FL - 17-yo Teen Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #3

[Horace Finklestein]

But the kid was runing away and he was not in danger.
shooting was not the right call no matter what.

What are you basing that on? Witnesses said they were fighting, and GZ had injuries to his nose and the back of his head. How do we know he was running away?

 

[Adrienne37]

Let me repost this link that I posted earlier this morning which should clear up quite a few statements about what was Zimmerman's duties, etc. This comes directly from the police department's neighborhood watch liaison and her interactions with Zimmerman as part of the program.

1. In every presentation, “I go through what the rules and responsibilities are,” she said Thursday. The volunteers’ role, she said, is “being the eyes and ears” for the police, “not the vigilante.” Members of a neighborhood watch “are not supposed to confront anyone,” she said. “We get paid to get into harm’s way. You don’t do that. You just call them from the safety of your home or your vehicle.”
Using a gun in the neighborhood watch role would be out of the question, she said in an interview.

2. In Sanford, she said, watch groups are not even supposed to make the rounds. That is the job of another kind of volunteer organization, Citizens on Patrol, whose members are selected and trained by the police and who drive the streets in a specially marked vehicle. Members of that group, Ms. Dorival said, “are armed only with a radio.”

3. The manual warns that watch members should “not attempt to apprehend a person committing a crime or to investigate a suspicious activity.” It should be emphasized to members of patrols, the materials state, that “they do not possess police power and they shall not carry weapons.” The consequences of not following the guidelines are severe, the manual states: “Each member is liable as an individual for civil and criminal charges should he exceed his authority.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46830953/ns/us_news-the_new_york_times/#.T2z67RH2b2Y

 

[LolaMoon08]

Start here Song - http://www.sanfordfl.gov/frames/home_frames.html

The girlfriend gave her statement 3 weeks after the fact - ABC got an exclusive with the girl and the family attorney. Trayvon was dead two days before being identified. The girlfriend describes talking on the phone with Trayvon and his being scared - being followed by someone, being hit....the phone somehow disconnecting (she never says she heard a shot), and then she apparently goes on with her life without ever calling the police about what she'd heard.

Like I said, maybe her parents didn't want her to get involved? Just look how she is being villified already? How do you know she went on with her life? She was probably devastated, scared, shocked, etc...

You know what... I'm going to take the advice of ynot and walk away for a while.

 

[annalia]

Let's not forget, that before the release of the 911 calls, Police Chief Bill Lee was very vocal and made sure every opportunity was to paint Trayvon in a bad light. We have witness, who was questioned at the scene that night, that claims she told LE officers that it was Trayvon screaming only to be corrected by LE that it was Zimmerman screaming. Since when do LE officers correct a witnesses statement? This same witness claims that she had tried to contact LE numerous times only for LE to come back and say this witness didn't want to get involved... yet she gave a statement to police that night?

Another thing, this young girl on the phone with Tray that night may not have known Trayvon's mother and father to get into contact with them? Maybe she had tried to call LE? Maybe her parents didn't want her to get involved? Like I said, we didn't get to hear the 911 calls until 3 weeks after Tray was killed... that does not mean that the 911 calls didn't exist 3 weeks ago. I don't find it strange for the family to have not announced this girl out of respect for her and her family until they were able to hear for themselves the 911 calls in order to put together what exactly happened that night.

With as little investigating that appears to have been done in this case, I can see LE in Sanford ignoring a witness. They'd done it before? They'd even done it when a young man had a video of a crime and they didn't care to arrest the boy who commited the crime.

SPD has done it before. And I believe that wasn't the only time but I can't recall the other or others.

Lee had been brought in to try to clean up the corruption. And what a coincidence that the same officer in the other coverup case was on the scene when Tray was murdered. I hope we find out the name of the officer who tried to change the witness statements.

JMHO

 

[flourish]

1) George Zimmerman was not doing a job. If there is a link or supporting evidence that he indeed was employed as a neighborhood patrol, I haven't seen it and would appreciate a link.

