Emmys will edit Kathy Griffin’s offensive speech

[Nova]

LOL Jeana! I have to say that it was disrespectful for Kathy Griffin to say that no matter what religion you follow. Chances are that you would offend at least 1 person in making a statement like that. Is it ok to makes some of the people laugh while offending others? Before you answer "yes", remember most comedians poke fun at others expense.

Not only is it okay, gman, it is virtually impossible to do otherwise. Every laugh is at somebody's expense.

What we can do is distinguish between easy, cheap targets and clever ones. Mocking excessive displays of faith is a worthy target, but I agree Griffin went about mocking those displays in a cheap way.

We might compare this episode with Bette Midler's famous Oscar presentation speech in the 1980s. Midler managed to ridicule the pompous nature of the entire event and every participant without resorting to silly remarks.

 

[IdahoMom]

Not only is it okay, gman, it is virtually impossible to do otherwise. Every laugh is at somebody's expense.

Steven Wright (love him) is/was pretty good at making it not about other people, but I think that would be tough to do. I think it would be hard to do comedy that doesn't offend someone. That said, some people are better at offending the masses than others!

Steven Wright: http://youtube.com/watch?v=KnxB6fEyHAk&mode=related&search=

 

[sherri79]

Yes, there is a world of difference between attacking an historically powerful group (American white males, say) versus attacking an historically disadvantaged group such as blacks or gays. It's the difference between a satirist and a bully. It's only unfair when you take both actions out of historical context; IN context, if white males take a little ribbing, it doesn't even begin to offset their many advantages.

I don't believe Griffin was attacking Christians per se. She was raised in the church and most of her family are presumably Christian.

I think she was mocking lavish shows of faith in inappropriate settings. Even Jesus himself mocked that, IIRC.

Would I have made the same choice? No. I don't mind admitting the "Jesus" phrase she employed doesn't sit very well with me. I'm not offended, exactly, but I do find it offputting. And I find it witless, which is a worse sin in my book.

But where is it written that everyone's unprovable, magical thinking must be treated reverently by non-believers? Don't get me wrong: I have my own faith in God and other ideas that can't be verified scientifically. But I don't get bent out of shape that the rest of the world neither agrees nor treats my beliefs as specially precious.

then we have to disagree. i would think attacking anyone because of race is racism. i dont buy the excuse "you started it" when my kids act badly and i wont buy it from adults.

i agree she was not aiming her insult at Christians. she was aiming it at Jesus. i dont care that she felt the need to say god did not get her here. if she felt god was owed no thanks dont give him any. if she felt the need to say it was not god to point out her hard work fine by me. if she wanted to express a difference between her and those that thank god fine. suck it went to far. at that point it was crude, vulgar, and disrespectful to all of those that feel this man came to earth to die for them. many Christians see Jesus as a hero who died for them and feel as strongly about this as most would if she had said "suck it troops and vets".

where is it written that just because you dont believe it is funny to insult the faith of those that do? what is so bad about saying you should show respect for deep held beliefs even if you dont agree with them if nobody is hurt?

 

[Paladin]

First off, Nova, great posts.

Secondly, when did the American public in general become such crybabies about being offended or their feelings being hurt?

For a country that heralds its free speech rights it sure makes us look like a bunch of hypocrites when we publicly chastise someone for putting them to use.

 

[Nova]

Steven Wright (love him) is/was pretty good at making it not about other people, but I think that would be tough to do. I think it would be hard to do comedy that doesn't offend someone. That said, some people are better at offending the masses than others!

Steven Wright: http://youtube.com/watch?v=KnxB6fEyHAk&mode=related&search=

Good contrasting example, IM. Certainly Wright's low-key style makes his remarks seem less abrasive.

But let's face it: Steven Wright's entire act is a humorous portrayal of clinical depression. I'm not offended, but some people would say mental illness is not a fit subject for comedy.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

First off, Nova, great posts.

Secondly, when did the American public in general become such crybabies about being offended or their feelings being hurt?

For a country that heralds its free speech rights it sure makes us look like a bunch of hypocrites when we publicly chastise someone for putting them to use.

Are you joking?? America has become so politically correct that I'm afraid to say anything at all.:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:

 

[sherri79]

First off, Nova, great posts.

Secondly, when did the American public in general become such crybabies about being offended or their feelings being hurt?

For a country that heralds its free speech rights it sure makes us look like a bunch of hypocrites when we publicly chastise someone for putting them to use.

pesky thing about free speech is it works both ways. i'm not the government. i can say i think she should shut up and it is just using my own rights.

 

[IdahoMom]

Good contrasting example, IM. Certainly Wright's low-key style makes his remarks seem less abrasive.

But let's face it: Steven Wright's entire act is a humorous portrayal of clinical depression. I'm not offended, but some people would say mental illness is not a fit subject for comedy.

Wow! I've never looked at it that way before. :waitasec: Interesting. I thought he was just a deadpan, eccentric dude.

 

[sherri79]

Are you joking?? America has become so politically correct that I'm afraid to say anything at all.:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:

yeah but it seems Christians are different cuz there are alot of them. it is not politically incorrect to insult them.

