FL- 12 Story Condo Partial Building Collapse, many still unaccounted for, Miami, 24 June 2021

[JaimeInLA]

Couple dead in Florida condo collapse found in bed together: son

did I read this correctly that the son lives in the twin building to this one, Champlain towers east!? yikes!!

 

[PayrollNerd]

I hope my google link comes out right. I just googled Surfside and the condo. It has water on two sides almost. Behind it, even if there's buildings, there's water close by too. From the east & west side of it, it's floating practically in water on a sand bridge with buildup. Scary. I really want to know if water was also seeping in from the ocean under the building along with the pool problem.

Google Maps

Your map opens to Daytona Beach, FL. This condo is on a barrier island off Miami.

Surfside, Florida, condo collapse: Death toll rises to 12 as search and rescue teams hold onto hope of finding people - CNN

ETA: photo

 

[al66pine]

.... Surfside and the condo. It has water on two sides almost. Behind it, even if there's buildings, there's water close by too. From the east & west side of it, it's floating practically in water on a sand bridge with buildup....Google Maps

@Dontknow? bbm sbm
Editting: Your red circle marking the bldg, is it correct location for the towers???

I'm interpreting it differently, seeing water, the Atlantic Ocean, only to east side of bldg/complex, that is, w a narrow green belt and sand strip separating bldg from ocean. No water on any other. I looked at "layers" on the Google map, but could be missing something.

@PayrollNerd Link showed "Surfside" on a map inset. Looked to me like right location, but I could be wrong.

 

[anneg]

Your map opens to Daytona Beach, FL. This condo is on a barrier island off Miami.

Surfside, Florida, condo collapse: Death toll rises to 12 as search and rescue teams hold onto hope of finding people - CNN

Yes, it's kind of odd, but if you zoom in on the map, it shows the building.

 

[GatorFL]

Who are you asking? If me....always owned single family, never owned a condo, thus I am condo-illiterate and it shows. However, I have acquaintances that own condos. They grumble, but stay put.

I was asking Dixie since she was describing some HOA issues. I was curious.

 

[amymarie]

I hope my google link comes out right. I just googled Surfside and the condo. It has water on two sides almost. Behind it, even if there's buildings, there's water close by too. From the east & west side of it, it's floating practically in water on a sand bridge with buildup. Scary. I really want to know if water was also seeping in from the ocean under the building along with the pool problem.

Google Maps

I don’t see what you’re seeing but I’ve also wondered if water was seeping up through the foundation due to the sinking issue combined with the cracking issues.

 

[GatorFL]

IMO, developers have been making bank on the Florida coast over these past 40 years.

All the while, IMO, condo owners have been footing the bill for repairs for shoddy construction.

I lived in Tampa way back in the late 70's. I remember the beautiful beaches and coastlines. It was a paradise.

When I went back to visit years later, I didn't didn't recognize the landscape.

Paradise Lost, IMO.

I can only imagine what happened to the East Coast of Florida.

Did over-development and lack of oversight play a role in this horrific tragedy?

BBM: Over-development is pretty much everywhere that is waterfront. Doesn't matter if it is the Atlantic or Gulf or a major river. Statewide issue. Lack of oversight is more regional. I'd rather have a house here in Palm Beach than Miami Dade, no matter when it was constructed. That said, the plumbing oversights here in PB make me believe the inspectors were either blind, didn't care, or paid off.

 

[anneg]

@Dontknow? bbm sbm Yes, your Google map shows the right bldg, imo. But I'm interpreting it differently, seeing water, the Atlantic Ocean, only to east side of bldg/complex, that is, w a narrow green belt and sand strip separating bldg from ocean. No water on any other. I looked at "layers" on the Google map, but could be missing something.

The building is on a barrier island between the ocean on the east and Biscayne Bay on the west (as is Miami Beach). It's 4 blocks from Biscayne Bay according to an article I read.

 

[GatorFL]

I hope my google link comes out right. I just googled Surfside and the condo. It has water on two sides almost. Behind it, even if there's buildings, there's water close by too. From the east & west side of it, it's floating practically in water on a sand bridge with buildup. Scary. I really want to know if water was also seeping in from the ocean under the building along with the pool problem.

Google Maps

There are many barrier islands all over FL just like that. Ocean on one side, river on the other. They evacuate these islands when a hurricane is imminent. Not because of wind, but because the islands can flood so completely the people might not be able to leave the building for a long time.

 

[al66pine]

The building is on a barrier island between the ocean on the east and Biscayne Bay on the west (as is Miami Beach). It's 4 blocks from Biscayne Bay according to an article I read.

@anneg Is your post saying that the red circle on map linked by @Dontknow? was in marked in wrong spot for the tower location? Or something else?

Seems from map, like you said, there are 4 blocks of land separating the tower location from water (Biscayne Bay) to the west of it. Okay by me if ppl say tower has water on west side too. A matter of semantics?

 

[GatorFL]

Your map opens to Daytona Beach, FL. This condo is on a barrier island off Miami.

Surfside, Florida, condo collapse: Death toll rises to 12 as search and rescue teams hold onto hope of finding people - CNN

ETA: photo

The map opens to the proper place. IDK why it says Daytona. That island is not one of Daytona's for sure.

 

[anneg]

@anneg Is your post saying that the red circle on map linked by @Dontknow? was in marked in wrong spot for the tower location? Or something else?