2) I'm confused about the complaining about Al Sharpton. This is a sincere inquiry. I don't know much about him except that we watch a lot of msnbc at home and he's on there.

 

[jjenny]

BBM

1. Everything I've read says that neighborhood watch volunteers are NOT supposed to follow people they think are suspicious.

2. Per the police chief, Zimmerman wasn't on patrol that night. Lee:

"He was in fact on a personal errand in his vehicle when he observed Mr. Martin in the community and called the Sanford Police Department."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/22/justice/florida-teen-zimmerman/?hpt=us_c2

He was not supposed to follow any "suspicious" persons but it was not illegal for him to do so.

 

[songline]

We are planning vacation for later this summer and have rented a very nice house in a gated community in Florida. We will have 8 of our children with us and as many of you know, our children are all African American. Honestly, I'm scared and seriously considering cancelling a wonderful family vacation because of what happened to Trayvon. It could just as easily be one of my kiddo's.

My family is mixed too
Everything will be fine if you do not bring the hoodlies...
Maybe you can have their hair braided not a wide afro.
And one more thing...Their pants must come up to the waist,
and not showing their under pants.
All of these things will save your family.

 

[jjenny]

1) George Zimmerman was not doing a job. If there is a link or supporting evidence that he indeed was employed as a neighborhood patrol, I haven't seen it and would appreciate a link.

2) I'm confused about the complaining about Al Sharpton. This is a sincere inquiry. I don't know much about him except that we watch a lot of msnbc at home and he's on there.

There is no "employment" involved and no one claimed there was. I believe its all volunteer efforts.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

I don't think he's black and that's the important aspect, not what GZ was but what Treyvon was. Black, Treyvon committed the fatal error of walking around while black in a place seemingly terrorized by this self appointed neighborhood watch vigilante. GZ saw BLACK and called 911. GZ's race is not important here except that the police treated him better than they likely would have if he was black too. They believed his unsupported story because it was only a black boy lying dead. Apparently this town has a history of racial problems and it's fairly easy to see why. So, whatever GZ was it's only really important what he wasn't, Black.

Oh, for the record Hispanic is not a race, at least according to the sources I'm aware of including the US Census. Many people of Hispanic ethnicity consider themselves white. Zimmerman is not an Hispanic name that I'm aware of but I believe one of his parents is Peruvian. Again, whatever he is, it ain't black and that was the relevant racial component here.

I noticed that you keep spelling the victims name wrong. Its Trayvon.

 

[Adrienne37]

OMG
first Al Sharpton and now Farrakhn.

IMHO - this will be a fiasco - this case can no longer be civil or JUST.

LE Messed up they needed to arrest GZ - and free him on bail.
this is a mess now.

EARLY ON I said that this family seems to have class - I do not imagine their son went out and upset GA.
NOW - I am wondering about that, it is not about race. I hate it when they pull that race card.

STILL I SAY Zimmerman should have been locked up and Ty deserves Justice.

At this point, I believe Trayvon's family will do any and everything they can to ensure justice on behalf of Trayvon and I say MORE POWER TO THEM. I will continue to support whatever means are necessary to ensure that this monster, Zimmerman, is locked behind bars where he cannot take the law into his hands anymore. Maybe he'll be dealt a swift blow of justice after he's locked up.

 

[lonetraveler]

So now GZ is white?

Just dropped into this thread but I've been following the news reports on this case since beginning. Anyway I also thought that GZ was Latino. But, I also think that he was a vigilante wannabe and stalked the teen. IMO if GZ was injured then maybe it was due to the teen fighting for his life. Why the heck didn't he back off and stop following him after the dispatch told him to? Intent is the word I think about right now.