 

[Nova]

then we have to disagree. i would think attacking anyone because of race is racism. i dont buy the excuse "you started it" when my kids act badly and i wont buy it from adults.

i agree she was not aiming her insult at Christians. she was aiming it at Jesus. i dont care that she felt the need to say god did not get her here. if she felt god was owed no thanks dont give him any. if she felt the need to say it was not god to point out her hard work fine by me. if she wanted to express a difference between her and those that thank god fine. suck it went to far. at that point it was crude, vulgar, and disrespectful to all of those that feel this man came to earth to die for them. many Christians see Jesus as a hero who died for them and feel as strongly about this as most would if she had said "suck it troops and vets".

where is it written that just because you dont believe it is funny to insult the faith of those that do? what is so bad about saying you should show respect for deep held beliefs even if you dont agree with them if nobody is hurt?

She wasn't insulting Jesus or even addressing Him. I don't know all of Griffin's specific beliefs, but I promise you she agrees with me that Jesus has better things to do than interfere in awards shows. She was making fun of people who are so narcissistic they think Jesus takes a personal interest in their winning a gold-plated statue.

Frankly, I find the notion that God plays favorites in sports and competitions rather offensive. I think it's a diminished and undignified view of our Creator. But I don't expect people to stop thanking God for their People's Choice Awards, just because I find petty the concept of His involvement there.

Turning the question back on me doesn't answer it. Why is anyone required to act reverently before anyone else's magical beliefs? If we have to revere Jesus, why not the Easter Bunny? You and I don't think they are the same, but some people do. What about respecting those people's beliefs?

The "required" reverence never ends, you see, unless we all sit alone in our rooms with our heads forever bowed out of respect for every thing everyone imagines.

 

[Nova]

pesky thing about free speech is it works both ways. i'm not the government. i can say i think she should shut up and it is just using my own rights.

You absolutely can and have every right to do so.

 

[Paladin]

Are you joking?? America has become so politically correct that I'm afraid to say anything at all.:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:

Whoooo boy Jeana don't get me started on the political correctness crap. I can practically pinpoint when all of it started, and it was during the whole fiasco between Anita Hill and Clarence Thomas.

Addressing the whole sexual harrassment issue was very important, but with it was ushered in a bunch of other crap that we talk about here on a daily basis. I guess you have to take the good with the bad.

It seems today that American's are so thin-skinned when it comes to speaking our minds. It's hard not to find a person or group that is offended by something someone says, and it just goes to show what a bunch of children we've become.

I think people should stop and think about whether they really are offended or not. Are they offended because their feelings truly were hurt, or are they offended because they are expected to be hurt?

Take the whole Imus thing for example. I'm pretty sure if someone didn't point out what he said to those Rutger's girls that they probably would have gone on living their lives just fine, but the media made such a big deal out of it the girls were probably just like "hey, maybe my feelings ARE hurt." I can't believe they could honestly care what an old fart like Imus would say about them, especially since I bet a million dollars that not a single one of them have ever listened to his show, let alone heard about him.

So the same goes for Kathy Griffin in my eyes. At the end of the day are you going to let some wiry red-head with a skewed sense of humor get the best of you? It's your power as a consumer to boycott her or change the channel or station if you don't like what she has to say.

 

[Nova]

yeah but it seems Christians are different cuz there are alot of them. it is not politically incorrect to insult them.

Not just a lot, but lately a very powerful lot, at least among Christians of a certain bent. People mock things, other people and even ideas that have a lot of power. Ridicule makes the target seem less serious and therefore less dangerous. And that is the difference.

 

[Squishified]

Whoooo boy Jeana don't get me started on the political correctness crap. I can practically pinpoint when all of it started, and it was during the whole fiasco between Anita Hill and Clarence Thomas.

Addressing the whole sexual harrassment issue was very important, but with it was ushered in a bunch of other crap that we talk about here on a daily basis. I guess you have to take the good with the bad.

It seems today that American's are so thin-skinned when it comes to speaking our minds. It's hard not to find a person or group that is offended by something someone says, and it just goes to show what a bunch of children we've become.

I think people should stop and think about whether they really are offended or not. Are they offended because their feelings truly were hurt, or are they offended because they are expected to be hurt?

Take the whole Imus thing for example. I'm pretty sure if someone didn't point out what he said to those Rutger's girls that they probably would have gone on living their lives just fine, but the media made such a big deal out of it the girls were probably just like "hey, maybe my feelings ARE hurt." I can't believe they could honestly care what an old fart like Imus would say about them, especially since I bet a million dollars that not a single one of them have ever listened to his show, let alone heard about him.

So the same goes for Kathy Griffin in my eyes. At the end of the day are you going to let some wiry red-head with a skewed sense of humor get the best of you? It's your power as a consumer to boycott her or change the channel or station if you don't like what she has to say.

Good post, Paladin!

 

[sherri79]

She wasn't insulting Jesus or even addressing Him. I don't know all of Griffin's specific beliefs, but I promise you she agrees with me that Jesus has better things to do than interfere in awards shows. She was making fun of people who are so narcissistic they think Jesus takes a personal interest in their winning a gold-plated statue.

