Egypt Air flight 804 missing, 19 May 2016

[K_Z]

One of the things I've been reading is that this route is typically done using a 737-- which is why there was some confusion on the flight tracking boards last evening. The route matrix is "pre loaded" with the 737.

I agree that the particular route that this flight took, which was 5 legs, including Tunisia, Cairo, Eritrea, makes me think strongly of terrorism, and the abrupt disappearance at altitude reinforces this. You have to seriously wonder what an equipment swap for another type of aircraft adds to the worries about terrorism. What caused the swap of equipment? When was the decision made? Where did the swap occur? Makes sense to me that a different AC and FO would be flying the Airbus A370, than would have done the route with the usual 737. Perhaps there were even 2-3 crew swaps during the 5 legs, depending on the length of the crew duty day for each crew member, where they started, etc.

The bobbing motions with abrupt turns to the right and left that are being reported, if true, actually increase my thoughts about the possibility of terrorism, IMO, as in a catastrophic decompression with missing portions of the tail. I'm doubtful that any kind of missile would have gone completely undetected by the huge amount of monitoring in this part of the world. So I'm leaning toward a bomb.

Any mechanical problems and at least one of the pilots would have started hitting alarms that would have been picked up, as they tried to gain control-- and for sure the pilots would have radioed a mayday if the cockpit was at all intact, and they were conscious.

 

[K_Z]

How can they have not found this plane yet? It is the Mediterranean Sea, full of ships, satellite coverage and radar not some huge ocean.

Bed time here in Australia, hoping I wake to find the plane ditched safely and all crew and passengers are safe on some tiny uninhabited rock, but unfortunately I doubt it. RIP MS 804 and here's hoping for a quick resolution.

Agree. How could there not be any debris found yet??

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Agree. How could there not be any debris found yet??

It sounds like they have. Two floating objects have been reported about 50m south of Karparthos.

 

[Dr. Know?]

Sky News NewsdeskVerified account ‏@SkyNewsBreak 1m1 minute ago
Reuters: Greek authorities searching for #EgyptAir #MS804 have spotted 2 floating objects 50 miles southeast of area where plane disappeared

https://twitter.com/SkyNewsBreak

 

[Dr. Know?]

Not sure if this was posted or not. Just woke up an hour ago.

[video=twitter;733207063388553216]https://twitter.com/7NewsSydney/status/733207063388553216[/video]

 

[Dr. Know?]

[video=twitter;733279976779350016]https://twitter.com/RT_com/status/733279976779350016[/video]

RTVerified account ‏@RT_com 4m4 minutes ago
URGENT: Terror attack possibility higher than technical failure, but let’s wait for facts – Aviation Minister http://on.rt.com/7d20 #MS804

 

[K_Z]

I'm no expert of course, but the movements described (a violent turn to the left, a huge fall in altitude and then a violent turn to the right) sounds like the loss of the rudder. Whether that would be a mechanical failure possibly due to poor maintenance or the result of an explosion, well it could be either.

From what I've seen, European aviation bods seem to be happy with the standards of Egyptair's maintenance of its aircraft. If they weren't, it wouldn't be flying into or out of Europe.

Remember also that the A320 is not a traditional "fly by wire" plane. It's a digital fly by wire. (No actual cables.)

Overall safety is increased with the use of fly-by-wire, which provides direct input through electrical signals for more precise commands. In addition, the control system monitors pilot commands to ensure the aircraft is kept within a safety margin called the “flight protection envelope.” As a result, pilots always can get the maximum performance out of Airbus aircraft without running the risk of exceeding these limits.

The use of fly-by-wire technology provides a number of operational advantages for Airbus aircraft, including higher precision during flight and lower maintenance costs.

The weight savings from the replacement of heavy mechanical control cables provides a significant reduction in fuel consumption. As electrical controls are less complex and easier to maintain than mechanical ones, the use of fly-by-wire also translates to lower maintenance costs for operators.

http://www.airbus.com/innovation/proven-concepts/in-operations/fly-by-wire/

 

[CARIIS]

Boy I tell ya guys, the term talking head, during aviation coverage becomes literal. One would think , that in light of the last 12 months some "notions" about how "fight" works and that some of that "data" would be be retained. Supposedly repetition increase "learning"!


Media being informed there were erratic movements in direction and altitudes. They then ask what does that mean. I mean really , if a TV personalty was told that the car crossed the medium and went into an opposing lane. No air personality would feel the need to ask ,what do you think that means?


In both, it clearly indicates a loss of control. I am confident , everyone here , never needed an expert explaining that a plane plummeting is not under the pilots control, and is somewhat problematic.


"Why," sure that is the question.