 

[vlpate]

This was a patrol officer on duty when the call came in. According to him all he did was secure the gun and zimmerman, watch them do cpr on the victim and hear Zimmerman say that about calling for help. Then he went back on duty and filled out this report when he got off duty at the end of the shift at 3:29.

Another odd thing is the other on patrol duty officer filled his report out his report an hour earlier.

How did this guy know it was being investigated as a stand your ground case?

I would assume it's a law he's familiar with and having conversations with the other officers. There's nothing strange to me about the timing of the reports - some fill them out manually, some on the computers in their cars, don't know much about that.

 

[songline]

What are you basing that on? Witnesses said they were fighting, and GZ had injuries to his nose and the back of his head. How do we know he was running away?

Early on in this discussion - I will try to find it.
He was on the phone with his GF and she told him to run and he did.

Frankly I am not so sure now... what is real since Sharpton came on...

 

[lonetraveler]

JMO but it appears that Zimmerman was playing "Barney Fife" and decided to use his one bullet. He had absolutely no business following and confronting this boy. He called 911, he should have just left it in LE's hands and backed off. Instead, he presented himself as a threat and confronted a teen walking home.

 

[songline]

At this point, I believe Trayvon's family will do any and everything they can to ensure justice on behalf of Trayvon and I say MORE POWER TO THEM. I will continue to support whatever means are necessary to ensure that this monster, Zimmerman, is locked behind bars where he cannot take the law into his hands anymore. Maybe he'll be dealt a swift blow of justice after he's locked up.

BBM - I would too...
But Sharpton IMHO is not about justice. he is about race.
If it is justice they want... this is not convincing me.

 

[flourish]

There is no "employment" involved and no one claimed there was. I believe its all volunteer efforts.

I was responding to a post where someone stated GZ was just doing his job.

 

[QueenD]

I haven't posted anything on this thread, sorta waiting out till the FBI reports are complete. One thing I do want to say is the President needs to stay out if it. Moo
This is a bad situation and could turn to a RK situation and I really hope not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ynotdivein]

Just Googled this up. Nothing particularly new, but interesting listening.

Suspect Silent as Slain Teen's Family Cries for Justice (NPR, 3/23/12)

"People across the country have had something to say about the death of Trayvon Martin, but the man at the center of the case — George Zimmerman — remains silent.

The neighborhood watch volunteer told police he was acting in self-defense when he shot Trayvon last month. Zimmerman has yet to be charged with a crime &#8212; or to speak publicly about what happened, leaving others to speak for him. <snip>"

 

[vlpate]

Like I said, maybe her parents didn't want her to get involved? Just look how she is being villified already? How do you know she went on with her life? She was probably devastated, scared, shocked, etc...

You know what... I'm going to take the advice of ynot and walk away for a while.

Why would her parents not want her to go to the police station and make a statement? Why would they rather ABC do it? To my knowledge, her name has not been released. No one is vilifying her, but it's hard for any reasonable person to believe she felt fear for her boyfriend, didn't hear back from him, and didn't call the police to report he was, or even had been, in danger. Maybe she did, but the new investigation seems to find this a new development, from what I understand.

My comment that she went on with her life was in reference to the days before she found out he had been killed and didn't call the police, just to be clear. I've not cast aspersions on her one way or the other - I find the fact that an attorney is breaking the story on ABC highly suspect.

 

[vlpate]

He's probably scared - it wouldn't matter what he said at this point, obviously, so what would be the point. Now he's likely been told the case is being investigated again and has an attorney, or one would think. JMO

Just Googled this up. Nothing particularly new, but interesting listening.

Suspect Silent as Slain Teen's Family Cries for Justice (NPR, 3/23/12)

"People across the country have had something to say about the death of Trayvon Martin, but the man at the center of the case — George Zimmerman — remains silent.

The neighborhood watch volunteer told police he was acting in self-defense when he shot Trayvon last month. Zimmerman has yet to be charged with a crime — or to speak publicly about what happened, leaving others to speak for him. <snip>"