Frankly, I find the notion that God plays favorites in sports and competitions rather offensive. I think it's a diminished and undignified view of our Creator. But I don't expect people to stop thanking God for their People's Choice Awards, just because I find petty the concept of His involvement there.

Turning the question back on me doesn't answer it. Why is anyone required to act reverently before anyone else's magical beliefs? If we have to revere Jesus, why not the Easter Bunny? You and I don't think they are the same, but some people do. What about respecting those people's beliefs?

The "required" reverence never ends, you see, unless we all sit alone in our rooms with our heads forever bowed out of respect for every thing everyone imagines.

the respect i ask for and i show to others does not require people to sit around with heads bowed for life. i try not to say things that are offensive to other people. i do not ask that she not mention Jesus in her speech. when she said god had nothing to do with her award i was not impressed nor offended. suck it Jesus is another story. you know we disagree on some religious issues but i spoke to you with respect despite the fact we dont agree. you did not insult me just because my beliefs are different from yours. we spoke and showed each other respect for our beliefs. it is not written anywhere because it is not a law. it is common decency.

 

[sherri79]

Not just a lot, but lately a very powerful lot, at least among Christians of a certain bent. People mock things, other people and even ideas that have a lot of power. Ridicule makes the target seem less serious and therefore less dangerous. And that is the difference.

i can change the word christian in your post to ten other things off the top of my head but they would be politically incorrect. a excuse for bad behavior wont make it good behavior.

 

[Paladin]

the respect oi ask for and i show to others does not require people to sit around with heads bowed for life. i try not to say things that are offensive to other people. i do not ask that she not mention Jess in her speech. when she said god had nothing to do with her award i was not impressed nor offended. suck it Jesus is another story. you know we disagree on some religious issues but i spoke to you with respect despite the fact we dont agree. you did not insult me just because my beliefs are different from yours. we spoke and showed each other respect for our beliefs. it is not written anywhere because it is not a law. it is common decency.

True, but you're not a comedian trying to be witty or edgy. She is. Perhaps if everyone were as respectful as you this would be a much happier planet. So I salute you for that, but it's not realistic to expect that behavior out of the other 4 billion + on this planet.

 

[Nova]

Whoooo boy Jeana don't get me started on the political correctness crap. I can practically pinpoint when all of it started, and it was during the whole fiasco between Anita Hill and Clarence Thomas.

Addressing the whole sexual harrassment issue was very important, but with it was ushered in a bunch of other crap that we talk about here on a daily basis. I guess you have to take the good with the bad.

It seems today that American's are so thin-skinned when it comes to speaking our minds. It's hard not to find a person or group that is offended by something someone says, and it just goes to show what a bunch of children we've become.

I think people should stop and think about whether they really are offended or not. Are they offended because their feelings truly were hurt, or are they offended because they are expected to be hurt?

Take the whole Imus thing for example. I'm pretty sure if someone didn't point out what he said to those Rutger's girls that they probably would have gone on living their lives just fine, but the media made such a big deal out of it the girls were probably just like "hey, maybe my feelings ARE hurt." I can't believe they could honestly care what an old fart like Imus would say about them, especially since I bet a million dollars that not a single one of them have ever listened to his show, let alone heard about him.

So the same goes for Kathy Griffin in my eyes. At the end of the day are you going to let some wiry red-head with a skewed sense of humor get the best of you? It's your power as a consumer to boycott her or change the channel or station if you don't like what she has to say.

Paladin, I don't think any teenage girl would appreciate being called a "nappy headed ho" on national radio, but on the whole, I agree with you.

What started as a reasonable attempt to the change the climate of public thought and speech in which blacks were regularly portrayed as lazy and criminal, gays were regularly portrayed as insane murderers, women were regularly portrayed as stupid, etc., because that climate let to dangerous actions, from lynchings to rapes.

But Americans being who we are, too often it's a matter of merely picking at a word choice. And the original, noble intention is lost.

 

[Nova]

i can change the word christian in your post to ten other things off the top of my head but they would be politically incorrect. a excuse for bad behavior wont make it good behavior.

Yes, but some of them wouldn't be the same. There is still a difference between mocking the powerFUL and mocking the powerLESS.

That doesn't mean YOU should change. God forbid!

I'm just saying not everyone is as gracious as you are.

 

[sherri79]

True, but you're not a comedian trying to be witty or edgy. She is. Perhaps if everyone were as respectful as you this would be a much happier planet. So I salute you for that, but it's not realistic to expect that behavior out of the other 4 billion + on this planet.

there will always be people who do the wrong thing. evil people, bad people, lazy people, rude people. the fact that people do the wrong thing to different degrees and all ways will does not mean people should not speak out when they see it. when you see a person do something wrong and you dont speak up you condone what they have said. i have lived that in my own life. i have kicked my own father out of my house for using the n word. had i done nothing my kids would have thought it was ok. that would have been my fault because by allowing it i might as well have said it was fine to use the word. i have no power on kathy but i can vent here and express why i feel it was so wrong.