I assume media fly rather often, have any of them been an aircraft (making this up ) dropping from the sky 2 miles in 47 seconds? Yet they ask is that normal? I could understand that on the space shuttle, some of these questions are logical!


They remain befuddled with "mayday". That in reality is from the propeller reality aircraft decades ago. Piston aircraft fly l slower, affording pilots (especially in the movies!) more time to be a hero, with riveting music in the background!


In the jet age stuff happens much much faster, pilot in jets are responding to many more events.. There are more alarms to address, more data to obtain.It would be the equivalent IMO in this day and age , when a car is spinning to ask why 911 was not called during the accident sequence.!


Jets are designed to do everything fast.r. A prop plane could not do a lot of the stuff (In terms of turning. spiraling. descending) this generation aircraft just, in reality , cant do that slow. Jets are designed to slither through the sky, effortlessly. The props were clunky being pulled through air as opposed to be pushed.


If a car was going 45 mph or 90 mph things would different- its a logical conclusion that same applies in aviation!!


Being an aviation enthusiast, it sure, for some reason, appears that these days it is taking longer to "locate" the debris field, which is counter intuitive in terms of technology. no?


Maybe that is because decades Cronkite would interrupt with a special report and then programming continues until something is really known?


But honestly in all the accidents I have intently followed, locating the scene was the easiest part of the process!


The only real question IMO, is what initiated a loss of control event. Those options are actually limited as well. Aircraft malfunction, weather, human error, or a bomb.

And finally, upon awakening to hear that they are still reporting a plane is missing as oppossed to having ceased flying through the air, is moronic, fuel, end of that story. Media job is to report news. ANy person with a common sense is not thinking we have a jet "missing".

That kinda like seeing smoke off in the distance, and the media saying we think there may be a fire invoved, but are awating confirmation! Wth....................................

They are so often wrong on things they should be waiting for confirmation for - this aint one of em.

God the media gets scarier and scarier IMO!!

TY

O/T media "reporting" that Paris attack was " unlawful killing" again, what a stupid news event. Oh, I am sorry maybe someone thought it was a lawful one jeezzzzzzzzz

 

[Bravo]

David Soucie per CNN- (not verbatim) He stated he is the last to conclude so early in this is terrorism but agrees the facts indicate it is. Dear Gawd!!!!!

 

[K_Z]

Wow--actual footage of the "ball of fire" seen by Greek civilians. That needs a lot more interpretation/ explaining.

 

[wendybtn]

Fox News on TV is reporting an Egyptian official states it is likely terrorism. I am also hearing and reading that on other websites and TV news channels.

 

[Dr. Know?]

Steve HermanVerified account ‏@W7VOA 43s43 seconds ago
Reports — attributed to #Greece officials— of two large objects seen floating in Mediterranean 80km SE of last known #MS804 position.

https://twitter.com/W7VOA

 

[Bravo]

If the reports of ball of fire are fact I would have to go with a bomb. Given erratic pattern of the plane as well. IMO

 

[Dr. Know?]

Phoebe Lanzer Wood ‏@PhoebeLondon 2m2 minutes ago
#Breaking: Reports that Islamic State Group has claimed responsibility for downed #EgyptAirMS804 plane. #MS804

https://twitter.com/PhoebeLondon

 

[MelmothTheLost]

If this is a terrorist incident, it really does look like an on-board bomb rather than a missile. Current maps suggest that the plane came down in Greek waters rather than closer to the Egyptian coast.

 

[Dr. Know?]

I think the tweet with two bodies found was possibly incorrect. Probably two pieces of the plane found. jmo

 

[CARIIS]

Hi Bravo!

Nice to "see" you!

 

[Dr. Know?]

Link to World News live blog.

http://live.reuters.com/Event/World_News

Greece finds pieces of plastic in sea search for missing EgyptAir plane

A Greek frigate searching for a missing EgyptAir aircraft discovered two large floating objects in a sea area 230 miles south of the island of Crete on Thursday, Greek defence sources said.

The objects appeared to be pieces of plastic in white and red. They were spotted close to an area where a transponder signal was emitted earlier, the sources said.

Greek state TV ERT reported similar information, saying two "orange-coloured" objects were located in the same area.

The EgyptAir flight from Paris to Cairo dropped off radar screens shortly after leaving Greek airspace and minutes after entering Egyptian airspace.

 

[JLSChook]

[video=twitter;733286860252925952]https://twitter.com/CBSNLive/status/733286860252925952[/video]

 

[Dr. Know?]

Ticks me off when they put this stuff out during a tragedy.

Alan O'RiordanVerified account
‏@StoryfulAlan Alan O'Riordan Retweeted 7 News Sydney
Purported #EgyptAir video is from last year. Debunked by the great @rkennedy228 of @Storyful #dailydebunk #MS804