Seems from map, like you said, there are 4 blocks of land separating the tower location from water to the west of it. Okay by me if ppl say tower has water on west side too. A matter of semantics?

No, it's marked in the right spot. We might just be talking around each other!

 

[Dontknow?]

There are many barrier islands all over FL just like that. Ocean on one side, river on the other. They evacuate these islands when a hurricane is imminent. Not because of wind, but because the islands can flood so completely the people might not be able to leave the building for a long time.

That's true from what I remember living in FL For some reason I thought the maintenance man from 1995 to 2000 said not only would the garage flood from storms but would come up from the floor. Well, never mind, that would be the pool leaking into it.

Stayed in plenty of beach motels over the years before living there 30 years ago. They had problems, almost crumbling back then but now many are gone thank goodness. Daytona mostly was closer to us.

 

[amymarie]

Someone asked about insurance. The condominium association should have a policy to cover the outside walls, common areas, and liability (typically starts at $1 million in coverage). Each unit owner will have coverage for the inside walls and liability (typically starts at $100,000). Renters should have their own policy to cover their belongings and also have liability coverage (starting at $100,000; this may or may not be required).

The condo policy should pay out, but the insurance company could try to fight it based on the lack of maintenance upkeep. If they only have $1M, that won’t go far between all the families. I’ve seen $5M being thrown around so that’s probably the policy limit. They pretty much have to sue to try to touch the insurance money, so I don’t think it’s premature for them to be filing lawsuits already.

Since the HOA members are also being named in the lawsuit, there could be more money to be had from their policies, especially if they have an umbrella policy, which usually starts at $1m.


This is an insurance company’s worst nightmare. I’m not sure which ones will pay and which ones won’t.

 

[cujenn81]

I just do NOT understand this. Most HOA/POA where I live require 15 year studies out to plan for reserves. How did they not increase each year to the max allowed to increase such as it was PIDDLY monies.

Do they do such so that folks buy into them, as they only have to disclose the yearly payments (which include reserves?..but they aren't funding such during those 15 years?)

Agreed! I like to groan and complain about the cost of our monthly HOA fee (which is astronomically high for the very little upkeep required to maintain our 30-unit complex) but… I must admit our cushy reserve goes a long way towards a healthy peace of mind when you live a block from the ocean in an area frequently battered by hurricanes.

 

[cujenn81]

Someone asked about insurance. The condominium association should have a policy to cover the outside walls, common areas, and liability (typically starts at $1 million in coverage). Each unit owner will have coverage for the inside walls and liability (typically starts at $100,000). Renters should have their own policy to cover their belongings and also have liability coverage (starting at $100,000; this may or may not be required).

The condo policy should pay out, but the insurance company could try to fight it based on the lack of maintenance upkeep. If they only have $1M, that won’t go far between all the families. I’ve seen $5M being thrown around so that’s probably the policy limit. They pretty much have to sue to try to touch the insurance money, so I don’t think it’s premature for them to be filing lawsuits already.

Since the HOA members are also being named in the lawsuit, there could be more money to be had from their policies, especially if they have an umbrella policy, which usually starts at $1m.


This is an insurance company’s worst nightmare. I’m not sure which ones will pay and which ones won’t.

This is exactly how mine works — the HOA fee covers insurance on the exterior areas of our building and my personal homeowners insurance policy covers everything inside the unit.

 

[MimosaMornings]

What about flood insurance? The COA is responsible for that policy?

 

[JaimeInLA]

Agreed! I like to groan and complain about the cost of our monthly HOA fee (which is astronomically high for the very little upkeep required to maintain our 30-unit complex) but… I must admit our cushy reserve goes a long way towards a healthy peace of mind when you live a block from the ocean in an area frequently battered by hurricanes.

The HOA fee for this building was $851 a month. And that was BEFORE the special assessment! The special assessment to cover the $15 million in necessary repairs was going to add $948 a month FOR 15 YEARS!

Source: a survivor is being interviewed on CNN and just gave Don Lemon those numbers.

 

[MoeInVA]

Someone asked about insurance. The condominium association should have a policy to cover the outside walls, common areas, and liability (typically starts at $1 million in coverage). Each unit owner will have coverage for the inside walls and liability (typically starts at $100,000). Renters should have their own policy to cover their belongings and also have liability coverage (starting at $100,000; this may or may not be required).

The condo policy should pay out, but the insurance company could try to fight it based on the lack of maintenance upkeep. If they only have $1M, that won’t go far between all the families. I’ve seen $5M being thrown around so that’s probably the policy limit. They pretty much have to sue to try to touch the insurance money, so I don’t think it’s premature for them to be filing lawsuits already.

Since the HOA members are also being named in the lawsuit, there could be more money to be had from their policies, especially if they have an umbrella policy, which usually starts at $1m.


This is an insurance company’s worst nightmare. I’m not sure which ones will pay and which ones won’t.

I just hope this leads to way more regulations to protect people. It is so easy for insurers to write policies in a way that they will never have to pay. Instead of leaving it up to every volunteer condo board to hire lawyers to analyze the policies (to mixed effect), there should be a prescribed minimum policy with language requirements from city, county or state. Pass the city review or you don’t get to operate in that city.

 

[LadyL]

She lost her father to Covid-19 and didn't get to say goodbye. Now her mother is unaccounted for in the Surfside building collapse - CNN