is. I believe they would have known that he was in the general area, but couldn't pinpoint it any closer than within a few miles. MOO

 

[jjenny]

I think it's a safe bet that Dylan's phone was not pinging anywhere, let alone Middle Mountain Road. If it was pinging from there, that would be a first place LE would have searched. It took them quite some time to start searching there.

 

[Confusion]

I think it's a safe bet that Dylan's phone was not pinging anywhere, let alone Middle Mountain Road. If it was pinging from there, that would be a first place LE would have searched. It took them quite some time to start searching there.

I believe you forgot to state that was your opinion. My educated guess is that the phone was probably on or it would have gone directly to e-mail. I already explained why the pings wouldn't lead them directly to the phone - in my opinion.